Wrestling needs more Japs throwing salt in the eyes too right? Wrestling has moved on a lot from its carny ways, but a fair amount of that shit still goes on.

 

Low blows are not considered PG by Vince, exposing the turnbuckle is done on occasion. And the money in the bank case has routinely been used as a weapon, as well as belts.

 

Low blows are not considered PG by Vince,

Makes you wonder why there have been plenty in the PG era then doesn't it.

Yet more shatting of sh&^ by people.

 

It still exists, just not in WWE.

 

I think you got a strong point. Could really work well IMO.

 

This is one of the things about modern day wrestling that pisses me off, and a small reason out of many why nobody gets over today. Heels are so clean today, I don't understand how or why this philosophy came into effect. I don't think I've ever seen Cesaro cheat. He's just one example I can think of, but what the fuck is the point of booing him when he just beats the babyface clean all the time? I don't object against clean wins against an established opponent once in a while to remind people that you're actually a serious threat, granted, but holy shit, CHEAT. Nowadays the biggest heel tactic seems to be walking out of the match and letting yourself get counted out, which is a TERRIBLE heel tactic. You want your heels to win underhandedly, not have them bail on the match, that gets nobody over and it wastes the crowds time, being an anti-climactic finish. Not to mention, it's made even worse by the fact that most of the time, the faces don't even try to bring them back, they just accept it. Orton usually throws them back in, but other than that it seems like they all just stand there and do jack shit.

I can't really think of anybody besides Sandow right now, who's constantly going for the tights in his pins, who uses any form of cheating, it's just win or lose. Ziggler's started to do it a little now that he has Big E and AJ, which as much as I hate him is good, because we got to get back to heels being heels, but he's another example. For YEARS he would just go in there with nothing to back himself up, and lose. It's ridiculous.

 

This is one of the things about modern day wrestling that pisses me off, and a small reason out of many why nobody gets over today. Heels are so clean today, I don't understand how or why this philosophy came into effect. I don't think I've ever seen Cesaro cheat. He's just one example I can think of, but what the fuck is the point of booing him when he just beats the babyface clean all the time?

Because you don't like him.

If I don't like someone, I don't particularly care how they won, it's the fact that they won PERIOD. I don't want to see them win at all.

 

Heels don't cheat as much. I suppose the reasoning is that in the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s it was not nearly as exposed. There weren't people who were or considered themselves to be "smart to the business." It was much more like a sporting event. Cheating in sporting events has been reviled for as long sports exist so it worked to get heat on a heel if he "cheated" during the match.

Now almost everybody knows it is a work so the cheating is not nearly to the extent to where it used to be when top heels were often the most innovative, ingenious and successful cheaters. THE DIRTIEST PLAYER IN THE GAME! WHOO! :flair

I think it is a mistake. Letting heels cheat more and get wins by cheating would still get heat and make it so that the heels don't look like these total chumps who lose 70 percent of their matches, regardless of their experience and in-ring talent. 'Sup Ziggles.

Edit: Motherfucker, beaten to the punch by about half a minute. I got Pyro'd.

:lelbron

 

Punk still cheats through interference that he denies involvement with. I think its pretty normal for mid card heels to beat mid card faces; its clean losses to a main event face that can ruin the product, since those are the heroes we watch for. Also, Del Rio was cheating when he was challenging Sheamus for the belt, and Sheamus cheated twice against Del Rio: using a shoe Ricardo threw in for Del Rio, and taking one of Del Rio's feet off the ropes during a successful pinfall that shouldn't have counted. I like that they seem to be coming up with new scenarios (I haven't seen them before).

 

The face counter-cheating to be cool is not new at all, it's 13 years old. The oldest I can remember is Boss Man throwing a nightstick to Shamrock, and Rock intercepting it.

 

It's really just a tv show these days, I think the most fun is probably had at live events when things aren't necessarily "for the cameras".


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I think heel tactics became less prominent when heels stopped being sadistic assholes and far more vain and narcassistic. I don't think Vince consciously decided to get rid of them, rather they just fell into disuse when Vince decided that heels would be presented as jokes unless they were superheavyweights. Can you imagine most of the heels today wanting to cheat for its own sake and not just because they have to?

 

surely it wouldnt be that hard for vince to see that a gimmick where someone such as a ted dibiase, michael mcgillicutty those young guys who have been around for a while have the talent but havent used it yet turns heel and does anything and everything to win the gold eventually even by chucking them with a manager who assist them at ringside in order to get the win. managers are now pointless and just there to get the crowd behind the individual in the main. It is a slow build but slower builds allow the individuals to get over more and seem more legitimate than they would if they rush them for three months do a short program and then drop them back down

 

Best post in this thread.

We need more Legit sneaky managers, theres no real Paul Bearer, Jimmy Hart, Bobby Heenan type characters in WWE these days.