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Well yeah work rate doesn’t draw. Guys like Adam Cole we’ll never draw. Guys like Rock and Cena do. Maybe unpopular opinion, but I think Wwe has improved dramatically recently. Still not great, but headed in the right direction.
 

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The bigger AEW gets and the bigger NJPW gets will make it hard for the WWE to sign the top indy Talent. They will be forced to make their own stars.

Looking at the current Top Talent in WWE, you see lots of NJPW/TNA/ROH guys... Things will be interesting 10 years from now.
!0 years from now, the WWE and NJPW will still exist. The other 3 won't
m

10 years from now:

WWE: Still number one but in a subdued state, with a 50/50 chance of being a Disney holding

NJPW: Clawed back to where they were in the NA market in 2018. Outside shot of being purchased and rebranded NXT Japan

AEW: Cancelled by TNT in early 2021 following injuries to Jericho and PAC, and Moxley utilizing his one year out clause in 2020. Shut down by the Khans at the end of 2021.

ROH: Bought by Anthem

MLW: Shut Down

NWA: Shut Down, property bought by WWE once and for all

Impact: Defacto Number Two
 

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alexa = greatest of all time!
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one thing i've learned with wwe is that it can always get worse...
 

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C’mon... Who isn’t looking forward to the all powerful “Mr. Helmsley” gimmick?

WWE will never have another Rock or Cena, and will bury those with that special potential, they’ll just be in Hollywood after a few years if they don’t.
 

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First off, Vince is one of the worst creative minds ever in wrestling. And I mean EVER.

Second, no one really knows 1) if Hunter will really have any autonomy once Vince is gone. Remember, Steph & Shane are very much in the mix, and 2) everything Hunter does now is within the framework of how Vince operates and isn’t necessarily how he would operate if given free reign.
 

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m

10 years from now:

WWE: Still number one but in a subdued state, with a 50/50 chance of being a Disney holding

NJPW: Clawed back to where they were in the NA market in 2018. Outside shot of being purchased and rebranded NXT Japan

AEW: Cancelled by TNT in early 2021 following injuries to Jericho and PAC, and Moxley utilizing his one year out clause in 2020. Shut down by the Khans at the end of 2021.

ROH: Bought by Anthem

MLW: Shut Down

NWA: Shut Down, property bought by WWE once and for all

Impact: Defacto Number Two
Is this your wet dream or something ?
 

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Wheel Man for SCOTT STEINER
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First off, Vince is one of the worst creative minds ever in wrestling. And I mean EVER.

Second, no one really knows 1) if Hunter will really have any autonomy once Vince is gone. Remember, Steph & Shane are very much in the mix, and 2) everything Hunter does now is within the framework of how Vince operates and isn’t necessarily how he would operate if given free reign.
If Levesque the executive had creativity, we'd have seen it by now during the scrambles for power. NXT appeals to people not because it's creative but it's just simple. What people have seen in late stage 205 Live, NXT UK and NXT itself is how he's going to do things. His 'big ideas' on RAW & SD when Vince weren't at shows were antiquated gimmicks like gauntlet matches & pointless exhibitions between two workrate wrestlers that haven't wrestled before. The guy doesn't have the chops for what people hope is enough to bring back "the glory days", he's fine for what he does in NXT. Although whether he deserves the budget he's been given (where expenses probably usurp revenue by 20:1) is another question.
 

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It'll just be NXT. It will be a good pro wrestling show, but it guarantees we're never the glory days back and ratings will continue to plunge.

Unpopular opinion on this forum, but workrate doesn't draw.
I’m not even sure it’s unpopular, but it’s certainly true. If more people in the States cared about 20 minutes of spotty kick out fests, with no selling or backstory, then NXT & AEW would be doing a lot better ratings wise. Or NJPW would have picked up more steam here.

WWE is in an awful state right now, but they do at least still try to create stories, characters, and reasons to care, even if they largely fail at doing so.

You can have the two best workers in the World go at it, but if there’s no heat or story, why do I care? Everyone loves to hate on Lesnar on this board, but go back and watch his matches, and see how invested people get when watching him. Or go way back to Hogan/Rock. Hogan could barely move at that point and that match is lauded as an all time great match.
 

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m

10 years from now:

WWE: Still number one but in a subdued state, with a 50/50 chance of being a Disney holding

NJPW: Clawed back to where they were in the NA market in 2018. Outside shot of being purchased and rebranded NXT Japan

AEW: Cancelled by TNT in early 2021 following injuries to Jericho and PAC, and Moxley utilizing his one year out clause in 2020. Shut down by the Khans at the end of 2021.

ROH: Bought by Anthem

MLW: Shut Down

NWA: Shut Down, property bought by WWE once and for all

Impact: Defacto Number Two
Is this your wet dream or something ?
No. More likely a dystopian probability.
 

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'Midget Geeks'

You mean the ones with WAY more charisma and personality than most of the main roster?

I don't know about you, but I'd be happy if we got storylines & feuds like NXT. Getting a feud that actually feels important on RAW/SD is like finding a needle in a haystack.
What exactly qualifies a show that's at least 85% (or more) in ring-wrestling to have way more (as you put it) charisma and personality?

They don't even have characters. The entire premises of shows like NXT is one wrestler comes out and challenges another wrestler to see which one of them is the better wrestler.

I am not even defending the Main Roster (with few exceptions), but you have to be delusional to believe the NXT roster has more charisma and personality than anyone, much less the Main Roster.
 

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10 years from now:


ROH: Bought by Anthem

Impact: Defacto Number Two
No way someone buys ROH. It will be done in less than 10 years. Same for Impact. Both aren't even number 2 or 3 now. There's no way either can last longer than WCW and ECW did and those two companies were around during wrestling's biggest boom period. The only reason the WWE hasn't bought them out is because neither are competition.
 

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No way someone buys ROH. It will be done in less than 10 years. Same for Impact. Both aren't even number 2 or 3 now. There's no way either can last longer than WCW and ECW did and those two companies were around during wrestling's biggest boom period. The only reason the WWE hasn't bought them out is because neither are competition.
Disagree (tentatively) on that. Both have but a fraction of the budget that WCW or even ECW had in 2000. Both are relatively low-cost content produced by and for their parent companies, Sinclair and Anthem. I'm not certain if both can survive long-term, but one certainly can.
 

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Discussion Starter #75
First off, Vince is one of the worst creative minds ever in wrestling. And I mean EVER.

Second, no one really knows 1) if Hunter will really have any autonomy once Vince is gone. Remember, Steph & Shane are very much in the mix, and 2) everything Hunter does now is within the framework of how Vince operates and isn’t necessarily how he would operate if given free reign.
If Levesque the executive had creativity, we'd have seen it by now during the scrambles for power. NXT appeals to people not because it's creative but it's just simple. What people have seen in late stage 205 Live, NXT UK and NXT itself is how he's going to do things. His 'big ideas' on RAW & SD when Vince weren't at shows were antiquated gimmicks like gauntlet matches & pointless exhibitions between two workrate wrestlers that haven't wrestled before. The guy doesn't have the chops for what people hope is enough to bring back "the glory days", he's fine for what he does in NXT. Although whether he deserves the budget he's been given (where expenses probably usurp revenue by 20:1) is another question.
You have explained it even better than I did. What Triple H does is just lazy.
People don't get that if you have the entertainment aspect it can be crappy but that kind of wrestling leaves always the door open for a new Hogan, Kane or Goldust one day but if there is no entertainment you will never get a new Mankind, Rock or Undertaker simply because it's not what they ask for on wrestling shows in the future.
It's like having a TV channel that has movies, maybe it shows crappy movies like After Earth but as long as there are movies there is always hope to watch the Godfather one day. If the TV channel stops showing movies there will never be a chance to watch Godfather.
 

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What exactly qualifies a show that's at least 85% (or more) in ring-wrestling to have way more (as you put it) charisma and personality?

They don't even have characters. The entire premises of shows like NXT is one wrestler comes out and challenges another wrestler to see which one of them is the better wrestler.

I am not even defending the Main Roster (with few exceptions), but you have to be delusional to believe the NXT roster has more charisma and personality than anyone, much less the Main Roster.
It's an interesting spot that WWE finds themselves in now. In the past, when a Dusty Rhodes, Paul Orndorff, Curt Hennig, Hawk & Animal, or even Big Bubba Rogers were to jump to the company they would either find themselves in a tweaked version of themselves, or an entirely new character. That NEVER happens when a wrestler leaves NXT, and the more that the larger audience becomes familiarized with the brand, the LESS fresh an Adam Cole or Matt Riddle will be when they "jump" to the more casual-viewed RAW or Smackdown. There's no repackaging, no tweaking (unless you call the War Raiders being redubbed the Viking Raiders), no freshening. Just taking an already well exposed commodity and putting it on a new show.
 

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'Midget Geeks'

You mean the ones with WAY more charisma and personality than most of the main roster?

I don't know about you, but I'd be happy if we got storylines & feuds like NXT. Getting a feud that actually feels important on RAW/SD is like finding a needle in a haystack.
NXT feuds are on and the same with 35 minute "fight forever" matches as the cherry on top.
 

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You have explained it even better than I did. What Triple H does is just lazy.
People don't get that if you have the entertainment aspect it can be crappy but that kind of wrestling leaves always the door open for a new Hogan, Kane or Goldust one day but if there is no entertainment you will never get a new Mankind, Rock or Undertaker simply because it's not what they ask for on wrestling shows in the future.
It's like having a TV channel that has movies, maybe it shows crappy movies like After Earth but as long as there are movies there is always hope to watch the Godfather one day. If the TV channel stops showing movies there will never be a chance to watch Godfather.
I get the sense that if Levesque were to be transported back to 1989 and build NXT then with his choice of talent, its "characters" and roster might be:

Curt Hennig, Terry Taylor, Big Freddie [Ottman], Tom Magee, Jerry Allen, James Powers, Brady Boone, Owen Hart, The Malenko Brothers, Brian Pillman, Ray Traylor, Marcus Calloway, Bob Bradley, Carlos Espada, Dustin Rhodes, and Double Trouble.

You'd never get a Mr. Perfect, Big Boss Man, or Undertaker out of that mix. You'd get great workers and memorable matches, but would they stand the test of time?
 
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