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Discussion Starter #1
So I'm pretty tired of being argued about the fact that WWE and wrestling are a dying industry. A majority of people on this forum want to say that the WWE product sucks, the stories are boring, it doesn't have the same feel as in the past and that the wrestlers are not the same quality. Yet whenever you say those are telltale signs of a dying company they want to argue and say that wrestling has always been here and always will be.

Well wrestling has been around as long as American industry has. It's roots are actually dated all the way back to just post Civil War, when professional wrestling was a real bout performed at carnivals with staged outcomes. For the rest of the 19th century wrestling was performed across the United States where professional wrestlers would challenge audience members for high stakes gambling. These bouts divided the profession into three types of people involved in the groups, the impresarios, the carnies, and the barnstormers.

The impresarios were what are modern day managers except really protecting and promoting their wrestlers. The carnies would be the entire staff behind scenes today, the guys that rig the performance and create the hook around the event. The barnstormers were travelling wrestlers that staged the outcomes.

The point I am making here is that wrestling used to be performed solely at carnivals and fairs until the 1950's with the rise of television. Where for about 30 years the profession blended television and small venue mixtures. In the 1980's the sport evolved once again with cable, pay per views and large football/basketball venues. Then again it evolved with the advancement of the internet in the late 1990's and early 2000's.

Now almost 12 years past the high point of the internet induced and computer era boom of the entertainment and more specifically wrestling industry, both industries are falling apart.

Below are the reasons that WWE (along with its continued investments in movies) is probably heading on a downward spiral that it will not emerge from.





Now I am sure that all of you will use the recent Wrestlemania buy rate as some kind of contradiction to this data or to discredit. However, the company has been losing money significantly for four years now. A large company should be expanding every year and gaining revenue in its intended industry.

The biggest tell tale sign though are how the companies total assets are declining every year while the other assets are increasing. That is a blatant sign of panic by a company, as it is moving money there. Another sign is how even with a huge increase in 2010 in the feature films line, the entire assets drops 30,000. So take the feature films assets out of that equation and the company shows a steady decline still. That should not be the case. A good business can rely solely on its bread(WWE tv) and butter(WWE live), however WWE cannot even rely on their jelly(WWE films).

On top of the financial data, WWE will officially lose guys like Undertaker, Rock, HBK, Austin and others for good in the next few years. Everyone on this forum constantly complains about what is really going on as well, no real new stars are being pushed and no one really cares for Cena, even the kids according to these declining numbers.

This is real. The WWE is the biggest company in the wrestling industry and they are on a steady decline. Sure its possible for them to turn it around but currently they are not taking the right steps. WWE absolutely needs to increase their profit of $24.83 mil because steadily it declines each year.

My argument all along though is that this will not happen because wrestling is like a circus, rodeo, amusement park and other industries that are being replaced by technology.
 

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Now I am sure that all of you will use the recent Wrestlemania buy rate as some kind of contradiction to this data or to discredit. However, the company has been losing money significantly for four years now
No they haven't. You either:

a) are a liar

b) don't understand financial statements

c) both of the above

WWE has not been losing any money in recent years. This is their net income (in thousands):

2011: 2010: 2009:
24,832 53,452 50,303

They made a NET PROFIT of nearly 25 million dollars last year. They are NOT "losing money significantly for four years now". They made less money last year, but that was largely do to charges for the under development WWE Network. They have not lost money in any recent year.
 

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Good Read OP.

WWE is struggling but they are not going out of business. There will always be a market for Wrestling in US and WWE being a monopoly can survive coz of that.

At worst, they would lose USA network which itself is quite an embarrassment if it happens.
 

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How is 25 million net profit 'losing money'? It could just mean they are spending more than they did the year before...
 

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They are in a transition period IMO, they are trying to create stars to lead the next decade. But they are doing it rather slowly. Mostly all main storyline go to John Cena, and that is on WWE themselves. For what ever reason, WWE seems to not want anybody other than John Cena to take all the spotlight. They are not ready for massive changes right now, which to me means that they are happy where they are right now or afraid to change. But if they have to change their product then they will when they have to.
 

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When you consider the thing WWE did last year, and notably, the people they brought in(like "dwayne johnson" and musical performers like pitbull and cee lo green, stuff like that would cost a good amount of money too)

They didn't make as much money in 2011 as they did in 2010 or 2009, but like people said, it probably had alot to do with spending money to do WWE network stuff. Don't forget, they also filmed tough enough in 2011, so assuming that the mansion the contestants were in was rented or something like that, they'd pay for that, along with all the food and everything else needed for them on the show.

Not saying if they didn't do this stuff, they'd have made more money than in 2010 or something, but it'd increase their overall profit by probably 5-10M.

Considering that WM28 alone made almost 100M(just from PPV buys,don't even know how much they made in ticket sales,or dvd sales starting on tuesday) don't think you should be worrying about anything
 

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To put it another way- I probably lost the same ammount in relative terms that WWE 'lost' due to inflation and taxes going up!
 

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Making "less" money somehow equates to losing money now. Video game profits continue to drop each year, so I suppose they're in danger of going under, as well.
In the investing world, making less money that the year before does equate to losing money. It doesn't make any rational sense, but that is how the market thinks. That said, WWE is in no real danger.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
No they haven't. You either:

a) are a liar

b) don't understand financial statements

c) both of the above

WWE has not been losing any money in recent years. This is their net income (in thousands):

2011: 2010: 2009:
24,832 53,452 50,303

They made a NET PROFIT of nearly 25 million dollars last year. They are NOT "losing money significantly for four years now". They made less money last year, but that was largely do to charges for the under development WWE Network. They have not lost money in any recent year.
So their net income going down 28,000 is not losing money? :lmao You are the pot calling the kettle black. LOOK AT THE ASSETS

What I am saying is they should be increasing their income to be safe and comfortable. That is a significant drop in income. Which today transfers into a failing business.

Your theory on the WWE network is BS as well. The data is right there ask anyone that has financial experience it does not look good. Especially with an industry such as wrestling, which has either dropped or stayed relatively the same for 10 years.

How is 25 million net profit 'losing money'? It could just mean they are spending more than they did the year before...
They went from 53 million to 25 million in profit. That is losing money to a tee. Plus it does not mean they are spending more the fucking data is right in from of you. They are losing their assets on top of the income going down. THAT IS BAD.

PEOPLE THAT ARE CONTRADICTING. LOOK AT THE ASSETS COMPARED TO THE NET INCOME. NET INCOME is not the only determinate in a thriving business. WWE IS DEFINITELY IN DANGER. Specifically look at CASH.
 

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fpalm

Once again, Link posts something completely wrong and his real life buddy has to be the first to chime in and ride his dick even though it's completely wrong.

This is ridiculous, not making as much money as the year before does not mean you are losing money. Learn to read financial statements.
 

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So their net income going down 28,000 is not losing money? :lmao You are the pot calling the kettle black. LOOK AT THE ASSETS
No you idiot. Losing money means you had a net loss. WWE hasn't had a net loss in any recent year. I don't believe they've had a net loss once since they went public.

Making less money than you did the year before does not mean "losing money"111!!12!!211!!1.



What I am saying is they should be increasing their income to be safe and comfortable. That is a significant drop in income. Which today transfers into a failing business.
If you'd read their financial statements (oh, what am I saying, you've already proven you can't read/understand financial statements), you'd know that the drop from 2010 to 2011 was largely do to one-time charges. Your focusing on assets is stupid. Having a lot of assets is not good for a company that for the most part is not making it's money selling physical goods, like WWE. In fact, a reduction in assets lowers their exposure to future financial risk.


Your theory on the WWE network is BS as well. The data is right there ask anyone that has financial experience it does not look good.
I have a Bachelor of Commerce, as well as multiple finance-industry professional certifications. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. You proved that when you said that making less money means losing money.


They went from 53 million to 25 million in profit. That is losing money to a tee.
No it's not you dummy. Losing money means negative profit. Making less money is not "losing money to a tee". You are an idiot.

PEOPLE THAT ARE CONTRADICTING. LOOK AT THE ASSETS COMPARED TO THE NET INCOME. NET INCOME is not the only determinate in a thriving business. WWE IS DEFINITELY IN DANGER. Specifically look at CASH.
LOL. Stop it. Just stop it. You have no idea what you're talking about. With every post you make you're making a bigger fool of yourself.
 

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This is a quote from WWE's fourth quarter/full year 2011 earnings release:

While we made significant progress toward this objective, our fourth quarter and full year results were impacted primarily by three items: significant non-cash film impairment charges stemming from the weak performance of our movie releases, strategic decisions to withhold several hours of previously licensed television content for distribution on other platforms, and initial start-up operating expenses associated with our emerging content and distribution strategy. Regarding the first item, we have taken several measures to improve the profitability of our movie business. And, regarding the other items, we believe that our ongoing investment to expand and maximize the value of our content is the most potent approach for driving our future earnings.
Since the OP lacks the capacity to understand what this means, I will explain the two bolded parts.

1. The first bolded part means they withheld television content they have already produced for future platforms. Future platforms is obviously WWE Network, and possibly some sort of online PPV platform. They intentionally sacrificed the short-term for their long-term goals.

2. The second part means they had one-time start-up costs associated with WWE Network. Once again, they spent a huge amount of money in the short term, in hopes it will pay off in the long term.
 

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Good Read OP.

WWE is struggling but they are not going out of business. There will always be a market for Wrestling in US and WWE being a monopoly can survive coz of that.

At worst, they would lose USA network which itself is quite an embarrassment if it happens.
wwe isn't a monopoly. they're like the ufc. they're the biggest company in their respective sports, and have the biggest stars, but they are far from a monopoly.
 

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Good Read OP.

WWE is struggling but they are not going out of business. There will always be a market for Wrestling in US and WWE being a monopoly can survive coz of that.

At worst, they would lose USA network which itself is quite an embarrassment if it happens.
wwe isn't a monopoly. they're like the ufc. they're the biggest companies in their respective sports, and have the biggest stars, but they are far from a monopoly.
 

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There will always be a market for wrestling so I don't see them ever going out of business. They are always going to have that core fanbase that will watch and stick with them no matter what. The reason the AE did so well was a combination of a lot of things but wrestling was 'in' back then. It was the cool thing to watch and talk about. On top of their core fanbase they were able to grab a lot of other fans and enter a massive boom period. They aren't able to do that anymore. Well actually they have been able to do it but only when a huge ass name from the past is involved. The area of their business that has taken the biggest hit in recent years is PPV. The facts are there. Numbers are dropping every year. They aren't able to convert their television audience into a paying PPV audience be that through lack of build, lack of stars, too many PPV's, the economy, whatever. The simple fact is, it isn't happening. Business is low in most of the other areas too but they aren't dying. They're comfortable. Look at all the money they are able to make without even trying lol. It's crazy.
 
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