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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
As time goes on, I've been wondering if WWE will ever give ECW the respect it garners for WCW. I understand it may not have been on the same level nationally as WCW became. Or as much of a rival. But it did have merits and tons of talent. Many of whom WWE eventually employed. You would think that Heyman also being friendly with the then WWF and even having talent exchanges would put ECW in better graces with the WWE. Additionally with Heyman being such a force still today within the company.

I imagine guys like RVD and Taz will be a HOFers at some point. But will we ever see guys like Raven, Dreamer, Sabu, Storm, Sandman, or Spike Dudley make the cut? These all being major players for ECW. And the HOF includes the likes of Rikishi, Beth Pheonix, and Koko B. Ware. Hardly top echelon talents. They even have the Rock n Roll Express, a great team, but a team that only saw a WWF ring once that I can recall.

It's strange to me how little they do with the IP compared to WCW. I get WCW was bigger but it just seems really underutilized in comparison. I'm hoping as they run out of big names we'll see these ECW talents become recognized for their contributions to the business.
 

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Well the same could be said about every single territory the WWF raided in 1984.

Heck I simply don't get why people think the ECW was so special. I mean Western States, Memphis, Mid-South and other territories were just as innovative and interesting, if not more.

Paul E learned his trade in the Southern territories and then took the trade up North. But we are supposed to think ECW was this innovative machine when the southern territories were like this for decades?

I don't care what credit ECW gets.....they are interesting but way over-rated.

Seriously every territory lost multiple stars to the WWE.....and beyond that many of the ECW "originals" were actually "originals" to other territories.

To bad no World Class, Mid South or Pacific Northwest chants ever caught on.

ECW was great I loved it, but it's legacy is bloated.
 

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Well the same could be said about every single territory the WWF raided in 1984.

Heck I simply don't get why people think the ECW was so special. I mean Western States, Memphis, Mid-South and other territories were just as innovative and interesting, if not more.

Paul E learned his trade in the Southern territories and then took the trade up North. But we are supposed to think ECW was this innovative machine when the southern territories were like this for decades?

I don't care what credit ECW gets.....they are interesting but way over-rated.

Seriously every territory lost multiple stars to the WWE.....and beyond that many of the ECW "originals" were actually "originals" to other territories.


ECW was great I loved it, but it's legacy is bloated.
I think that's just time playing it's usual games. ECW heavily influenced the wrestling style of today, while the territories you mentioned were influencial to, for lack of a better word, the past generation.

I think you're starting to see WWE recognize some of the guys from different promotions from that era Verne Gagna, The Midnight Express, Bill Watts, even Gordon Solie, just to name a few.

All that being said I think only a handful of ECW should get in, basically just Raven, Taz, Sabu, Sandman and Dreamer, so that it really means something... then again I wish a lot less WWE guys got in for the same reason lol

EDIT: I almost forgot about Heyman. He'd probably have gotten into the Hall of Fame just on his WWE credentials, but to put him in without his legacy of ECW being a heavy focal point of his induction would be a BIG diservice to Paul as I said at the top of my post, ECW has influenced modern prowrestling immeasurably.
 

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Paul E learned his trade in the Southern territories and then took the trade up North. But we are supposed to think ECW was this innovative machine when the southern territories were like this for decades?

I don't care what credit ECW gets.....they are interesting but way over-rated.

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Can you please elaborate on this...I am genuinely curious.

WWe stole a lot of stuff from ECW, not just wrestlers. It could be argued that the "Attitude Era" or Austin's "no fucks given" persona doesn't exist without ECW.

It also stole things that are lesser known. For instance, the infamous match between Rock and Mick Foley from the Royal Rumble where Rock beat the shit out of Mick with a chair was taken from ECW, handcuffed Mick getting a microphone shoved in his face and all....only in ECW it was Shane Douglas beating him instead of The Rock.
 

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Paul E was a young wrestling fan who by his own admission went to the Apter mags every week to see what was happening around the wrestling world.

He ended up going to Memphis trying to cut his teeth. Their is no doubt Memphis was the closest thing to ECW. Hayman learned from the guys who created the Tupelo Concession Stand Brawl (look it up credited as the original hardcore match), had empty arena matches years before the WWF, did the scaffold match first. They had Savage pile drive Morton through a table which shocked the wrestling world. Lawler and Jarrett were trying to fill arenas every week. They were the creative team Paul E learned from. Then Paul E went to Watt's Mid south and learned from him.

He took a very similar booking style up North but called it "Extreme". So the East coast had no clue what Southern territories were like. I mean just like everything else the Northeastern United States thinks the rest of the nation rotates around them. So when Paul E presents this new exciting weekly product the fandom was enthralled because they were used to the WWF's monthly booking. The mind numbingly slow developing feuds. Where a heel turn, specialty match or run in might happen once a year. In the south those were weekly occurrences. It caught on in the North and people chanted ECW.
 

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RVD, Dreamer, Sabu, Taz and Dudleys for sure. Raven and Sandman maybe, but Sandman should definitely go in and saying ECW was overrated :lol Stone Cold bit his whole character off ECW (Sandman's beer drinking entrance, Mikey Whipwreck's whippersnapper). Alot of the attitude era bit off ECW they were not overrated they were always in the right place during the late 90s/early 2000

1.WWF
2.WCW
3.ECW

then for a quick min

1.WCW (nWo)
2.WWF
3.ECW

then

1.WWF
2.ECW
3.WCW (jumped the shark)
 

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In a way, you could argue they respect ECW's legacy more than WCW's, simply because of the lack of revisionist history. WWE's portrayal of ECW, based on their acknowledgement in documentaries and other content, matches up with the story told by those outside of WWE's version. They've certainly upheld ECW.

The only difference is the amount of HOF inductions. Not sure why no one who made their career in ECW hasn't been inducted, especially Tommy Dreamer. There's plenty that are deserving, based on ECW alone and even a handful that would deserve it based on their WWE success, such as the Dudleys & RVD.

It's probably a matter of timing and coming to an agreement. Look how long it took to induct the Freebirds and Stan Hansen.
 

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Well the same could be said about every single territory the WWF raided in 1984.

Heck I simply don't get why people think the ECW was so special. I mean Western States, Memphis, Mid-South and other territories were just as innovative and interesting, if not more.

Paul E learned his trade in the Southern territories and then took the trade up North. But we are supposed to think ECW was this innovative machine when the southern territories were like this for decades?

I don't care what credit ECW gets.....they are interesting but way over-rated.

Seriously every territory lost multiple stars to the WWE.....and beyond that many of the ECW "originals" were actually "originals" to other territories.

To bad no World Class, Mid South or Pacific Northwest chants ever caught on.

ECW was great I loved it, but it's legacy is bloated.
So...that means nobody from ECW deserves to be in the Hall of Fame?
 

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So...that means nobody from ECW deserves to be in the Hall of Fame?
No I did not mean that....of course some do, I just got a button pushed. This is a case of me not reading the OP well enough sorry. I got triggered lol. I have lots of respect for ECW it was awesome. I just hate it when wrestling fans think ECW was this innovative thing when I watched a very similar product for years.


Dudley's should be in, RVD, maybe Rhyno down the line? Hard for me to say Dreamer I can't stand that guy. Maybe my least favorite wrestler ever.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I'm from the Northeast. Growing up here that's all we got was Northeast wrestling. I can't comment on the southern work or its influence.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
WWE actually treats ECW pretty well. A lot better than WCW.
Every WCW guy is in the HOF not named Goldberg, which is only a matter of time now. There isn't a single ECW guy in there. And what I mean by that is a guy who made their bones there. A guy that makes you think ECW right off the bat. To me it seems they don't think anyone out of there is worthy of being remembered.
 

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Paul E was a young wrestling fan who by his own admission went to the Apter mags every week to see what was happening around the wrestling world.

He ended up going to Memphis trying to cut his teeth. Their is no doubt Memphis was the closest thing to ECW. Hayman learned from the guys who created the Tupelo Concession Stand Brawl (look it up credited as the original hardcore match), had empty arena matches years before the WWF, did the scaffold match first. They had Savage pile drive Morton through a table which shocked the wrestling world. Lawler and Jarrett were trying to fill arenas every week. They were the creative team Paul E learned from. Then Paul E went to Watt's Mid south and learned from him.

He took a very similar booking style up North but called it "Extreme". So the East coast had no clue what Southern territories were like. I mean just like everything else the Northeastern United States thinks the rest of the nation rotates around them. So when Paul E presents this new exciting weekly product the fandom was enthralled because they were used to the WWF's monthly booking. The mind numbingly slow developing feuds. Where a heel turn, specialty match or run in might happen once a year. In the south those were weekly occurrences. It caught on in the North and people chanted ECW.
Heyman also hit Jim Crockett Promotions and Continental Wrestling (from Alabama).

There's also a lot of Mid-South in what ECW became. Memphis had the showmanship and the exciting stories, Mid-South had the bad-asses and the hardcore action. There was no cartoonish gimmicks like in the WWF, just solid action. Junkyard Dog, Duggan, DiBiase, Dr. Death, Freebirds, Sheepherders, Dick Slater, Jake "the Snake" Roberts, etc. If you weren't seen as someone who could "hook 'em up" in the words of Cowboy Bill Watts, you didn't make it in the Mid-South as the fans wanted you to be a badass. Before Vince made them out to be cartoonish side shows, folks like Duggan, the One Man Gang, the Sheepherders, etc...were legitimate tough guys. Even mid-card guys like the Lightning Express, Terry Taylor, "Iceman" King Parsons, etc...had important roles within the booking of the Mid-South. Heyman borrowed that when he got ECW rolling, making sure that everyone had important roles from Shane Douglas and Taz on down to the Blue Meanie and Amish Roadkill.

It was also down there where the women that were managers really started to mix it up with the guys...a moment that comes to mind for me is when Jake "The Snake" Roberts confronted then North American champ Dick Slater. When Slater's valet Dark Journey got involved, Roberts gave her a DDT. That was unheard of back then for a man to actually not only hit a woman but put her into the mat.

When I look at ECW...I can definitely see both the booking of Jerry Jarrett and Cowboy Bill Watts in action.
 

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I mean just like everything else the Northeastern United States thinks the rest of the nation rotates around them.
Hey I resent that.

Unfortunately I can't deny it.
 
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It's just a matter of time, I think. The thing with the HOF is that it's been a yearly thing for close to 15 years now. In maybe the last 4 or so years, you've had a lot stronger WCW influence on inductions because they've burnt through a lot of WWF/E names from those time periods, to the point where Sting was the headline inductee last year. Also, the Network provides a lot more exposure to those other promotions, to the point where Teddy Long's stint managing Doom in WCW became a focal point of his induction, not just his Smackdown GM run. DDP didn't get in for his one year in WWF smiling and having a little run with the European Championship.

So, they've burnt through a lot of worthy WWF/E names. Most of the top WCW players too, bar Goldberg. I can only assume we'll see the likes of RVD, Dreamer, Sabu, the Dudleys within the next 2-3 years now.
 

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Had WWF not stolen many ECW ideas and styles WWE would not be a thing in 2017 and I am a 28 year fan of WWF/E.

Violence, Language, and Women being involved more in a sexual way...
 
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