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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Watching some old things in WWE from 1991 which was one of my all time favorite years in WWE seeing as i grew up an NWA fan and watched a lot of Ric Flair and The Road Warriors so seeing them in WWE was a big thing for me. One thing that stood out to me that i had forgotten all about was that Vince McMahon was using the NWA World title on tv or PPV's which was about as big an insult as you can do to your competition.

I remember Vince McMahon being very scared in 1997 of Bret Hart going to WCW as WWE champion and showing up on Nitro with the title belt just as he hated the fact that Madusa/Alundra Blayze showed up with the Womens title and threw it in a bin. Surely though what Vince McMahon actually did do was much worse and this at a time when he was very much on top in the wrestling industry with NWA/WCW going through a lot of major changes because of Jim Herd and barely any of them good.

What i'm getting at is i don't really ever remember Vince McMahon getting any heat for allowing Ric Flair to turn up with the NWA World title or possibly being the one who wanted to push that on tv yet i can remember Eric Bischoff getting a lot of heat for Madusa/Alundra Blayze and Bret Hart even possibly doing so at a time when WCW were the ones on top. Surely Vince McMahon was the one who began everything as far as champions turning up with titles on rival companies tv shows came about, i know they did the whole video distortion thing but by then everyone knew it was the NWA World title and knew Ric Flair was their World champion.
 

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Vince did not WANT Ric flair to show up with the title, Flair just did. Flair still does get heat for it.

But Eric Bischoff purposely had medusa do that to WWF. Its well documented.
 

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Legally, Flair owned the belt. If I remember correctly, every wrestler in NWA had to deposit a sum of money while holding the championship as insurance and once they dropped it, the deposit would be returned. So on his way out of the NWA, Flair wanted his deposit back in return for the championship but Jim refused, so Flair left with the belt and showed up with it on WWF TV. I wouldn't be surprised if they got some heat for it at the time, but I believe that Jim Herd got the most heat (and rightfully so).

If one good thing came from this, it got Herd fired.
 

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Tecnically speaking Ric Flair owned the NWA World title, since back then wrestlers used to pay a desposit or something for the title when they were champion. However I do think it's down right insulting what Ric Flair did, and it's something that wrestling seem to overlook when talking about Flair. Even if he didn't throw it in the bin, showing up on a rival company's show with their world title was wrong. This is the same guy who badmouthed the NWO in an interview once because they kept made themselves out to be bigger then WCW, and said that it was wrong. Yet it seems he was making himself out to be bigger then NWA by keeping their title and showing up on another show. Which is more wrong in that regard?

Even today Madusa/Alundra is blacklisted, yet Flair is treated like a god. I just wonder what Flair thinks of the Montreal Screwjob.
 

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Vince did not WANT Ric flair to show up with the title, Flair just did. Flair still does get heat for it.

But Eric Bischoff purposely had medusa do that to WWF. Its well documented.
Didn't Ric Flair actually send Vince McMahon the NWA title? Then they came up with an angle where Flair would debut as the real world's champion with the NWA title around his waste. This went on until NWA threatened legal action if the WWF showed the NWA title on WWF tv so they began to blur the title belt.

Flair didn't just turn up with the title around his waste without Vince knowing or without permission. It was all cleared in advance.
 

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I always read they offered Flair to buy it and he did. And Vince did get shit back when he started using the belt. But it's a replica, not the same belt Flair wore.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Didn't Ric Flair actually send Vince McMahon the NWA title? Then they came up with an angle where Flair would debut as the real world's champion with the NWA title around his waste. This went on until NWA threatened legal action if the WWF showed the NWA title on WWF tv so they began to blur the title belt.

Flair didn't just turn up with the title around his waste without Vince knowing or without permission. It was all cleared in advance.
Yes Ric Flair said he called Vince McMahon and said he would like to come to WWE and Vince McMahon said ok but send me the belt first which he did. This is even spoken about on the DVD of The Four Horsemen in 2006 or 2007 if i remember rightly so Vince McMahon definitely did want to use the NWA World title belt.
 

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From what i know he owned the belt cos he had put the deposit on the belt and when he left WCW he was the champion and never dropped the belt. He then showed up in WWE with it and they did the Real Worlds Champion. The NWA who still had say within WCW in 1991 did a vote concerning the belt and WWF was not aloud to use the belt so Flair used an old tag belt that they blurred out on TV.
 

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I think this had more to do with Flair and the NWA then it did with Vince. Flair had to put a $25,000 deposit on the belt IIRC (which was customary at the time) and they refused to give it back to him when he left, so he decided the belt was his and he went to WWF with it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I don't see any reason to give Vince heat over it. It was mostly Flair and it actually raised the value of the title as opposed to Madusa throwing the women's title in the trash.
I think this had more to do with Flair and the NWA then it did with Vince. Flair had to put a $25,000 deposit on the belt IIRC (which was customary at the time) and they refused to give it back to him when he left, so he decided the belt was his and he went to WWF with it.
Every NWA World champion back then had to pay a $25,000 deposit on the title belt and Jim Herd refused to pay it back to Ric Flair because he was leaving and even told Ric Flair that Doug Dillinger was coming to collect. The fact is though that Vince McMahon wouldn't simply just allow Ric Flair to turn up on WWE tv with the rival companies World title belt unless he had given the go ahead, it was Vince McMahon who had told Ric Flair to send the belt to him before he even signed with WWE and that is well known, why would Vince McMahon ask Ric Flair to send the title belt if he wasn't the one who wanted to put it on WWE tv.

The whole video distortion thing was part of a storyline where Ric Flair said he was "the real World's champion" and so that WWE could build towards Hogan/Flair for WrestleMania 8 not because of NWA/WCW telling WWE to blur the title or they would be sued, it was part of a storyline that Vince McMahon did to make it look as if the rival company had threatened to sue. Still to this day nothing is put on tv without Vince McMahon agreeing to it and a lot of the time back then everything that was on WWE tv was down to him as it wasn't really until 1994 that wrestlers started coming up with their own ideas and running them past Vince McMahon which is why The Clique have always been seen as having a lot of backstage power.
 

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I guess the main problem is that VKM & the Fed didn't disrespect the title by trashing the way Medusa did.

Flair's NWA title was treated similarly to DiBiase's Million Dollar championship in as much as it was an unrecognized title that a heel was using to get over.

I believe that to be the major difference.
 

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WWE disrespected the womens title way more than Medusa did. Atleast people actually give a shit when she tossed it in the bin. Can't say the same anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I guess the main problem is that VKM & the Fed didn't disrespect the title by trashing the way Medusa did.

Flair's NWA title was treated similarly to DiBiase's Million Dollar championship in as much as it was an unrecognized title that a heel was using to get over.

I believe that to be the major difference.
Any wrestling fan from back then knew who Ric Flair was and knew that the belt he was carrying was the NWA World title as it wasn't even distorted when Bobby Heenan first brought Ric Flair out on what i think was Prime Time Wrestling if i remember right. The fact is that Ric Flair coming out with the NWA World title on WWE tv without any video distortion and on a pre taped show was a lot more wrong than Madusa seeing as Madusa hadn't even done anything with the title in god knows how long anyway whereas Ric Flair along with Sting was the symbol of NWA/WCW.

It may not have been properly recognized by WWE as far as on screen goes but like i said that was all part of a storyline to build Hogan/Flair in the long term as Ric Flair's promo at The Royal Rumble in 1992 goes on to show. The fact is that Vince McMahon TOLD Ric Flair to SEND the title belt in a telephone conversation they had after Ric Flair had decided to leave WCW because of Jim Herd and Ric Flair then sent it. Back then tv was pre taped so if as some people are trying to claim it was all Ric Flair do you think the taping wouldn't have been edited so it WAS down to Vince McMahon as he wanted to make a storyline out of it with "the real World champion" in Ric Flair against the WWE champion in Hulk Hogan.
 

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Funny thing is, the NWA title was on RAW after that, on Jeff Jarrets waist, with the actual NWA president who presented it to JJ.
 

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I guess the main problem is that VKM & the Fed didn't disrespect the title by trashing the way Medusa did.

Flair's NWA title was treated similarly to DiBiase's Million Dollar championship in as much as it was an unrecognized title that a heel was using to get over.

I believe that to be the major difference.
Spot on Chief. They didn't do anything to disrespect the title and if anything, probably did more for it than WCW ever could. I believe that WCW won a court ruling that prevented WWF from continuing to use it, thats where the old Tag belt came into it.
 

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Vince did not WANT Ric flair to show up with the title, Flair just did. Flair still does get heat for it.
No, you're wrong. WWF showed the title (and Bobby Heenan talked about it) for several weeks BEFORE Flair even showed up on WWF t.v.:

 

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Any wrestling fan from back then knew who Ric Flair was and knew that the belt he was carrying was the NWA World title as it wasn't even distorted when Bobby Heenan first brought Ric Flair out on what i think was Prime Time Wrestling if i remember right. The fact is that Ric Flair coming out with the NWA World title on WWE tv without any video distortion and on a pre taped show was a lot more wrong than Madusa seeing as Madusa hadn't even done anything with the title in god knows how long anyway whereas Ric Flair along with Sting was the symbol of NWA/WCW.

It may not have been properly recognized by WWE as far as on screen goes but like i said that was all part of a storyline to build Hogan/Flair in the long term as Ric Flair's promo at The Royal Rumble in 1992 goes on to show. The fact is that Vince McMahon TOLD Ric Flair to SEND the title belt in a telephone conversation they had after Ric Flair had decided to leave WCW because of Jim Herd and Ric Flair then sent it. Back then tv was pre taped so if as some people are trying to claim it was all Ric Flair do you think the taping wouldn't have been edited so it WAS down to Vince McMahon as he wanted to make a storyline out of it with "the real World champion" in Ric Flair against the WWE champion in Hulk Hogan.
Vince wanted to use the NWA title to get Flair over in his territory and set up his eventual superfight, Bischoff just wanted to embarrass Vince. There was no rhyme or reason to why Bischoff wanted that Women's title other than to throw it in the trash, the women's division in WCW dissolved so quickly most don't even remember it existing (it only lasted about a year or two). Flair was given the WWF highest honor and Medusa found herself blackballed in the wrestling industry and basically aimless within the same amount of time.

Vince didn't bring in the NWA title to embarrass the NWA but to help himself & Flair. Bischoff just wanted to take a cheap shot at Vince, he had no real plan for Women's wrestling.

I understand that perhaps its a double standard that people didn't hold it against Flair but they do against Medusa, however you have to look at who they are...I mean he is Ric Flair, the 16 time World Champion, limosine-riding, jet flying, wheel-dealing, kiss stealing son of a gun and she's Alundra Blayze/Medusa, heavily pushed Women's Champion but hardly the stature of Flair.

Foley attempted to rationalize to Flair why he spit on WCW's Tag Championship but spitting on titles is disrespectful, regardless of context (which Foley argued that Flair didn't understand the context) and the same can be said for trashing titles, you just don't do it.
 
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