Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion - Lex Luger or Vader?
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Neither of them deserved to be WWE champion, there was no way HBK was gonna drop the title so soon into his first run at the top.
Neither of them deserved to be WWE champion, there was no way HBK was gonna drop the title so soon into his first run at the top.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
IMO vader
IMO vader
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
I'm going to say neither. With Luger you get the feeling that he was the back up on if Bret Hart failed. I also get the feeling the Rumble was done the way it was to give McMahon more time to decided who was going to be the face of the company. With that said, Bret didn't fail. At least not enough to drop down to Luger.
When we say Vader, we can't let his runs in other places effect what we're talking about here. In WWE he wasn't the same, so there was no reason to give him the belt. Honestly, in WWE he was nothing more than "insert upper midcarder here". That was his role vs. Shawn, Taker, Goldust and Kane. I know there was plans and Shawn vetoed the decision, but really all Vader was in WWE was another body. If you had a gap in time from major shows you'd place them in a feud with Vader. He kind of was just a stepping stone.
I'm going to say neither. With Luger you get the feeling that he was the back up on if Bret Hart failed. I also get the feeling the Rumble was done the way it was to give McMahon more time to decided who was going to be the face of the company. With that said, Bret didn't fail. At least not enough to drop down to Luger.
When we say Vader, we can't let his runs in other places effect what we're talking about here. In WWE he wasn't the same, so there was no reason to give him the belt. Honestly, in WWE he was nothing more than "insert upper midcarder here". That was his role vs. Shawn, Taker, Goldust and Kane. I know there was plans and Shawn vetoed the decision, but really all Vader was in WWE was another body. If you had a gap in time from major shows you'd place them in a feud with Vader. He kind of was just a stepping stone.
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You absolutely need to look at Vaders other work to see the potential he could have been. Just look at the reaction when Flair got his belt back and insert Shawn, it could have been an amazing feud. Vader should have held a title for fuck sake Sid was champion but not Vader? Vader was 1000 times the worker and would have made Shawn look amazing at the end with Shawm going over.
Vader was the biggest miss use of talent in WWE history.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Vader Luger bombed when Vince tried to put him over. Vader would have been a decent heel champ early in his WWF days.
Vader Luger bombed when Vince tried to put him over. Vader would have been a decent heel champ early in his WWF days.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Without a doubt, Vader!
While his career faltered, he was a massive, massive monster when he first showed up in 1996. WWF would have been better off during 1996 if Vince had just taken the belt off of Shawn & placed it on Vader at Summerslam, as was the original idea.
Without a doubt, Vader!
While his career faltered, he was a massive, massive monster when he first showed up in 1996. WWF would have been better off during 1996 if Vince had just taken the belt off of Shawn & placed it on Vader at Summerslam, as was the original idea.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Vader. There was nothing that Sid wasn't doing in 96/97 that Vader couldn't have done. SummerSlam '96 just FEELS weird. You know something was up then. He should have been the guy to beat Shawn.
But, it was awesome when Sid did it in MSG.
Vader. There was nothing that Sid wasn't doing in 96/97 that Vader couldn't have done. SummerSlam '96 just FEELS weird. You know something was up then. He should have been the guy to beat Shawn.
But, it was awesome when Sid did it in MSG.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
What I'm saying is in WWE, during the time he was facing Shawn Michaels in '96 did not really need to go over. That just wasn't his role in WWE. We can't retroactively go back nearly 20 years and change his role. In WWE he was just a good hand upper midcarder to use in a WWE superstars down time. Vader would never look weak and wins over him made his opponent look strong. Was Vader potentially underused in WWE? Sure. You're saying Sid got a title run. Sid's run with the belts was only a few weeks. It's not like he was a dominate champion. He won it to give it right back to Shawn. Then won it to give to Undertaker.
All I'm saying was Vader's role was basically babysitter/jobber to the stars. So why give him a reign. I'm not saying he wasn't phenomenal or better than Sid, because he was, but there roles were different. Sid was a main event level guy used as a transitional champ (who also had already main evented wrestlemania before) and Vader was a utility player to give the stars something to do.
There's some misunderstanding here. I NEVER said Vader wasn't good. Vader was great. I'm not comparing him to Sid, because that's not making any point. Comparisons here are never really in context. Could Vader potentially have been a better main eventer than Sid? Sure, but that's not what we're talking about and Sid is irrelevant to this discussion.
What I'm saying is in WWE, during the time he was facing Shawn Michaels in '96 did not really need to go over. That just wasn't his role in WWE. We can't retroactively go back nearly 20 years and change his role. In WWE he was just a good hand upper midcarder to use in a WWE superstars down time. Vader would never look weak and wins over him made his opponent look strong. Was Vader potentially underused in WWE? Sure. You're saying Sid got a title run. Sid's run with the belts was only a few weeks. It's not like he was a dominate champion. He won it to give it right back to Shawn. Then won it to give to Undertaker.
All I'm saying was Vader's role was basically babysitter/jobber to the stars. So why give him a reign. I'm not saying he wasn't phenomenal or better than Sid, because he was, but there roles were different. Sid was a main event level guy used as a transitional champ (who also had already main evented wrestlemania before) and Vader was a utility player to give the stars something to do.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Vader's good enough for me. Luger, not so much. Seemed like a bootleg Hulk Hogan to me during his WWF run.
Vader's good enough for me. Luger, not so much. Seemed like a bootleg Hulk Hogan to me during his WWF run.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
I think when Vader first came in he could have done big things as champion, but it was HBK's time.
He was the guy who was anti-authority before Austin and the nWo beating on the boss which historians and fans online never bring up.
I think when Vader first came in he could have done big things as champion, but it was HBK's time.
He was the guy who was anti-authority before Austin and the nWo beating on the boss which historians and fans online never bring up.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
No question, Vader all the way.
Vader is the type of guy you can't book as a monster heel and not give him the title. Furthermore, since he can only be booked as a monster heel, you have to give him the title. That spelled the beginning of the end for Vader. Not possible to overcome that because the monster appeal wore off within the first, where he didn't win when it mattered.
With Luger, it's less deserving because of the circumstances surrounding his babyface push. He was used as a replacement. I don't think you can say a guy in the replacement role is deserving or should have won the title. Plus, I don't really see a long title run by babyface Luger in the 90s as a good idea anyway, which is why nobody ever did. Heel Luger as champion, there's something to work with in the 90s WWF because there's a variety of stars. As a face, not so much and Luger isn't good enough to possibly elevate guys like Bret could. Giving Luger the belt would be nothing more than "Hey, let's give him the belt" and I'm sure that's how it goes but I'm also sure there's a vision for that happening and I can't see how face Luger as champion would work. And I really can't say he deserved it, especially not as Hogan-lite.
Vader, as a heel in '96 WWF, you got shit to work with, proven by his runs in WCW. And with Cornette? IMO, that's gold. A unbeatable, monster heel as champion. Fuck it, let him drop the belt to Taker, let him drop it back just like Sid but to not have it at all? HBK at his finest. Vader should have beat his ass for being a bitch.
No question, Vader all the way.
Vader is the type of guy you can't book as a monster heel and not give him the title. Furthermore, since he can only be booked as a monster heel, you have to give him the title. That spelled the beginning of the end for Vader. Not possible to overcome that because the monster appeal wore off within the first, where he didn't win when it mattered.
With Luger, it's less deserving because of the circumstances surrounding his babyface push. He was used as a replacement. I don't think you can say a guy in the replacement role is deserving or should have won the title. Plus, I don't really see a long title run by babyface Luger in the 90s as a good idea anyway, which is why nobody ever did. Heel Luger as champion, there's something to work with in the 90s WWF because there's a variety of stars. As a face, not so much and Luger isn't good enough to possibly elevate guys like Bret could. Giving Luger the belt would be nothing more than "Hey, let's give him the belt" and I'm sure that's how it goes but I'm also sure there's a vision for that happening and I can't see how face Luger as champion would work. And I really can't say he deserved it, especially not as Hogan-lite.
Vader, as a heel in '96 WWF, you got shit to work with, proven by his runs in WCW. And with Cornette? IMO, that's gold. A unbeatable, monster heel as champion. Fuck it, let him drop the belt to Taker, let him drop it back just like Sid but to not have it at all? HBK at his finest. Vader should have beat his ass for being a bitch.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Im going with the Tide and say Vader as well. There were 3 chances where Vader could of had the strap... Summerslam 1996 was the best chance. I reckon he could of held the belt for 2-3 months and lost it at Survivor Series 1996.
Another chance would of been WWF the final four PPV in February of 1997. I know Bret won the belt that night to build up the Bret Vs Austin Feud. I wouldnt mind Vader winning the belt that night then dropped the belt to Sid a night later as what Bret originally did.
The final chance and this would of been a very slim one was vs Undertaker at Calgary stampede at july 1997. It could of been ok and a Vader vs Bret Hart match at Summerslam 1997 would of been good but you wouldnt get the start of the Undertaker vs HBK rivalry.
Lex Luger was underused as well in a way. If they were going to give him the strap, it would of been Summerslam 1993 or WM 10. By Summerslam 1994 he was buried to the point of no return. The only possible choice might of been wm 11 if he won the 1995 royal rumble.
Im going with the Tide and say Vader as well. There were 3 chances where Vader could of had the strap... Summerslam 1996 was the best chance. I reckon he could of held the belt for 2-3 months and lost it at Survivor Series 1996.
Another chance would of been WWF the final four PPV in February of 1997. I know Bret won the belt that night to build up the Bret Vs Austin Feud. I wouldnt mind Vader winning the belt that night then dropped the belt to Sid a night later as what Bret originally did.
The final chance and this would of been a very slim one was vs Undertaker at Calgary stampede at july 1997. It could of been ok and a Vader vs Bret Hart match at Summerslam 1997 would of been good but you wouldnt get the start of the Undertaker vs HBK rivalry.
Lex Luger was underused as well in a way. If they were going to give him the strap, it would of been Summerslam 1993 or WM 10. By Summerslam 1994 he was buried to the point of no return. The only possible choice might of been wm 11 if he won the 1995 royal rumble.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
People seem to be judging Vader based on how he ended up in 97 and then 98.
You should look at how he started in the WWF. He was a monster. He attacked Gorilla Monsoon for God's sake!
After Summerslam he lost his momentum and dwindled into oblivion.
But he could have been something special.
People seem to be judging Vader based on how he ended up in 97 and then 98.
You should look at how he started in the WWF. He was a monster. He attacked Gorilla Monsoon for God's sake!
After Summerslam he lost his momentum and dwindled into oblivion.
But he could have been something special.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
I would of much rather preferred to of seen Vader get the title run instead of Sycho Sid in 1996.
I would of much rather preferred to of seen Vader get the title run instead of Sycho Sid in 1996.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
It was weird how Sid got the strap in his second WWE run. I guess Vince likes the big guys not the semi fat ones.
It was weird how Sid got the strap in his second WWE run. I guess Vince likes the big guys not the semi fat ones.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Oh you mean like say, John Cena?
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
I would have preferred to see Vader win the WWF Championship. He could have been a dominate heel that took down everyone, he had a great gimmick and was exciting to watch in the ring for a big guy. I don't think the WWF fully capitalized on his full potential.
I would have preferred to see Vader win the WWF Championship. He could have been a dominate heel that took down everyone, he had a great gimmick and was exciting to watch in the ring for a big guy. I don't think the WWF fully capitalized on his full potential.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
Curt Hennig.
Curt Hennig.
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Re: Who was more deserving of being WWF Champion Lex Luger or Vader
More deserving? Vader.
Luger never sat right with me, I didn't like his look.
More deserving? Vader.
Luger never sat right with me, I didn't like his look.
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