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Which is worse? A chair shot in pro wrestling or a round in the Octagon?

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I have noticed that many observers of wrestling have condemned the use of unprotected chairshots to the head in the name of protecting wrestlers' health. Now, while I wholeheartedly agree with this line of thinking and I commend WWE for banning chairshots to the head and other dangerous moves, I do wonder this:

Is it hypocritical for those who condemn chairshots, to be fans of MMA and cheer on as fighters take more severe blows (punches, kicks, knees, punches on the ground etc) to the head than in any other sport I can think of (with the possible exception of boxing, but not definitely, because boxers don't have to take kicks or get hit on the ground.)

Many studies have been conducted in the last number of years on the brains of dead football players, fighters, and pro wrestlers. A lot of evidence has suggested that the human brain is far more susceptible to injury from blunt force than was thought previously. Concussions and other brain injuries have been linked to chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE (The degenerative brain disease Chris Benoit, amongst others, was found to be suffering from).

Brock Lesnar is considered a top level fighter and in his last two fights, he won one and he lost one. However, the result to his health was the same in both fights. His face was an almost unrecognisable mush because he took so many hard shots to the head let alone the blows to his body. Whether you think it is his right to enter the Octagon and take these risks if he so wishes or not, you have to wonder if it is right for spectators to cheer on as one human beats on another to the point that they are battered, bloodied, swollen and unconscious? Lesnar is UFC's top draw and former heavyweight champion and he has shown that even a tip top level fighter is liable to suffer untold trauma to the head even if he wins, let alone if he loses.

In the interest of full disclosure, I don't agree in principle with boxing or mma or the All Japan strong style of pro wrestling, or basically anything where the point is to injure or harm the other person. (I know the point of strong style pro wrestling is not to actually injure your opponent, but injury is such an obvious and direct consequence of the style that I feel it should be included)

So again, is it hypocritical for those who condemn chairshots, to be fans of MMA? What do you think?
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We're talking an unprotected blast from steel onto skull against trained fighters who are protecting themselves at all time, so I dunno.

But like anything, moderation is key. If you took five unprotected chairshots everynight in a wrestling ring - your brain would be mush before too long.

However if you had a three round fight in the octagon every single day, this could also ring true.

The bottom line is there really is no comparison - because one is a show for the fans, where the object is to protect each other whilst making it look as good as possible. That is not represented by hitting someone on the head as hard as you can with no protection.

MMA however is physical combat in a controlled environment, where you are trying to hurt each other.

So, no - I don't think anyone who disagrees with unprotected chairshots in wrestling is a hypocrite for enjoying MMA.
 

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MMA fighters generally know what they're in for when they pursue MMA. Severe brain damage would be the sacrifice for them I suppose.

The difference would be that professional wrestlers can still do what they do without taking chair shots to the head.
They can take a hit on a different part of the body or just avoid chairs all together and still have a match.

There's hope for a safer environment for wrestlers with lots of dangerous moves being banned as the years go by.
As far as MMA fighters go, I think that will always be part of their line of work.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
But surely the thought process behind condemning chairshots is that you don't want somebody to suffer brain damage?

If somebody in an octagon takes damage to the extent that they suffer a brain injury like a concussion, where does your concern for the person go?

It can't be that fighters agree to the risks, because by that logic it would be okay for a wrestler to agree to a chairshot if he knows the risk.

Also as regards which is harder to take, a chair shot or punches in the Octagon, I have seen Brock no-sell a chair shot to the head. He isn't able to no-sell punches from Velasquez or Carwin.
 

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An MMA fighter in the UFC will have 3 to 5 fights a year. Of course when you are building your way up, you'll have less. Same goes for boxing, though I believe you're more likely to get your head messed up in Boxing, as majority of people, will hunt for the head. And then with a 10 count thing, you could be knocked down for an 8 count every round but finish a round, 12 to 15 rounds of that will make you're brain look like goo. With MMA sure you can be kicked in the head, but it's rarely done, as it's easy to counter and can tire you out. The gloves as well are not made to protect your head, they are made to protect your hands from braking whilst punching someone in the head (heads are hard).
But then with wrestling, you have the problems aswell with landing on your head, even when landing on the matt on your back, you head can still whip back and hit the matt. I guess taking a chair to the head unprotected is alright if you do it like 5 times a year, but not like Rock vs Mankind style, where you are literally swinging for the fences.

It's all moderation, how much you do at the time, and how long you leave to heal afterwards. A pro-wrestler will take longer to heal than a fighter, due to constantly having to work year round.
 

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Chairshot. Last time I checked nobody in the UFC's fist = an unprotected steel chair to the skull. Besides it would depend on the round.

Plus wrestling is fake so taking a chairshot just for the fuck of it is pointless. Everyone already thinks/knows it's fake so why damage your brain and shorten your life just so I can get a cheap thrill? In MMA you are supposed to knock the guy out or submit him, but not in rasslin'.
 

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You know, I'm gonna try and answer this to according to my past experience in mma and current job as a pro wrestler.
Taking a chairshot to the head can be a fatal thing just like any punch or kick that is delivered in an mma fight. Wrestlers as a whole are taught one important thing when dishing and taking chairshots. NEVER HIT SOMEONE ON THE SIDE OF HIS HEAD OR DIRECTLY IN THE FACE. You see some measures are taken as to give some protection to the receipent where a chair is swung, ever notice how a chairshot is mostly directed to the forehead, more so at the bend where the hairline and and forehead meet? Now this still isn't very safe long term, which is why you won't see wrestlers taking in chairshots at regular intervals. Heck i've suffered a concussion as a result of a chairshot before, but i've also suffered a concussion as a result of phoenix splash where i misjudged my landing and hit my head against my opponents left knee.

Now from an MMA standpoint, blows to the head are just as dangerous, sometimes more so because a kick or punch is a more focused shot and the point of pressure is smaller as compared to hitting with an object with with a wider surface. 1 punch, 1 roundhouse, 1 elbow, 1 knee, 1 move in general can be deadly if landed correctly. Trust me landing a roundhouse on someone and hitting them in the back of the neck by accident and feeling a "crackling" noise as your foot hits sends cold chills up your spine. Now ask any MMA fighter, the first and most obvious rule is to go all out and don't ever hesitate, but keep things in "control" meaning we don't go for deadly blows ala "heartpunch" etc

Now you ask which is worse between a chairshot and a direct mma shot to the head? Well they are both equal i would say out of my own experience, depending on who the deliverer is and how the shot is taken

It all comes down to this. Any sport has it's risks, there really isn't anything like a "safe sport".

PS The Rock hitting Foley like that chairshot after chairshot is BLATANT STUPIDITY. The way some of those shots were delivered are questionable to say the least
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Chairshot. Last time I checked nobody in the UFC's fist = an unprotected steel chair to the skull. Besides it would depend on the round.

Plus wrestling is fake so taking a chairshot just for the fuck of it is pointless. Everyone already thinks/knows it's fake so why damage your brain and shorten your life just so I can get a cheap thrill? In MMA you are supposed to knock the guy out or submit him, but not in rasslin'.
Yeah but Brock is able to shrug off and no sell chairshots. He isn't able to no-sell in the octagon. Wouldn't that tell you that the punishment from a trained ufc fighter is harder to take than a chairshot where the swinger isn't actually trying to take your head off?
Also why is it any less of a cheap thrill to damage your brain and shorten your life just because you do it in ufc? All professional sport is just for other people's entertainment anyway. When an aging fighter is suffering brain damage and can't function properly, it won't make it any better for him that he ended up that way because he lined Dana White's pockets instead of Vince's.
 

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obviously chair shot to the head, it's unprotected and very dangerous.

UFC wear protective gloves etc plus they stop the fight before any serious injury happens. With a chair shot you don't know what's going to happen. Plus chair shot has long term damage to the brain
 

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Also in MMA the ref steps int he moment they think you can't protect yourself. In pro wrestling? not so much, the match goes on unless one guy is really, really fucked up. No actual sport would allow the kind of shit that goes on in 'hardcore' wrestling.

The real danger lies in repeated damage and not allowing it to heal. Fighters have a bout every month at most, usually only every two or three giving them plenty of time to heal and make sure they aren't showing signs of being 'punch-drunk'. Wrestlers go week in week out taking that kind of damage and it just builds up and builds up.

A bout in MMA, K-1 or Boxing does a body no good whatsoever but they have rules intended to keep things from getting too dangerous. Pro wrestling does not. Just watch any Botchamania that focusses on CZW or some shit and cringe at the amount of people being being legitimately spiked and then getting up to try and keep going. And there are a lot of wrestling fans who demand that level of violence and dedication, just look at the 'glory days' of ECW. MMA fans may want to see a fighter lose hard but mostly they're there to see a good contest, not to see someone get torn to pieces.
 

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Some facts:

- Boxing is the worst sport for the brain. The big gloves reduce the KO power...that resulting in more punches thrown and landed in a fight. 100 punches to the head are way worse than a big high kick to the skull that puts the guy to sleep.

- In MMA and Boxing, you can't hit the back of the head becouse is the most dangerous place to hit, while the majority of chairs shots hit right in the back.

- Punching in the jaw, nose or cheek bone doesn't have the same effect than a direct blow to the skull. That means you can be KO'd without damage to your brain...

- MMA fighters and kickboxers fight, at most, 50-70 bouts in a span of 12-15 years, and the damage to the head done in a good amount of those is very little.

But the most important thing is... why people still compare wrestling to sports instead of movies?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
You know, I'm gonna try and answer this to according to my past experience in mma and current job as a pro wrestler.
Taking a chairshot to the head can be a fatal thing just like any punch or kick that is delivered in an mma fight. Wrestlers as a whole are taught one important thing when dishing and taking chairshots. NEVER HIT SOMEONE ON THE SIDE OF HIS HEAD OR DIRECTLY IN THE FACE. You see some measures are taken as to give some protection to the receipent where a chair is swung, ever notice how a chairshot is mostly directed to the forehead, more so at the bend where the hairline and and forehead meet? Now this still isn't very safe long term, which is why you won't see wrestlers taking in chairshots at regular intervals. Heck i've suffered a concussion as a result of a chairshot before, but i've also suffered a concussion as a result of phoenix splash where i misjudged my landing and hit my head against my opponents left knee.

Now from an MMA standpoint, blows to the head are just as dangerous, sometimes more so because a kick or punch is a more focused shot and the point of pressure is smaller as compared to hitting with an object with with a wider surface. 1 punch, 1 roundhouse, 1 elbow, 1 knee, 1 move in general can be deadly if landed correctly. Trust me landing a roundhouse on someone and hitting them in the back of the neck by accident and feeling a "crackling" noise as your foot hits sends cold chills up your spine. Now ask any MMA fighter, the first and most obvious rule is to go all out and don't ever hesitate, but keep things in "control" meaning we don't go for deadly blows ala "heartpunch" etc

Now you ask which is worse between a chairshot and a direct mma shot to the head? Well they are both equal i would say out of my own experience, depending on who the deliverer is and how the shot is taken

It all comes down to this. Any sport has it's risks, there really isn't anything like a "safe sport".

PS The Rock hitting Foley like that chairshot after chairshot is BLATANT STUPIDITY. The way some of those shots were delivered are questionable to say the least
By the way, I would agree that all things considered taking all the variables onto account like who is swinging and where the blow lands etc, that an unprotected chairshot and a direct mma strike from a ufc fighter are equally dangerous. I consider chairshots to be too great a danger to a person's brain(regardless of whether they are a wrestler or a fighter). Therefore seeing as they are equally dangerous, I am also against people striking each other with intent to hurt in the confines of the ufc. Looking at it from a human standpoint and not differentiating just because somebody is a legit fighter or entertainer, I don't think anyone deserves to be brain damaged at the end of their career. Ufc is there to entertain, just like wwe. The fact that they do it with real violence doesn't make it anymore noble. In fact it probably makes it less
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
obviously chair shot to the head, it's unprotected and very dangerous.

UFC wear protective gloves etc plus they stop the fight before any serious injury happens. With a chair shot you don't know what's going to happen. Plus chair shot has long term damage to the brain
In what way is a barrage punches from somebody like shane carwin not very dangerous?
Also you know the gloves are to protect guys fists, not heads right? And refs stop matches before injury happens? I never saw Brock leave a wwe ring in as bad a shape as he did after his last two ufc fights.
I agree you don't know what is going to happen with a chairshot. That is why I am against them. But you also don't know what can happen with a beast like carwin on top of you on the ground punching your head in.
And you're kidding me if you think there isn't longterm damage to the brain from repeated blows to the head from ufc heavy hitters
 

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By the way, I would agree that all things considered taking all the variables onto account like who is swinging and where the blow lands etc, that an unprotected chairshot and a direct mma strike from a ufc fighter are equally dangerous. I consider chairshots to be too great a danger to a person's brain(regardless of whether they are a wrestler or a fighter). Therefore seeing as they are equally dangerous, I am also against people striking each other with intent to hurt in the confines of the ufc. Looking at it from a human standpoint and not differentiating just because somebody is a legit fighter or entertainer, I don't think anyone deserves to be brain damaged at the end of their career. Ufc is there to entertain, just like wwe. The fact that they do it with real violence doesn't make it anymore noble. In fact it probably makes it less
While i do get where you're coming from, i can tell you that my motivation when i was doing mma was because i love the sport. To me there is nothing like going out there and testing your skills against others with the same passion and love for the sport. I SERIOUSLY miss MMA alot at times but i made my choice and i'm sticking to pro wrestling. You see, i totally get where you are coming from but look at this from our standpoint. 90% of mma fighters do it for the love. It's no different to football. Sure there are dangers involved but that's why there are rules and regulations involved. Many fighters fight for different reasons but most do it for the love of the sport. It's been that way since the dawn of man, honour is something that is earned, respect is something that is earned, and to a fighter even those in ufc making the big bucks, respect and honour matter too, not just the money, no matter what they may say. "Underground" fighting is where your point comes across better, where there are(in most cases) where the lives and safety of the contenders mean next to nothing. So i do agree somehwhat to what you say and i do see your point, i hope that you too can see our standpoint. Most fighters don't do it to hurt someone, we do it within rules and boundaries because we love the sport, not the thrill of inflicting injuries on another. Hurting someone is not all what MMA is about for those who love the sport
 

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I'd say a chair shot to the head is more dangerous. I mean come on, that's a metal chair being slammed into your head. There's no way for it NOT to hurt like a motherfucker, especially when it's hit so hard the chair bends.

Still, even with this in mind I never really forgave WWE for banning them. Maybe I'm just sick, but I always loved seeing people get a stiff crack across the skull with a chair. There's something about it, particularly the sound, that just makes me happy.
 

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obviously chair shot to the head, it's unprotected and very dangerous.

UFC wear protective gloves etc plus they stop the fight before any serious injury happens. With a chair shot you don't know what's going to happen. Plus chair shot has long term damage to the brain
You have no effing clue how useless those gloves are. Those things serve almost zero protection to the guy who's getting his head punched in.

Second, guys can still wrestle well into their 40s. In MMA you should have retired by now.

Third, chair shot to head, cutcut, bleed. Punches + Elbows + Knees + Real Chokes to the head = Bleeding in every surface that can bleed.

It's no doubt a chairshot can f*ck your head up. But people seriously need to watch more MMA. There's a reason why they only fight 2-3 times a year; it can f*ck up your health in a heartbeat. There's also a reason why referee stoppage is so important in MMA; once a person gets rocked he is in actual mortal danger to recieve permanent damage due to inability to defend himself.

I still gives both wrestling and MMA equal props.
 

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The question is silly because both situations are so very circumstantial. The chair shot could be unprotected, from behind, from the side, to the front. Who's the guy you're in the octagon with? The weight difference? The skill difference?

It's just a silly question in general and way too broad to make anything near to a right answer.
 

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WWF is just fake kid shit and Couture could legit knock that pussy Cena out legit. Clearly you know nothing about MMA cus its legit and btw I trained at my local MMA gym for 2 weeks so I know how legit it feels.

/pseudoaggressivemiddleagedouchebagufcfan
 
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