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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Vince Mcmahon gave Bret Hart high praise in this promo drop saying "That was a real champion" for the A & E Documentary.

The way Vince stated that it seems like Vince knows when he has the real deal champion and knows he has "paper champions".

I would love to hear his list on that lol.
 

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I think Vince always felt like Bret was a placeholder until he found his next Hogan which ended being Austin but that in retrospect he's in a better position to fully appreciate what Bret did for his company and brought to his product. Yes he was a placeholder but it's a job very few if anyone other than Bret could've pulled off. He was a total pro he was dependable and he had the ability to legitimize his product at a time when it's credibility took a serious hit. What he lacked in pop culture appeal he more than made up with his GOAT level storytelling ability in/out of the ring and his gift for making wrestling look real. He was the perfect guy to transition from Hogan to Austin As a kid/teen I remember when i first found out he had beaten Ric Flair for the belt my first reaction was "What? That mid-carder is now world champ how the mighty have fallen". Fast forward to 2 years later when he lost the belt to Backlund i remember thinking. "That guy was the greatest world champion ever" Sure i was a total mark about it but once again it spoke about Bret's ability to make pro wrestling look real.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I think Vince always felt like Bret was a placeholder until he found his next Hogan which ended being Austin but that in retrospect he's in a better position to fully appreciate what Bret did for his company and brought to his product. Yes he was a placeholder but it's a job very few if anyone other than Bret could've pulled off. He was a total pro he was dependable and he had the ability to legitimize his product at a time when it's credibility took a serious hit. What he lacked in pop culture appeal he more than made up with his GOAT level storytelling ability in/out of the ring and his gift for making wrestling look real. He was the perfect guy to transition from Hogan to Austin As a kid/teen I remember when i first found out he had beaten Ric Flair for the belt my first reaction was "What? That mid-carder is now world champ how the mighty have fallen". Fast forward to 2 years later when he lost the belt to Backlund i remember thinking. "That guy was the greatest world champion ever" Sure i was a total mark about it but once again it spoke about Bret's ability to make pro wrestling look real.
On point review of his importance. I remember my uncle who did not like wrestling (because he saw it as a circus passing off as a sport) actually would watch Bret Hart because "that guy looks very real" defending the title.

I think as you said by WM 10 time people saw Bret as the real deal champion when he beat Yoko in comparison to the out of nowhere house show title win over Flair 2 years earlier.
 

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He really was the embodiment of the fighting champion and he would put the belt on the line at any time because that's what the champion does, at least in his eyes. I think it was a tough time for him as he was such a departure from the characters as he was arguably the most popular WWF guy from late 92 to 96, yet he had to step aside for Yoko being champ, then the Hogan debacle and back to Yoko with the Lex Express as top face, then the Diesel disaster. Vince really wanted other guys to be the next Hogan, but in the end he had to concede the fans wanted Bret all along.
 

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Bret Hart is the greatest of all time. So he is correct this time.
 
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There is a old story about Bret
Back in the 80s he had a match with this jobber from around that time, by the end of the match , Vince was so convinced that he had found the next big thing that he rushed to offer the guy a contract.
However , Bret was not in the guys next three matches and the true extent of his talent was revealed to be almost non existent and Bret carried the match from start to finish
Much like his match with Bulldog at Summerslam
Bulldog was on a come down from crack that night and two to three minutes into the match decides to tell Bret
“Bret , I’m fucked”
So Bret carried the match and people to this day call it one of the all time greats when it comes to matches.

Now,we fast forward to today
Roman Reigns vs Undertaker
Worst match ever at Mania
Why?
Because taker was injured and Roman had no idea how to carry the match
If that was Bret
It would have still been an instant classic
Same with Rollins
How many people has he put on the injured list?
Compared to I dunno
Bret himself
Double digits vs 0

I can see why Bret is considered one of the greatest champs of all time
He was a work horse and clean as a whistle
His record speaks for itself
 

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There is a old story about Bret
Back in the 80s he had a match with this jobber from around that time, by the end of the match , Vince was so convinced that he had found the next big thing that he rushed to offer the guy a contract.
However , Bret was not in the guys next three matches and the true extent of his talent was revealed to be almost non existent and Bret carried the match from start to finish
Much like his match with Bulldog at Summerslam
Bulldog was on a come down from crack that night and two to three minutes into the match decides to tell Bret
“Bret , I’m fucked”
So Bret carried the match and people to this day call it one of the all time greats when it comes to matches.

Now,we fast forward to today
Roman Reigns vs Undertaker
Worst match ever at Mania
Why?
Because taker was injured and Roman had no idea how to carry the match
If that was Bret
It would have still been an instant classic
Same with Rollins
How many people has he put on the injured list?
Compared to I dunno
Bret himself
Double digits vs 0

I can see why Bret is considered one of the greatest champs of all time
He was a work horse and clean as a whistle
His record speaks for itself
Tom Magee i think you are on about.its on the network now that.holy grail i think they call it
 
Banksy
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Tom Magee i think you are on about.its on the network now that.holy grail i think they call it
Awesome , I’ll need to add that to my watch list for tonight ☺

I’m sure Tom Magee is the guy but I can’t be sure until I see the match again.
I found it online years ago but it wasn’t a great copy at times so it would be nice to see it crystal clear
 

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Awesome , I’ll need to add that to my watch list for tonight ☺

I’m sure Tom Magee is the guy but I can’t be sure until I see the match again.
I found it online years ago but it wasn’t a great copy at times so it would be nice to see it crystal clear
To your point though yeah Bret made others look great.lot of wrestlers had their best matches against Bret and its no coincidence
 

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Bret is one of best ever. Top 5 worker of all time, developed into a phenomenal promo late in his career. Got Austin on the map at WM 13, basically completely was responsible for the Mr. Mcmahon character that Austin benefited from too. You could argue Bret Hart was responsible for the Attitude era getting off the ground. WCW misusing him was painful to watch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Their clash of philosophies was what made it work so well.
Yeah that whole run between 93-97 is a drama in itself how the two evolved. HBK in 92 at Survivor Series compared to HBK at WM 12 compared to Survivor Series 97 you couldn't even write lol beforehand it got so crazy. Then you got Hart who stayed the same, yet got turned on by fans in USA for heels. No one could see 97 happening with Hart and Austin in 1992-4 with Hart's rise.
 

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Bret is one of best ever. Top 5 worker of all time, developed into a phenomenal promo late in his career. Got Austin on the map at WM 13, basically completely was responsible for the Mr. Mcmahon character that Austin benefited from too. You could argue Bret Hart was responsible for the Attitude era getting off the ground. WCW misusing him was painful to watch.
Sort of. It was Vince's idea to turn Bret, Bret initially didn't want to do it. The old man deserves some credit for having the foresight that Bret's character needed to be refreshed. But both Bret and Vince didn't really conceive of the attitude era that we eventually got, it happened organically. Bret didn't like the direction of the non-wrestling and the sexual and over the line stuff, and Vince thought he was initially going to be the face coming out of Montreal. The Attitude Era was somewhat organic and not a plan by anyone per se.
 
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