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Ok, if that's the case... why did these NPW shows in the US not sell so well?

NJPW in California - G1 Special... 2,300
G1 Climax 29 - Dallas 4,800

New Beginnings Tour -
Tampa -800
Nashville -560
Durham - 637
maimi -525
Atlanta - 825

Or the other people say that the "bullet Club / Elite" sold the venue.... which is true too. NJPW helped, Bullet Club/Elite helped. But so did ROH itself. The promotion has been growing for 18 years, and this was a big moment for the company.

I'm not going to bicker back and forth on who is better... but don't kid yourself that Impact is "way ahead" of ROH.
Lol don't kid yourself to not want to believe Impact is way bigger than ROH when Impact gets better viewership, better attendance, Impact plus has more subscribers than Honorclub, And Impact is actually profitable while ROH isn't.

Now to your attendance crap NJPW were barely drawing 200-400 people in the U.S on average before the pandemic

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The latest edition of the The Wrestling Observer Newsletter reports that NJPW has had some disappointing attendance numbers with their recent shows, particularly the New Beginning Tour in the US. The tour was reportedly a ‘huge disappointment’ in regards to crowd size. The attendances that were announced were the building totals. In Japan, they usually announce the amount of people who paid. Paid numbers were even lower than announced.

Nashville was said to be closer to 400, which was one of the lowest paid crowds in recent years for New Japan. It was reportedly the most unsuccessful tour they’ve run. The show in Atlanta, which was the last one, on February 1 had 855 fans.



ROH were barely drawing 200 people at their shows






Impact were regularly drawing 1,000-2,000 people to their shows which ROH hasn't come close to doing. Impact in Mexico drew 2,000-2,200 people earlier this year











Sold 3k tickets to BFG last year




ROH hasn't done anywhere close to these numbers so Impact are infinitely bigger than ROH in every cotagory there is. Impact also outdrew NJPW in ATL 3 months ago. NJPW only drew 855 people while Impact drew 1,500 people.
 

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Sure... we'll chalk it up to "Luck" .... I do agree agree it's unlikely to happen again any time soon, but also no one is even running shows with live audiences.... and Ring of Honor isn't running shows now.
not sure what you're getting at but your statement has zero relation to what we're talking about. Now has nothing to do with then
 

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I do think if Impact wants to be taken serious they need a better image and presentation and how they story tell. Its been to many cheesy segments. I assume that Impact is about to get a shake up though.
 

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Impact still has a pretty big world wide fallowing. It might still be the #2 promotion in the world.
 

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Impact need to raid NWA now that they've shut down. Eli Drake, James Storm, Nick Aldis, Royce Isaacs, Thunder Rosa, Allysin Kay etc. could be brought in. A lot of them have history with the company. They also need to look forward.

Warhorse and Danhausen would fit in well at Impact. I want to see them both on tv, they do comedy stuff but they do it well. Victor Benjamin, Taynara Conti, Schaff, Mil Muertes (With Karlee Perez), Rebel Kel, Rhett Giddins, Quinn McKay, Moonshine Mantell, Ganon Jones Jr. and Duke Davis and Channing Decker, plus a bunch of the WWE releases and they could build a pretty strong roster.
 

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If I may add my two cents on this Impact/ROH debate.....I attend events for both companies when either company is in the New York/New Jersey/Philadelphia area and follow each company weekly. Suffice to say I am a fan of both companies and hope both succeed. Right now today Impact is ahead of ROH for two reasons: they are still running shows and staying in the consumers eyes. Having a regular weekly show rather than what is a clip show every week is a more pleasing viewing experience. Now with that said we don't have access to ratings for either show so it's tough to back up this claim with actual evidence. I did see it pointed out earlier in this thread and it is true that Impact does have more lucrative international tv deals, especially in India.

The second case is in turning profits. Again, this is a hard one to prove because we only have what comes out in the dirtsheets rather than actual public financial reports like WWE has. While ROH was a money loser every year until Sinclair Broadcasting bought them, they have turned small profits most years until this last one. Impact prior to Anthem taking over had lost tons of money for years but last year they were turning a small profit. I'm sure not selling tickets isn't helping either company right now.

I do think Impact is ahead or ROH right now but I would think it's closer than people want to admit. Both companies seem to hit a ceiling that they can't breakthrough before losing momentum and falling back. The fact that both companies are offer some big money contracts now (Marty Scurll making 7 figures) (dirtsheet articles claiming Impact is offering competitive or better offers to recently released WWE talent) is hopefully a good sign for both companies.
 

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Lol don't kid yourself to not want to believe Impact is way bigger than ROH when Impact gets better viewership, better attendance, Impact plus has more subscribers than Honorclub, And Impact is actually profitable while ROH isn't.

Now to your attendance crap NJPW were barely drawing 200-400 people in the U.S on average before the pandemic

SHARE ON FACEBOOK



The latest edition of the The Wrestling Observer Newsletter reports that NJPW has had some disappointing attendance numbers with their recent shows, particularly the New Beginning Tour in the US. The tour was reportedly a ‘huge disappointment’ in regards to crowd size. The attendances that were announced were the building totals. In Japan, they usually announce the amount of people who paid. Paid numbers were even lower than announced.

Nashville was said to be closer to 400, which was one of the lowest paid crowds in recent years for New Japan. It was reportedly the most unsuccessful tour they’ve run. The show in Atlanta, which was the last one, on February 1 had 855 fans.



ROH were barely drawing 200 people at their shows






Impact were regularly drawing 1,000-2,000 people to their shows which ROH hasn't come close to doing. Impact in Mexico drew 2,000-2,200 people earlier this year











Sold 3k tickets to BFG last year




ROH hasn't done anywhere close to these numbers so Impact are infinitely bigger than ROH in every cotagory there is. Impact also outdrew NJPW in ATL 3 months ago. NJPW only drew 855 people while Impact drew 1,500 people.

ROH runs 40 events @ 44K tickets sold for the year. @ ave 55$ ticket = 2.4 M (17K at MSG)

Impact runs 40 events @ 30K tickets sold for the year @ ave 30$ Ticket = 900K

These numbers are generous on Impacts side. I know most side shows and touring TV tapings mostly do less than 1K. Impact runs TV tapings in my area and they shoot 4-6 episodes over 2 days. "Tickets are priced as follows: Floor Seats - $40 per night, or BOTH nights for $60! Bleacher Seats - $20 per night, or BOTH nights for $30! All seating is General Admission" ...let alone free tickets given out. They've had a handful of shows with attendance over 1K, but most are well under 1K.

ROH tickets were like 35-100$ a seat in 2019... which is why ticket sales were down. I assume the MSG tickets were even more expensive,but didn't factor that in. On that of that.... ROH has been averaging 40-45K tickets sold per year... the last 3-4 years. ROH averaged about 675-700 per regular show in 2019... which is very low compared to years past. (700*39 shows = 27K plus 17K at MSG = 44k for the year.

In terms of Impact plus having more subscribers than HonorClub is BS ... because neither company has released subscriber numbers.

This is only Live event profits... and there are a lot more that goes into it... but dont act like Impact is raking in the money. I know multiple people on the ROH roster making well over 6 figures, and these were deals when business starting down down in 2019. I'm pretty sure if they were in any financial trouble, they wouldn't be paying huge contracts. I know impact is not paying their top talent anywhere near this.
 

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ROH runs 40 events @ 44K tickets sold for the year. @ ave 55$ ticket = 2.4 M (17K at MSG)

Impact runs 40 events @ 30K tickets sold for the year @ ave 30$ Ticket = 900K

These numbers are generous on Impacts side. I know most side shows and touring TV tapings mostly do less than 1K. Impact runs TV tapings in my area and they shoot 4-6 episodes over 2 days. "Tickets are priced as follows: Floor Seats - $40 per night, or BOTH nights for $60! Bleacher Seats - $20 per night, or BOTH nights for $30! All seating is General Admission" ...let alone free tickets given out. They've had a handful of shows with attendance over 1K, but most are well under 1K.

ROH tickets were like 35-100$ a seat in 2019... which is why ticket sales were down. I assume the MSG tickets were even more expensive,but didn't factor that in. On that of that.... ROH has been averaging 40-45K tickets sold per year... the last 3-4 years. ROH averaged about 675-700 per regular show in 2019... which is very low compared to years past. (700*39 shows = 27K plus 17K at MSG = 44k for the year.

In terms of Impact plus having more subscribers than HonorClub is BS ... because neither company has released subscriber numbers.

This is only Live event profits... and there are a lot more that goes into it... but dont act like Impact is raking in the money. I know multiple people on the ROH roster making well over 6 figures, and these were deals when business starting down down in 2019. I'm pretty sure if they were in any financial trouble, they wouldn't be paying huge contracts. I know impact is not paying their top talent anywhere near this.
Impact runs over 60 or more dates and sells 1,000-2,000 tickets at $150 and sold 3k tickets to BFG last year. That MSG ahow was because of NJPW NOT ROH so bringing that up for a basis for your argument isn't helping you.

Impact outsold ROH last year on tickets sold. ROH were barely doing 200-400 people while Impact regularly doing 1k people for tv tapings and 3k people for PPVs

🤣 Impact tapings were regularly drawing 1k people just like Windsor as a matter of fact they sold put the Asylum with 1,300 tickets for $150-300


https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/adnqu7

And sold out BFG at the same price of $+150-300 and still sold 3k




ROH tickets were dirt cheap last year at only $20-40 because they couldn't draw big crowds.

Most of Impact's shows were over 1k while ROH's were well below that.

Heres Impact with 1k in Windsor last year




Except Len Asper said Impact plus has over 100k subscribers




The app hes talking about is Impact plus so you're wrong Impact plus has more subscribers than Honorclub.

Except Moose, Eddie Edwards, The North , and The Rascalz are all getting paid upper 6 figures so again you're wrong. ROH isn't in any financial trouble? Ok








Yeah ROH are in BIG FINANCIAL trouble and are a money pit and are barely alive.


Also Impact are offering bigger money to their young talent to re-sign and to the guys WWE released to sign




Yeah you're done with all of this evidence against you.
 

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Would like the show to have a better presentation. Even years ago when they were at the impact zone that sucked. A similar presentation and camera angles to AEW and WWE.

It comes across as too indie. The company must be doing ok to be in negotiations with Gallows and Anderson, considering what they were making in WWE.
 

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Impact runs over 60 or more dates and sells 1,000-2,000 tickets at $150 and sold 3k tickets to BFG last year. That MSG ahow was because of NJPW NOT ROH so bringing that up for a basis for your argument isn't helping you.

Impact outsold ROH last year on tickets sold. ROH were barely doing 200-400 people while Impact regularly doing 1k people for tv tapings and 3k people for PPVs

🤣 Impact tapings were regularly drawing 1k people just like Windsor as a matter of fact they sold put the Asylum with 1,300 tickets for $150-300


https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/adnqu7

And sold out BFG at the same price of $+150-300 and still sold 3k




ROH tickets were dirt cheap last year at only $20-40 because they couldn't draw big crowds.

Most of Impact's shows were over 1k while ROH's were well below that.

Heres Impact with 1k in Windsor last year




Except Len Asper said Impact plus has over 100k subscribers




The app hes talking about is Impact plus so you're wrong Impact plus has more subscribers than Honorclub.

Except Moose, Eddie Edwards, The North , and The Rascalz are all getting paid upper 6 figures so again you're wrong. ROH isn't in any financial trouble? Ok








Yeah ROH are in BIG FINANCIAL trouble and are a money pit and are barely alive.


Also Impact are offering bigger money to their young talent to re-sign and to the guys WWE released to sign




Yeah you're done with all of this evidence against you.
Sure... your right. The average ticket price impact sold is 150$ ...when i clearly quoted Impact ticket prices, and that you can attend for 15$.

Also, i'm sure your right... the Rascals are getting paid upper 6 figures each.

I am done.
 

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No one not named the WWE is really making money off house shows.

Impact is making money off its international tv deals. Its been reported that they are huge in India and Africa.
 

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Impact need to raid NWA now that they've shut down. Eli Drake, James Storm, Nick Aldis, Royce Isaacs, Thunder Rosa, Allysin Kay etc. could be brought in. A lot of them have history with the company. They also need to look forward.

Warhorse and Danhausen would fit in well at Impact. I want to see them both on tv, they do comedy stuff but they do it well. Victor Benjamin, Taynara Conti, Schaff, Mil Muertes (With Karlee Perez), Rebel Kel, Rhett Giddins, Quinn McKay, Moonshine Mantell, Ganon Jones Jr. and Duke Davis and Channing Decker, plus a bunch of the WWE releases and they could build a pretty strong roster.
Thunder Rosa would be a great add from the NWA. As would Danhausen and Warhorse from the indies. I'm all for bringing in 2 or 3 different talents per taping. Keep it fresh. If they get over they can always bring them back.
 

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No one not named the WWE is really making money off house shows.

Impact is making money off its international tv deals. Its been reported that they are huge in India and Africa.
WWE actually has lost money the last few years on house shows. That's an even bigger sign of them losing interest of casual wrestling fans than the declining ratings.

You are right about Impact making big money on their India tv deal. I'm not sure African tv deal is anywhere near as lucrative.

This whole argument between ROH and Impact is dumb. It's been going on for years and always was dumb. We don't have access to enough facts to really tell. The only way to really know would be the companies to release their financials and that isn't going to happen until they legally have to.
 

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Sure... your right. The average ticket price impact sold is 150$ ...when i clearly quoted Impact ticket prices, and that you can attend for 15$.

Also, i'm sure your right... the Rascals are getting paid upper 6 figures each.

I am done.
Actually you didn't and you got proven wrong time after time especially when you lied and claimed that ROH wasn't in financial trouble 😂.

Bye and all their top stars are getting paid upper 6 figures not just The Rascalz







You're dismissed and you've been embarrassed with evidence in EVERY post I made meanwhile you showed 0 evidence to back up the trash you posted because none of it is true.
 

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I know the TNA belt thing was Mooses idea but the way Impact has been promoting it more than him does anyone think they plan on having a bigger storyline with this ? Or i guess it could just be a story leading of to that TNA themed ppv that was canceled because of the virus. They are for sure doing more with this and the belt than just Moose though.

Has it been scheduled yet ?
 

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I know the TNA belt thing was Mooses idea but the way Impact has been promoting it more than him does anyone think they plan on having a bigger storyline with this ? Or i guess it could just be a story leading of to that TNA themed ppv that was canceled because of the virus. They are for sure doing more with this and the belt than just Moose though.

Has it been scheduled yet ?
I think it's was angling to an Elgin vs Moose rivalry eventually, with Elgin gone...it makes sense to put the belt on him, he deserves it, rounds off arc path it was on, just early.
 

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I think it's was angling to an Elgin vs Moose rivalry eventually, with Elgin gone...it makes sense to put the belt on him, he deserves it, rounds off arc path it was on, just early.
They should put the Impact logo on the tna belt lol. Way nicer
 

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I know the TNA belt thing was Mooses idea but the way Impact has been promoting it more than him does anyone think they plan on having a bigger storyline with this ? Or i guess it could just be a story leading of to that TNA themed ppv that was canceled because of the virus. They are for sure doing more with this and the belt than just Moose though.

Has it been scheduled yet ?
Yea I'm beginning to think there may be more to this. A split roster leading to a TNA vs Impact feud? They could use the injection of a bunch of new guys to do this. I think Eric Young would definitely be the type of guy very pro-TNA for example. Is Low-Ki still with MLW, he would be pro-TNA since he was there when it started in 2002.
 

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Yea I'm beginning to think there may be more to this. A split roster leading to a TNA vs Impact feud? They could use the injection of a bunch of new guys to do this. I think Eric Young would definitely be the type of guy very pro-TNA for example. Is Low-Ki still with MLW, he would be pro-TNA since he was there when it started in 2002.

but lol neither brand seems like they would be heels
 
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