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I give him a big ZERO.

This trash shouldn't even have been employed after 2008.
Funny when he may just have more personality and mic skills than basically the entire roster. In no way is miz trash. As a wrestler I can see why people dont feel him though, but i think hes solid enough nothing too outstanding in the ring. Look/presence-8/10 In ring ability-6/10 Charisma 9 Mic skills 9
 

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Funny when he may just have more personality and mic skills than basically the entire roster. In no way is miz trash. As a wrestler I can see why people dont feel him though, but i think hes solid enough nothing too outstanding in the ring. Look/presence-8/10 In ring ability-6/10 Charisma 9 Mic skills 9
True.

He's tolerable on the mic, better than Seth Rollins, but I can never see him as a "wrestler" or a serious competitor no matter how hard they push him. I can't get invested in any of his matches.
 

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His look is objectively obviously not better than Cesaro. Cesaro is "natty" shredded and a fucking beast.
His ring work, OF COURSE is NOOOOOOOOOOT better than Cesaro. Cesaro works circles around him all day every day.
Charisma is debatable. Charisma is more than just mic work, it's presence. It's aura.

The only thing he does better than Cesaro without question that we can all agree on is Mic work. This is the only reasonable opinion on this subject.
Cesaro looks like a caw from wwe 2k, so generic. And he doesn’t have any charisma. And ring work is the least important, it got Cesaro nowhere.
 

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Cesaro looks like a caw from wwe 2k, so generic. And he doesn’t have any charisma. And ring work is the least important, it got Cesaro nowhere.
He's in great shape, bullshit.

And yes, he does have charisma.
You're going to try to argue that this guy doesn't have charisma? That he doesn't connect with the crowd? Complete horse shit.

And finally, NO. Ring work is NOT the least important. If Ring Work was the least important on a FUCKING WRESTLING SHOW, we'd have literally nothing but promos and character work and no wrestling. At that point it's just a shitty soap opera for man babies.

In fact!
 

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Discussion Starter #25
Yep, Cesaro DOES have SOME charisma. Otherwise, he wouldn't have been able to get over with crowds multiple times whenever it looked like he was getting a good push in singles competition as a babyface (like he did in early-2014, mid-2015, and most of 2016).

Cesaro would be coming out to crickets for pretty much his ENTIRE career if he truly had "no charisma."

Anyway, I appreciate those of you who are helping out by rating The Miz as an overall talent :)
 

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His look is objectively obviously not better than Cesaro. Cesaro is "natty" shredded and a fucking beast.
His ring work, OF COURSE is NOOOOOOOOOOT better than Cesaro. Cesaro works circles around him all day every day.
Charisma is debatable. Charisma is more than just mic work, it's presence. It's aura.

The only thing he does better than Cesaro without question that we can all agree on is Mic work. This is the only reasonable opinion on this subject.
In any era, in any company, Cesaro would be way higher on the card than The Miz, but this isn't just any company, it's a variety show for soccer moms, or at least it was for the bulk of these two guys' runs.
I don't hate The Miz but him main eventing WM was a damn travesty.

Inviato dal mio SM-A405FN utilizzando Tapatalk
 

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Ah damn, I fell off on these! I've just added my scores to the Lacey and Sheamus thread, and I'll go through and do some more over the next couple of days- I think I saw some AEW ones to do as well.

Anyway, this is a Miz thread not a Cesaro thread, so getting this back on topic:

Look/Presence: 7/10

His look is not great, whether we go with the odd fashion choices of early Miz or the more generic wrestling attire of current Miz. Although he has improved his physique over the years, he actually has a little muscle definition rather than just looking like an average dude. Still kinda average though. What saves him here is the presence part- he has always carried himself like a big deal- whether jobbing to the Boogeyman in 2006, mixing it up with Cena and Rock in the main event of Wrestlemania, or doing his thing on Miz TV today.

In-Ring: 7/10

He's in that "solid hand" category these days. He was a terrible wrestler when he started, his charisma and mic skills essentially saved his job back then. But he worked really hard to get good at wrestling, and on occasion has really brought in. I remember going to a Raw house show in 2013, and Miz had the MOTN in a street fight with Dean Ambrose. In 2016, he had a couple of stand out PPV matches- one being a Fatal 4 Way at Extreme Rules sharing the ring with Cesaro, Owens and Zayn. The other being the title vs. career match with Dolph Ziggler at No Mercy- I consider that to be the best match of both men's careers, damn near a classic. But Miz hasn't had that kind of form in a while. He has generally good, acceptable matches now. If he was still in his 2016 form, he'd rate a little higher.

Charisma: 9/10

Easily one of the most charismatic people on the WWE roster. Both in a wrestling performance sense, and just generally as a personality. I mean, how did this douchey average looking loudmouth marry a bombshell like Maryse? Charisma out the wazoo. Really, the only thing stopping him getting a perfect score is his inability to play both sides- he's incredibly unconvincing as a babyface. One of the best heels of the last 15 years though.

Mic Skills: 9/10

There's a reason Miz does a TON of Miz TV segments these days- he's damn good at it. Whether it's to get himself over, or a feud he's in, or to act as a proxy for weaker talkers, Miz is an incredible asset on the mic. A long way from the dude that screwed up as the Diva Search host on Raw, Miz has a lot of range in his talking ability. He can be funny, serious, intense, fearful, braggadocious, he can pretty much do it all. Except play babyface.
 

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Look/Presence: 9/10. He's got a good look, he looks like a Star. The same people who say 'the look' doesn't matter, "wrestlers dont need to be bodybuilders" are suddenly holding it against The Miz that he's not a jacked Adonis

In-Ring Ability: 7.5/10. Its his weakest area, but he's still capable of producing a great match.

Charisma: 10/10. Easily one of the only people in this Era that has charisma. And no just being over doesn't equal charisma, Cesaro for example is not charismatic.

Mic Skills: 10/10. He's one of the only current people that should score more than 2 in this category. By far and away is one of the only great promos in the WWE and indeed in the entire modern Pro Wrestling business. In an Era where everyone else cuts promos that all sound the exact same with the same lack of emotion or anything to them Miz actually knows how to cut a promo.

he can pretty much do it all. Except play babyface.
Claims like this annoy me. Because Miz is one of those people that fans blame for his booking. If Miz is booked like shit then its somehow The Miz's fault and speaks to him failing. I mean look at his last Babyface run, in particular his promos on Shane during their feud, and his Babyface fire in their matches. Even his promos on Bray Wyatt after Bray went after his family. How can you say Miz cant play a Babyface with instances like that out there?

The only reason he failed as a Bbayface this time around was because his entire Babyface run was a burial. He was buried by Shane in the kind of feud that if you put Rollins, Owens, Cesaro, etc in Miz's spot there'd be riots about it, thats how badly booked and ultimately buried Miz was in that feud. Then he jobbed to Nakamura. Then he was buried by Mr. Rogers Bray Wyatt with one move. As a Babyface Miz didn't get to win anything, didn't get to do anything, didn't get presented like a serious threat even once. He was the one Babyface on the roster that was booked like a hapless geek. Miz held up his end and delivered, but once again the McMahons did what they do best and buried him repeatedly for daring to get over and be entertaining.
 

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Claims like this annoy me. Because Miz is one of those people that fans blame for his booking. If Miz is booked like shit then its somehow The Miz's fault and speaks to him failing. I mean look at his last Babyface run, in particular his promos on Shane during their feud, and his Babyface fire in their matches. Even his promos on Bray Wyatt after Bray went after his family. How can you say Miz cant play a Babyface with instances like that out there?

The only reason he failed as a Bbayface this time around was because his entire Babyface run was a burial. He was buried by Shane in the kind of feud that if you put Rollins, Owens, Cesaro, etc in Miz's spot there'd be riots about it, thats how badly booked and ultimately buried Miz was in that feud. Then he jobbed to Nakamura. Then he was buried by Mr. Rogers Bray Wyatt with one move. As a Babyface Miz didn't get to win anything, didn't get to do anything, didn't get presented like a serious threat even once. He was the one Babyface on the roster that was booked like a hapless geek. Miz held up his end and delivered, but once again the McMahons did what they do best and buried him repeatedly for daring to get over and be entertaining.
Zero to do with his booking for me, when scoring him I actually wasn't thinking of any of that, but I had his 2013 babyface run in my mind, where he feuded with Wade Barrett over the IC title and had Ric Flair as his mentor. He adopted the Figure Four as his finishing move and got considerably better in the ring around this time. He's absolutely fine when it comes to intensity and I guess what would be termed "babyface fire".

For me, it's strictly a personality thing. The cocky shit talker essentially IS Miz, and to me seeing him play for humility and vulnerability always seemed completely insincere. It's like if you run into your high school bully in some kind of adult/professional setting, and they're more mature and cordial towards you, but you know they're just putting on an act to keep up appearances. That's Miz as the good guy.
 

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Discussion Starter #31 (Edited)
Charisma: 10/10. Easily one of the only people in this Era that has charisma. And no just being over doesn't equal charisma, Cesaro for example is not charismatic
Nah, the ability to get over (multiple times throughout one's career) with different crowds indicate how charismatic a wrestler is. That definitely describes Cesaro since he managed to connect with crowds for decent periods whenever it looked like he was going to receive a good push as a babyface.

Plus, there's been plenty of instances over the years where he's been able to get fans in attendance hyped and invested in his matches because he's such an excellent wrestler (which is demonstrated by multiple clips available that I COULD upload later on).

Cesaro DOES have SOME charisma. In fact, he's really underrated in the charisma department. His only/big weakness is his lack of mic skills.

Cesaro nerver had big pops, only minimal ones, he never had pops atleast as big as Ziggler used to get a few years ago, he only got a few cheers.
That's mostly true, which is why I consider Dolph Ziggler to be (even) more charismatic than Cesaro since crowds were hotter for him when he was really over on different periods.

I still believe that Cesaro is reasonably charismatic since he's been able to get crowds to care about him as a solo competitor in the past (even if most of his positive/vocal crowd reactions were somewhat mild).
 

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Nah, the ability to get over (multiple times throughout one's career) with different crowds indicate how charismatic a wrestler is. That definitely describes Cesaro since he managed to connect with crowds for decent periods whenever it looked like he was going to receive a good push as a babyface.

Plus, there's been plenty of instances over the years where he's been able to get fans in attendance hyped and invested in his matches because he's such an excellent wrestler (which is demonstrated by multiple clips available that I COULD upload later on).

Cesaro DOES have SOME charisma. In fact, he's really underrated in the charisma department. His only/big weakness is his lack of mic skills.
Cesaro nerver had big pops, only minimal ones, he never had pops atleast as big as Ziggler used to get a few years ago, he only got a few cheers.
 

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Look/Presence: 9/10. He's got a good look, he looks like a Star. The same people who say 'the look' doesn't matter, "wrestlers dont need to be bodybuilders" are suddenly holding it against The Miz that he's not a jacked Adonis

In-Ring Ability: 7.5/10. Its his weakest area, but he's still capable of producing a great match.

Charisma: 10/10. Easily one of the only people in this Era that has charisma. And no just being over doesn't equal charisma, Cesaro for example is not charismatic.

Mic Skills: 10/10. He's one of the only current people that should score more than 2 in this category. By far and away is one of the only great promos in the WWE and indeed in the entire modern Pro Wrestling business. In an Era where everyone else cuts promos that all sound the exact same with the same lack of emotion or anything to them Miz actually knows how to cut a promo.



Claims like this annoy me. Because Miz is one of those people that fans blame for his booking. If Miz is booked like shit then its somehow The Miz's fault and speaks to him failing. I mean look at his last Babyface run, in particular his promos on Shane during their feud, and his Babyface fire in their matches. Even his promos on Bray Wyatt after Bray went after his family. How can you say Miz cant play a Babyface with instances like that out there?

The only reason he failed as a Bbayface this time around was because his entire Babyface run was a burial. He was buried by Shane in the kind of feud that if you put Rollins, Owens, Cesaro, etc in Miz's spot there'd be riots about it, thats how badly booked and ultimately buried Miz was in that feud. Then he jobbed to Nakamura. Then he was buried by Mr. Rogers Bray Wyatt with one move. As a Babyface Miz didn't get to win anything, didn't get to do anything, didn't get presented like a serious threat even once. He was the one Babyface on the roster that was booked like a hapless geek. Miz held up his end and delivered, but once again the McMahons did what they do best and buried him repeatedly for daring to get over and be entertaining.
Exactly he was very over in his feud with Shane and has recieved praise, but after he lost, all of a sudden people started saying he sucks, his moves look weak as a babyface , not convincing, cause Meltzer started saying that. He was still over with the crowds, but the smarks said he sucks.
 

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Nah, the ability to get over (multiple times throughout one's career) with different crowds indicate how charismatic a wrestler is. That definitely describes Cesaro since he managed to connect with crowds for decent periods whenever it looked like he was going to receive a good push as a babyface.

Plus, there's been plenty of instances over the years where he's been able to get fans in attendance hyped and invested in his matches because he's such an excellent wrestler (which is demonstrated by multiple clips available that I COULD upload later on).

Cesaro DOES have SOME charisma. In fact, he's really underrated in the charisma department. His only/big weakness is his lack of mic skills.



That's mostly true, which is why I consider Dolph Ziggler to be (even) more charismatic than Cesaro since crowds were hotter for him when he was really over on different periods.

I still believe that Cesaro is reasonably charismatic since he's been able to get crowds to care about him as a solo competitor in the past (even if most of his positive/vocal crowd reactions were somewhat mild).
So basically we're going to say every Pro Wrestler ever is really charismatic? Everyone gets over to some degree, its rare that a wrestler doesn't get over with the fans. Some people get over with the fans simply because of ring work, or a catchphrase, or whatever else. You dont need charisma to get over, especially thesedays when most of the audience jerks off over meaningless work rate and hates anyone who actually has charisma, personality and real, genuine promo skills.
 

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Looks/presence- 6.5/10
I think while his look compliments the character of the chicken-shit heel, he’s not a guy that screams “I can kick your ass”. With that being said he’s not a cruiser weight and the way he carries himself is that of a star. He’s not ripped or shredded the way Vince likes, but he’s not Kevin Owens tier either. Overall 6.5/10

In Ring Ability- 6.5/10
Again not a guy that screams in-ring general but definitely capable of complimenting other superstars and keeping up with superstars who are great in the ring. From 2016 on he has def been decent in the ring. The fatal 4 way for the IC title in 2016, the Ziggler series in 2016, and the Rollins match for IC title in 2018 are great examples of what I just said above. Did Miz carry those matches? No but he did enough to keep up and compliment. Miz is a guy who has gone from bad in the ring to passable and finally to decent.
Overall 6.5/10

Charisma 8.5/10
There’s a reason this guy gets TV time even when he’s irrelevant. It’s because he’s great at getting segments and programs over. Even those his baby face runs have failed (mostly due to very poor booking) he was turned face largely when he was getting face reactions as a heel. Overall 8.5/10

Mic Skills 9.5/10
Probably the best on the mic for the current roster today besides Samoa Joe. Today’s current superstars largely cannot talk but are great in the ring. In the past it was those who could talk were those who main evented. And I feel that’s the way it should go back to being. Miz is leaps and bounds above the current roster in terms of mic skills. He gets Miz Tv segments weekly because of it. I’m not even gonna name good promos. He carries basically every segment he’s in for the current roster. Overall 9.5/10
 

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Look/Presence: 6
In-ring ability: 5
Charisma: 7
Mic skills: 8

Miz should have never won the WWE title honestly. He is a good talent but never had the tools to be a real wrestling star. I give him credit for his reality tv shows/movies and I think that's where he should have stayed.
 
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