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On smaller wrestlers not drawing:

Anyone who thinks that talents like AJ Styles are too small to draw big money are fooling themselves and are truly living in the enhanced 80’s. Or, they’ve never had their ass whipped by a smaller guy especially amateur wrestlers who are under 200 pounds. Stars are not judged by pounds and inches but by talent, charisma and athleticism.
Not rocket science people. And this is coming from a former VP of Talent relations and a damn good one at that.
 

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Your argument is totally off base. As a big boxing fan Mayweather didn't start getting recognized in the public until he adapted his Money Mayweather persona. He is one of the most skillfull boxers of all time and most find him boring because he is a defensive first fighter. The only reason Mayweather is a big draw is because of his persona and people really want to pay to see him lose which won't happen because he is that damn good. Now maybe if these smaller indy guys adpoted a personality like Mayweather has shown to draw mainstream attention they would be a draw too instead of worrying about crazy spots and 5 star matches which don't draw to the causals like Mayweather has.

Another example of a small skillful boxer is Tim Bradly but the causal fans do like care about him because his personality is dry and he is not a PPV draw because of it. Me personally I have no problem with small wrestlers long as they entertain me. Some of my all time favorites that are small are Bret Hart, Owen Hart, Shane Douglas, Mr. Perfect, Jericho, Raven, Benoit I can go on and on. However the difference between those guys I just named compared to these small Indy guys many praise of this forum is to go along with good work rate those guys also have a character and go mic skills besides Benoit to get the crowd to invest.
Nobody is saying that the smaller wrestlers will draw and should be pushed without having charisma that the fans can connect to but that's exactly the same for bigger wrestlers aswell.

In the WWE though even smaller guys or simply anyone who don't fit the big American male who are over have a hard time because of predetermined stereotypes that are held by the guys who make the decisions of who he wants to be a star.
 

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"Or, they’ve never had their ass whipped by a smaller guy especially amateur wrestlers who are under 200 pounds."

His statement is a bit off. A 300 lb professionally trained athlete in a certain discipline is going to destroy a 200 lb professionally trained athlete in the same discipline. Just 20 lbs is a monumental size disparity.
 
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For those staring look at ufc and boxing that shows little guys can draw I got a question would you geeks be ok. With Ambrose vs. Styles for a WWE light heavyweight title and not being allowed to compete for the World Heavyweight Title?
 

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I know nothing of that first video and the second video is two guys from different disciplines.

Looked it up. I knew who Fedor was but only heard the other guy's name but knew little about him. Fedor has a godly record and the other has only won 3 of his 7 fights (one of the wins was against Jose Canseco). That's like trying to prove a point by showing a clip of Bret Hart beating Khali.
 

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The last everyday roster members to have any legitimate impact on the product were Punk and Bryan. That should tell you enough about "small guys". Talent is talent and it's going to get over regardless of size, look, whatever the fuck. It's the main fundamental reason why Roman Reigns has been a disaster, while Punk/Bryan were purposely buried yet still kept forcing WWE's hand to push them.
 

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Smaller wrestlers can't draw. Of course. Explains why Bryan wasn't popular at all. :side:
Being popular and drawing aren't the same thing. Diesel was popular in 1995, and he drew shit.

Bryan...its hard to really say whether or not he was a draw due to his time in the main event being so short. Compared to WWE today, he may as well be Hulk Hogan, but if we're going for an objective standard, I'd say he was a bit of one. His segments did pretty well, ratings wise, and his merch sold. Dunno about house show attendance and such, though. Still, with the title, Raw was getting a lot more viewers than today, but as I said, its kind of unfair to compare the two.
 

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Being popular and drawing aren't the same thing. Diesel was popular in 1995, and he drew shit.

Bryan...its hard to really say whether or not he was a draw due to his time in the main event being so short. Compared to WWE today, he may as well be Hulk Hogan, but if we're going for an objective standard, I'd say he was a bit of one. His segments did pretty well, ratings wise, and his merch sold. Dunno about house show attendance and such, though. Still, with the title, Raw was getting a lot more viewers than today, but as I said, its kind of unfair to compare the two.
You can't base "drawing" on the traditional numbers anymore. Cena out-draws everybody in wrestling history, yet no one in their right mind is going to say he's more popular than Austin or Rock were.. WWE created an environment where they monopolize drawing to one or two guys and the rest aren't allowed to draw, then hit the audience over the head with those performers over and over and over and over again. Bryan drew IN SPITE of them.

I just look at the show as a whole. During Bryan's multiple rises to the top, the show was 10 times more interesting than it is right now. Even when he was in the midcard with Kane, he made those angles exciting and interesting too. The show actually felt like it had structure, as there was a guy getting universally cheered who's story the entire audience was invested in. Compared to today, where the top face is the most hated guy on the roster, and his feuds/angles are insomnia cures to the crowd.

Crowds were hot for Bryan, and in return, hot for the entire show, compared to today where if you hear an audible chant it's like "Holy shit, is that a chant? People are actually chanting??!!!" You can hear a pin drop during 90% of RAW.
 

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Nobody is saying that the smaller wrestlers will draw and should be pushed without having charisma that the fans can connect to but that's exactly the same for bigger wrestlers aswell.

In the WWE though even smaller guys or simply anyone who don't fit the big American male who are over have a hard time because of predetermined stereotypes that are held by the guys who make the decisions of who he wants to be a star.
It has nothing to do with who the WWE wants to be a star. Most of the guys the IWC praises are guys who work these so called 5 star matches and nothing else to offer down from character, mic skills and storytelling. No selling and high spots is not wrestling.
 

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http://wrestlingnews.co/jim-ross-on-the-main-event-of-fastlane-and-pat-pattersons-autobiography/

Anyone who thinks that talents like AJ Styles are too small to draw big money are fooling themselves and are truly living in the enhanced 80’s. Or, they’ve never had their ass whipped by a smaller guy especially amateur wrestlers who are under 200 pounds. Stars are not judged by pounds and inches but by talent, charisma and athleticism.

"
Who the hell is He to say what stars are judged by? Really. It's completely subjective to the viewer; there isn't a rule or anything. If someone doesn't think AJ Styles can beat Lesnar and/or outdraw Lesnar, then so be it. If enough people don't buy into a smaller guy being a legit star, then that fucking smaller guy isn't going to be a star. Again, so be it.
 

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It has nothing to do with who the WWE wants to be a star. Most of the guys the IWC praises are guys who work these so called 5 star matches and nothing else to offer down from character, mic skills and storytelling. No selling and high spots is not wrestling.
I find that opinion has been exaggerated so much on this forum, you can make your point without the usual "iwc want's this" or "all indie wrestlers have no mic skills, charisma and just have matches full of high spots with no selling" It's really boring and untrue.

Who are the guys actually in the WWE that people want pushed strongly that are not over?
 

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Im gonna disagree with JR...well maybe not, depending on your perspective.

Short guys can draw and can be great. But you have a harder job convincing fans that Spike Dudley is Heavyweight Champion, than you would convincing them that Ryback is. So with the smaller guys you better be damn good, and compensate for this deficiency!

Every single example of a smaller guy in here is someone that managed to do this. CM Punk, Bryan, Jericho etc etc.
 

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It has nothing to do with who the WWE wants to be a star. Most of the guys the IWC praises are guys who work these so called 5 star matches and nothing else to offer down from character, mic skills and storytelling. No selling and high spots is not wrestling.
I was watching Superbrawl III last night, and Chris Benoit virtually no-sold a superkick, something that people say is a product of our times. It's not.
 
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