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I remember that Seth Rollins was considered a good wrestler especially with his selling by many. I haven't been watching for a while but what happened?
 

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Cut the crap he does the same exact thing Seth did last night. Don’t use kayfabe broken ribs as an out. All those matches with Okada were 40 plus minutes of huge spot after huge spot with the same kind of selling you see everywhere now. The NXT guys same deal. And don’t get wrong I’m fine with it because it’s entertaining as hell but that’s so blatantly dishonest to praise Kenny in the same breath as trashing Seth. They’re so similar. Because one is Mr WWE and the other is the darling of the “cool indy scene”.
Ok Professor, please show me one spot that Omega does in every match that is about as bad as Rollins' Superplex into a falcon arrow? With that spot, Rollins makes himself, his opponent and the match itself look phony. What does Omega do that is as equivalent?
 

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If not selling meant someone was a bad wrestler why are Strong Style wrestlers or any indie wrestler who gets back up after a pile driver, 27 Super kicks or a Canadian Destroyer so popular?
because you have ton of fans who dont care about anything else but MOVES and SPOTS. thats all they wanna see.
 

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Seth is decent but he will never be in the league as someone like HBK, Savage, or Bret Hart for example until he can use psychology in his matches. Right now it's just spots for the sake of doing spots with very little story being told. Atleast not ones that makes sense.
 

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Discussion Starter #85 (Edited)
Literally, everybody did. Well.. not everybody... everybody but me :p. Nobody was running around complaining how 'fake' his selling of the knee was.



And you can keep trying to equate Rollins not selling to the inability to be able to sell just kind of invalidates you.

Even the core concept of this thread.. that Rollins 'sucks in the ring' is hilarious. Now, granted he narrowed his moveset and workrate after the injury(and i'm quite sure at the promotion's behest), but simply saying that means someone is completely ignorant of Rollins's run since he broke The Shield. The motherfucker would take a dive over the top rope to the outside and land on his feet. Would jump off the top rope into an F5. Shit... the curbstomp reversal into an RKO @ WM is a thing of legend. This is a guy that could do a Phoenix splash if needed and most guys his size wouldn't even consider it.

He can roll with anyone, anytime... even the technical guys like Styles or Bryan. I'm quite sure if you put him in there with Ricochet, he'd hold his own with Flippy McFlipper.

And make no bones about this.. if he were ever to come free, AEW would be on him like white on rice. The guy is a top-tier talent, and if you don't believe that you can take your opinion, which is worth about as much as a ten cent taco, and shove it. I mean, they went after Ambrose and that guy is mid-tier at best anywhere else.
So judging by the things you said Rollins is a spot monkey? I hate both Seth and Ricochett but you are out here calling Ricochett "Flippy Mcflipper" while you are praising Rollins when they're almost the same . Doing a Phoenix Splash , diving off the top rope and landing on your feet and all the other shit you mentioned doesn't make you a good wrestler :lmao. Stone Cold couldn't do any of that shit you mentioned yet he's better than Rollins in the ring. Also Ambrose is better than Rollins at literally everything now. He used to be better than Rollins at everything except for in ring skills but now he even surpassed Rollins in that aspect. Its not even debatable anymore.
 

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Literally, everybody did.
No, they didn't. Don't reply to me if you're just going to reply with bullshit statements.

Well.. not everybody... everybody but me :p. Nobody was running around complaining how 'fake' his selling of the knee was.
And this is just further proof that you're lying. That was one of the biggest complaints about his match.

And you can keep trying to equate Rollins not selling to the inability to be able to sell just kind of invalidates you.
It doesn't invalidate me at all. He's demonstrated multiple times now that he's not capable of doing it, even in situations where he doesn't have a pre match stipulated injury.

Even the core concept of this thread.. that Rollins 'sucks in the ring' is hilarious. Now, granted he narrowed his moveset and workrate after the injury(and i'm quite sure at the promotion's behest), but simply saying that means someone is completely ignorant of Rollins's run since he broke The Shield. The motherfucker would take a dive over the top rope to the outside and land on his feet. Would jump off the top rope into an F5. Shit... the curbstomp reversal into an RKO @ WM is a thing of legend.
Literally none of that is being ignored. Those things don't make him a great in-ring performer. Those things don't make anyone a great in-ring performer.

This is a guy that could do a Phoenix splash if needed and most guys his size wouldn't even consider it.
So on top of lying about people thinking Rollins was legitimately injured going into his match with Triple H, you are now telling me that you are one of those people that think that "moves moves and MOVES LOL" are what makes a guy great in the ring. I guess you think Terry Funk wasn't a great in-ring performer right? I guess Steve Austin wasn't great? Oh but I bet Jeff Hardy is an all time great right?

He can roll with anyone, anytime... even the technical guys like Styles or Bryan. I'm quite sure if you put him in there with Ricochet, he'd hold his own with Flippy McFlipper.
Until Rollins proves he's able to construct a match differently from the typical style that he likes performing in, he is not anywhere close to Bryan as far as being an in-ring performer is concerned.

And make no bones about this.. if he were ever to come free, AEW would be on him like white on rice. The guy is a top-tier talent, and if you don't believe that you can take your opinion, which is worth about as much as a ten cent taco, and shove it.
A guy who can't talk on the mic and has little to no abilities in the character department isn't a top tier talent, regardless of how good he is in the ring (and he's not good in the ring, so that just kills your argument).

I mean, they went after Ambrose and that guy is mid-tier at best anywhere else.
Because Ambrose is one of the best mic workers in Pro Wrestling. He's an excellent character worker who takes that aspect of Pro Wrestling very seriously. And he is a very, VERY good in-ring performer who takes not only selling seriously, but all of the other critical aspects such as storytelling too. Rollins does not.

I gave you the benefit of the doubt and that was a very obvious mistake. I mean, you just tried to tell me that Seth being able to do a Phoenix Splash makes him a top tier in-ring performer. That makes him a great gymnastic, that doesn't make him a great in-ring performer. There's a reason he's already received criticism from other people within the industry for his in-ring work, and it isn't because he doesn't do enough flips.

Now please, take your lack of Pro Wrestling knowledge somewhere else and leave this to people who know what they're talking about.
 

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In a way it bothers me he can sell an injury one time then next he doesn't, I'm starting to think I'm making excuses for him but it's like he has short attention span at times.
This is my issue, the man can sell injuries it;s just it seems in the heat of the moment he forgets. Take his match with Brock, man came out selling and limping form the beatings he took. but the the moment the bell rang he was on and off with his selling.

Meanwhile in the Ricochet v AJ Styles match that night Ricochet was selling every beat of that leg injury throughout that whole match.

But more on topic Rollins is a great in ring athlete I wont even judge his in ring ability he is one of the best right now, but his only down side to his in ring ability is his consistency with selling injuries. If you have a massive rib injury then you got to think smart and perform around it.
 

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Until Rollins proves he's able to construct a match differently from the typical style that he likes performing in, he is not anywhere close to Bryan as far as being an in-ring performer is concerned.
The same Daniel Bryan whose moveset is now so limited he likely has less moves than Cena? Maybe early DB, but he's so constricted now, he makes Rollins look like Mozart.
 

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I remember that Seth Rollins was considered a good wrestler especially with his selling by many. I haven't been watching for a while but what happened?
Now people hate him and don't only resort to pointing out his flaws, they're even trying to imply he actually sucks at what was ALWAYS revered about him (even by his deniers) back in the day : his in-ring ability.

Classic internet situation.
 

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he sold it well on raw when aj punched him in the back early on, and when he was suplexed on the floor, but other times throughout the match (and the one with brock) he forgot to sell it. ugh. either sell it or don't.
 

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The same Daniel Bryan whose moveset is now so limited he likely has less moves than Cena? Maybe early DB, but he's so constricted now, he makes Rollins look like Mozart.
This destroyed your argument. DB doesn't need crazy moves to have a great match.
 
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Stone Cold: “Rollins is somewhat over, not all-the-way over, not by a long shot. Now, I don't mean that in a bad way. That's just being honest. He [has] relied on his sequences and his athleticism to carry him. To take him to the next level, he'll have to get more character development."

“When you say 'Seth Rollins' or if you want to say 'Seth Freakin' Rollins', I still don't have a sense of what or who this guy is. And so, that rests on Seth Rollins' shoulders, as an individual, as a performer, to define or create that as well as the WWE because I still don't get a sense of what kind of personality he is."
To be fair, you can say that about a LOT of WWE performers. Who or what is Ricochet? Or Johnny Gargano? Or Adam Cole? Or Drew McIntyre? With the exception of Ricochet, they’re just names. As general as anyone you could randomly run into.

WWE inadvertently allowed itself to become a giant scale version of ROH, whose small fan base thrives on wrestlers with no characters or gimmicks, where match quality was the only selling point (because it was booked as an opposite to WWE). WWE’s strengths have historically been defined, over the top characters that draw mainstream interest like The Rock. The company has been playing to its weaknesses and booking towards ROH’s audience in the last couple of years. Heyman has a long rebuild ahead of him.
 

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Very few people nowadays sell adequately. They sell at the point of impact (sometimes they don’t even do that) and then five seconds later they’ve recovered. Rollins is one name on an unfortunately long list.
 

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The guy's a fucking joke.
End of story.
It actually is psychology, he had to risk everything to beat Lesnar, which is exactly what he did in that match and it paid off in the end. He had to hit something really big and even though he risked his mid section, he HAD to do it to take Lesnar out. It was a more guts/heart than brain story being told, it's not even questionable, you're just either ignorant or blind if you can't tell a story cause of your bias against someone
 

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I remember that Seth Rollins was considered a good wrestler especially with his selling by many. I haven't been watching for a while but what happened?
Nothing, he just had a few unpopular opinions and views on Mox and WWE and suddenly everyone turned off their brain to his ability because someone they don't like can't be good at anything because people are fucking stupid, the end
 

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:lol

This thread...

Sure Rollins isn't perfect and could improve in many areas but at the same time he's definitely one of the best on the roster. He took a match where he was boo'd at the start to cheered at the end. He's a great performer...maybe the psychology can improve but no one is perfect.


Ooofff...I can't believe the difference a year can make lol. More like 6 months can make...

Anyways...doesn't matter who's on top they will be shit on.

I'll back my boy Rollins :D
 

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The same Daniel Bryan whose moveset is now so limited he likely has less moves than Cena? Maybe early DB, but he's so constricted now, he makes Rollins look like Mozart.
Steve Austin post broken neck was heavily constricted, and that version was one of the greatest in-ring performers of all time. How many moves a person has doesn't prove how good they are in the ring. You're just proving to me you don't know anything about in-ring work.

Nothing, he just had a few unpopular opinions and views on Mox and WWE and suddenly everyone turned off their brain to his ability because someone they don't like can't be good at anything because people are fucking stupid, the end
:mj4 I just can't with idiotic arguments like this. This isn't something that happened overnight, and it most certainly did not happen because of his comments on Ambrose. Complaints about Rollins in-ring work have been going on for a while now.

It actually is psychology, he had to risk everything to beat Lesnar, which is exactly what he did in that match and it paid off in the end. He had to hit something really big and even though he risked his mid section, he HAD to do it to take Lesnar out. It was a more guts/heart than brain story being told, it's not even questionable, you're just either ignorant or blind if you can't tell a story cause of your bias against someone
Jesus christ this is even worse than your other post. First off what you just described is storytelling, not psychology. Second, this entire post is strawman arguing at its finest.

Rollins is a man whose finisher revolves around slamming the opponents head into the mat. And he's a dangerous striker with his feet and knees, as he has proven in the past. So please, do not tell us that he needed to do multiple suicide dives into a man who is 280+ pounds of almost pure muscle and a frog splash onto the man while he was on the announcers table. If Seth had any regard for actual storytelling and making what was happening look convincing, he wouldn't have done a frog splash onto the announcers table. He would have went onto the other one, and hit Lesnar with the curb stomp onto the table. Targeting the head was the best bet, since that is the main point of impact with the Curb Stomp anyways (you know, that move he used to beat him with...twice). Rollins never gave any ounce of a shit about telling a legitimate story in that match. He went for the big spots that made no sense, and quite frankly, that entire match can be summed up with that very sentence. A bunch of big spots that made no sense.

Guts/Heart stories can lead to terrific matches. But when it's done in a way that is straight up illogical, it simply doesn't work. And here, it doesn't work. And the reaction from a lot of fans to this match is a clear indication of that. Don't call it bias or being blind. You're committing the act of being both of those things if you're sitting there with a straight face telling us that a man with broken ribs using his stomach to fight someone could possibly work in any scenario.
 

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Discussion Starter #100 (Edited)
Yall Rollins fans can say that "its blind hatred" or its because of his comments about Moxley or anything you want but i still haven't heard a good argument why Rollins's good in the ring or why the match was good. The only argument i've seen is that "he can do movez, he can land on his feet off the top rope and that he can do a phoenix splash". The post above explained perfectly why Rollins isn't good in the ring or atleast not as good as you say he is yet your argument is "You just turned on him" or "Its because of his comments about Moxley".

Rollins is a man whose finisher revolves around slamming the opponents head into the mat. And he's a dangerous striker with his feet and knees, as he has proven in the past. So please, do not tell us that he needed to do multiple suicide dives into a man who is 280+ pounds of almost pure muscle and a frog splash onto the man while he was on the announcers table. If Seth had any regard for actual storytelling and making what was happening look convincing, he wouldn't have done a frog splash onto the announcers table. He would have went onto the other one, and hit Lesnar with the curb stomp onto the table. Targeting the head was the best bet, since that is the main point of impact with the Curb Stomp anyways (you know, that move he used to beat him with...twice). Rollins never gave any ounce of a shit about telling a legitimate story in that match. He went for the big spots that made no sense, and quite frankly, that entire match can be summed up with that very sentence. A bunch of big spots that made no sense.

Guts/Heart stories can lead to terrific matches. But when it's done in a way that is straight up illogical, it simply doesn't work. And here, it doesn't work. And the reaction from a lot of fans to this match is a clear indication of that. Don't call it bias or being blind. You're committing the act of being both of those things if you're sitting there with a straight face telling us that a man with broken ribs using his stomach to fight someone could possibly work in any scenario.
I don't know how you can argue with this really
 
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