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Discussion Starter #1
I was thinking about this in the TNA forum with Bobby Roode and it applies to the WWE and wrestling in general.

Roode was really good as a babyface but he just didn't have what it took back then to really make that jump and become a legit main eventer. Now he turned heel and he's been fantastic and I can only imagine that when he does turn babyface he'll be more over than ever thanks to the heel run.

I think it's like that with a lot of wrestlers if you think about it. Look at The Rock. In early '98 he was starting to get over as a babyface and they teased a babyface run but he turned heel and it really helped him. He played such a fantastic heel that fans loved to hate him and when he did turn babyface in '99 he became one of the biggest stars of the business.

Randy Orton was pretty bland as a babyface in the mid 2000s and when he turned heel he was great and by the time he turned babyface he was very over with the crowd.

John Cena turned babyface because he was a "cool" heel. I think if he were to turn heel it would be very refreshing for him and who knows it might help him and when he turned babyface again he'd be more over than ever.

CM Punk was being booked as a pretty boring face from 2006-2009. It wasn't until he turned heel and formed the SES did he really start to get over and when he came out and cut that promo last summer and turned babyface he became a huge star.

I really think it is necessary to take guys who are almost "right there" and turn them heel before they become a babyface.

I think the same thing is going to happen to Daniel Bryan. The fans love to hate him right now and when he turns babyface he'll probably be one of the most popular wrestlers in the business.
 

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interesting way to look at things, can't say i disagree.
 

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CM Punk was being booked as a pretty boring face from 2006-2009.

I disagree i liked hes face run especially hes ECW stuff
 

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From that point of view I can't say you're wrong. Didn't Austin do that too against Hart?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I think playing a heel really opens things up for a wrestler. If you can get over as a heel you can get over as a babyface. But being a heel gives you so much to work with. You don't have to really act a certain way and suck up to the crowd. You can cut different style promos and see what works. If the fans start to like that wrestler then you turn them face.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
From that point of view I can't say you're wrong. Didn't Austin do that too against Hart?
Yeah, Austin is another guy. He was so great as a heel that fans started to like him. He absolutely had to be a heel first because of his gimmick. But fans ended up liking his whole rebel anti-authority figure gimmick and he took off.
 

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I don't think they HAVE to, it all depends on the situation, the person, etc. Rey Mysterio was never heel in WWE, Goldberg started as a babyface in WCW and got over gigantically. Probably more examples. Steamboat never turned heel, ever. It's harder to be a babyface right off the bat than it is to be a heel, so often people play heel first, establish a relationship with the fans, then turn and get cheered, but it's not a law of wrestling or anything. It depends how naturally likeable that person is and what the presentation of their character is that determines if they'll be accepted as a big face immediately.
 

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Rey Mysterio and Jeff Hardy say no, you don't have to be a heel first.
Didnt Jeff technically have a heel run in the New Brood?
 

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I think that it is easier to get heat as a heel than as a face. If the character can be defined by his actions then it is easier to define a heel (he's the guy that does bad things) and draw attention to this aspect of his character. What does a face do, really, but react to the behaviour of the heel? The heel is (more often than not) the antagonist in the feud. Getting over as a face is pretty hard, I think. You need to get the fans to like you without losing credibility as a tough guy, coming across as smug or allowing yourself to become too comedic or laughable.

Remy Mysterio could never be booked as a heel, though, because of his size. He is the perennial underdog. Nobody likes to see a little guy get pushed around.
 

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