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Vince forgetting Lesnar's finisher is F5 truly concerning.

https://www.podcastone.com/episode/...-fallout-Carmellas-push-Vaders-legacy-6-21-18

"As Vince has gotten older I think he has become more forgetful with
things and there were a lot of instances where he had to be reminded. He would just flat out ask, `What did we do on RAW last week with this guy? What did we do?' He would need to be caught up to speed. Granted, he was in his late 60s/early 70s at that point and responsible for a lot of programming and seen a lot of angles over the years and seen a lot of TV shows. One of the funniest things I recall is Vince one time in a booking meeting...it was Brock Lesnar against somebody and Vince was trying to think of what the finish could be and he literally says this in a booking meeting. He said, `What's Brock's finish again?' It wasn't a joke. There was kind of a pause and somebody spoke up and said, `The F-5.' Then it suddenly dawned on Vince that he had taken that move not too long before that and hurt his hip and made a joke about it, `Oh that's right, my hip didn't like that movie very much.' He could not remember the F-5."

Wade Keller & Eck later lamented the current female champions, Carmella and Alexa Bliss, and argued that after the Women's Revolution the two essentially represented a regression back to the Divas era. Eck said that Vince,

"When I was there in 2014, it was the Divas for sure and Vince would use the line, `Our fans don't want to see the girls fight like the guys.' Whenever there was a suggestion of more of a wrestling type match or some type of stipulation, whether it be Falls Count Anywhere or whatever it might have been, it was, `No no no one wants to see that.' He would look at the girls - he would call them girls, that's why I am saying girls - as providing a sexuality aspect of the show. `Let's get some sexuality on the show,' which meant let's
get a women's match on the show. You would get a 3 or 4 minute match and get the women in the ring and guys can see hot women and that would be a nice buffer to the next men's match. That's the way they were promoted. That era: Carmella or Alexa Bliss? Absolutely. They were perfect champions for that era; but, not today."

Eck went on to say that he can not fathom this era of women's wrestling in comparison to the time he was there, when McMahon & WWE television producer Kevin Dunn were dead set against that. Eck continued to describe women that McMahon apparently found unattractive,

"The women that I heard that Vince found unattractive would blow your mind, like Kaitlyn - not attractive. That would just blow my mind. I just couldn't believe some of the things I used to hear. I'll tell you what, he grew to love A.J. Lee, that whole storyline she did with CM Punk, Daniel Bryan...he grew to
love her just as a character. I think that's why A.J. got the push she did because obviously she didn't fit the cookie cutter mold of a Diva either. Nothing against them; but, The Bella Twins, Kelly Kelly...that was the mold of WWE women."
 

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The amount of negative shit about WWE that Kevin Dunn is mentioned in just doesn't go away.
That cunt is poison. Absolutely toxic.
Even the Smarkbuster-wannabes don't defend Dunn. And they usually defend all the mongs who are dragging down the WWE just to be contrarian.
 

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One of the most amazing things about this company is the influence this no-nothing hack Kevin Dunn has. It’s amazing to me.
And he only got the position because of something his father did, not something he did himself
 

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I don't know why he found Kaitlyn unattractive. If it is due to her size, then he must be fucked up in the head as he clearly has a lot of large sized women on the roster.
 
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One of the most amazing things about this company is the influence this no-nothing hack Kevin Dunn has. It’s amazing to me.
And he only got the position because of something his father did, not something he did himself
 

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Used to be a Dreamer, Dreamin' of a Fire
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I'm tired of hearing that Alexa Bliss and Carmella are "Divas" just because they're more traditionally attractive than the 4 Horsewomen. Alexa and Carmella are leagues better in the ring and on the mic than the Eves, Ashleys and Dawn Marie's of that era. They may not be AS GOOD in the ring as Charlotte, Sasha or Asuka but no, they are better than the Diva label. That is such a lazy critique.

They fit in just fine in an era where WWE presents a more complex and varied offering of women's wrestling. Part of that depth and variety are characters like Alexa and Carmella. To say every woman needs to be a technical wizard to have a spot would really limit and dumb down the Women's Revolution. You need those types of heels for the women just like you need them for the men
 

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The man is 72 so him being forgetful is to be expected it's not like Brock is making weekly appearances, sometimes I forget the Universal Title even exist. Vince most likely forgets a plethora of things that he constantly needs to be reminded of about his own product.

They may be right about Carmella being champion since she's no different that the women of the Divas era, but Alexa is actually an overall good pro wrestlers and is in the same league as women like Trish and AJ. Not everyone has to be a technical marvel in order to be a good pro wrestler and the notion that the Women's Revolution was suppose to be all about that is silly. All the revolution meant was women getting more opportunities which is what's been happening.

Finding Kaitlyn unattractive really isn't anything unexpected, I was more surprised people actually held her looks to such a high regard, I felt similarly about Kelly Kelly and Maria. Vince loving AJ was obvious and it would have been beneficial for the Divas division if more talented women were given opportunities instead of Kelly Kelly, the Bellas, Michelle McCool(even though she was a decent wrestler).
 

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Remember how many head bumps and unprotected chair shots he took during the Attitude Era and some years following that. I would not be surprised at all to hear that he suffers from some sort of CTE thanks to concussions he's gotten. And I would also not be surprised if his memory has been negatively effected as a result.
 

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The Empire will Reign again
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I'm tired of hearing that Alexa Bliss and Carmella are "Divas" just because they're more traditionally attractive than the 4 Horsewomen. Alexa and Carmella are leagues better in the ring and on the mic than the Eves, Ashleys and Dawn Marie's of that era. They may not be AS GOOD in the ring as Charlotte, Sasha or Asuka but no, they are better than the Diva label. That is such a lazy critique.

They fit in just fine in an era where WWE presents a more complex and varied offering of women's wrestling. Part of that depth and variety are characters like Alexa and Carmella. To say every woman needs to be a technical wizard to have a spot would really limit and dumb down the Women's Revolution. You need those types of heels for the women just like you need them for the men
Thank God somebody finally said it.
 

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It sounds like he's a bitter employee. I do believe WWE was only portraying women as sex symbols for the most part. I'm more curious to find out who pushed for the women to get match time: Steph or HHH?

I'm tired of hearing that Alexa Bliss and Carmella are "Divas" just because they're more traditionally attractive than the 4 Horsewomen. Alexa and Carmella are leagues better in the ring and on the mic than the Eves, Ashleys and Dawn Marie's of that era. They may not be AS GOOD in the ring as Charlotte, Sasha or Asuka but no, they are better than the Diva label. That is such a lazy critique.

They fit in just fine in an era where WWE presents a more complex and varied offering of women's wrestling. Part of that depth and variety are characters like Alexa and Carmella. To say every woman needs to be a technical wizard to have a spot would really limit and dumb down the Women's Revolution. You need those types of heels for the women just like you need them for the men
Absolutely. I thought the same when he compared bliss/Carmella to the diva's age. :clap
 

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"Granted, he was in his late 60s/early 70s at that point..."

Age isn't exactly something you can generalize. It's a fucking concise number, lol.

I think it's unfair to lump Bliss in with Carmella as belonging more to the Divas Era than today. She's had long, competitive matches and she works her ass off. Granted, she's no ring general by any stretch, but neither is anyone else on the roster unless your name is Asuka or any of the Four Horsewomen.
 

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I feel bad for Vince. He needs to retire age caught up with him he needs to go home and give the company to Hunter.
 
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I'm tired of hearing that Alexa Bliss and Carmella are "Divas" just because they're more traditionally attractive than the 4 Horsewomen. Alexa and Carmella are leagues better in the ring and on the mic than the Eves, Ashleys and Dawn Marie's of that era. They may not be AS GOOD in the ring as Charlotte, Sasha or Asuka but no, they are better than the Diva label. That is such a lazy critique.
Carmella isn't better in the ring than anybody. Alexa may be, but not Carmella. She legitimately can't do anything right.

They fit in just fine in an era where WWE presents a more complex and varied offering of women's wrestling. Part of that depth and variety are characters like Alexa and Carmella. To say every woman needs to be a technical wizard to have a spot would really limit and dumb down the Women's Revolution. You need those types of heels for the women just like you need them for the men
You need those types of heels for the real wrestlers to run through. Nobody said they "can't have a spot", but a "spot" does not mean the champions on top of the division, especially the way Bliss is on top. A 26 year old 5 time champion. At this rate, if she's still in WWE when she's Mickies age, she'll have held more world titles than Ric Flair and Hulk Hogan combined. It's absurd. The one thing I'll at least give Bliss, though, is that I don't think she should never get a reign, she just shouldn't be a constant fixture. She should be a character who talks shit, she loses, rinse and repeat. Every now and then you throw her an accomplishment just to keep her in the mix. Not like how they do it where she can't spend 3 months away from the belt. Carmella should never, ever, ever hold the belt, though.

As far as "depth and variety" goes, they have none. Alexa is a copy and paste of Regina George, and Carmella is basically Alexa if she lost all of her talent, dressed horribly, and didn't know how to moonwalk properly. These are stock WWE characters, this is their default mode. There's no depth in "bitchy heel who bullies everyone".

There's nothing that "limits" and "dumbs down" the womens revolution more than undermining its very point with champions like Carmella, the point of which is that women can be legitimate acts like the men. That was the initial point. Now we've gone back to the divas era, but under the guise of the womens revolution, so instead of the women being awful for 3 minutes, they're awful for 30.
 
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