Bush wasn't running for office in 2008 - you can't deny that the previous administration and how they are perceived has a direct and substantial effect on the outcome of the election. Clinton was a disgrace, and yet Obama endorsed her - he is part of the same party establishment which rigged the Democratic primaries. You only have to see the results of the 2014 mid term elections to see though, that the public perception of the Democrats goes far deeper than Clinton, who for many was just the tip of the iceberg.1. Obama wasn't running for President. Hilary Clinton was. She was literally the worst option from the Democratic Party. With the controversy regarding the more favored Bernie Sanders being screwed out of the primary, public perception of the Democratic party in general went to total shit.
Who are these people? Do you personally know them? There are uniformed people on both sides. I don't buy into this assertion that 'my side are so much smarter than the other', we are all equal, we all have one vote. Perhaps the Democrats should have been more enticing to working/middle class people, rather than labelling them as a bunch of backward, racist, troglodytes. The reality is that the people in middle america were hurting a lot - not just due to the recession 8 years prior, but because of the nature of the recovery and that in part, Obama must take responsibility for.2. People bought into most of the garbage Trump spewed about Obama (and most of which was false) as well as believing he'd be anything good for the country as a whole. There were even people who thought Obama was in office when 9/11 happened. It isn't difficult to fool most Trump supporters into believing something negative about Obama, because they will typically buy into it without bothering to fact check or even stop and think for a moment. We're talking about a man who got elected by having one of his own promises be that he would make another country pay for something that would be made on US territory. It's pretty obvious that critical thinking isn't something Trump supporters employed when they voted for him.
What I take from that is that Trump supporters in large want to stop illegal immigration. I don't really think they give a damn who pays for the wall, or perhaps even if there even is a wall, as long as the issue is tackled.
Clinton's vision was basically a continuation of Obama's policies - that is to a large extent why Trump was able to win. You are right though, Trump had no business winning, especially with all the scandals surrounding him, and yes Clinton was generally an awful candidate, but many voted for Trump because they hated the establishment and wanted change, the same change that Obama had promised 8 years prior and failed to deliver.3. Undecided voters went mostly to Trump, and rightfully so. Rather than try to actually fix the problems that were created by Obama, Clinton mostly praised them and wanted to keep them. Trump at least gave undecided voters a reason to want to vote for him, because he was at least giving an outlook of what his version of America would look like compared to Clinton, who basically assumed this election was hers for the taking. And in retrospect, it was hers for the taking. Trump had no business winning this election. He did it mostly due to Clinton's inability to be a proper candidate.
Cleaning up the mess Bush made - Wat? If you mean in terms of the economy then you are wrong, he basically did everything that Bush would have done - Bailing out the banks with taxpayer money, with no hope of ever seeing it returned was criminal. The recovery was also pretty slow and there was a 'double dip' recession during his tenure. Furthermore, real wage growth was really slow and most people in middle America felt the pinch - nobody likes working an unfulfilling job, for a subsistence wage and with little hope of new opportunities in the future. Jobs too continued to leave the country and be taken up by poor, exploited workers in third world countries - and yet he did nothing to aid this issue.They are trolling because that's basically all Trump supporters can do now. It's pretty obvious at this point that Trump hasn't been anywhere close to the President Obama was. This isn't to say that Obama's time as President didn't leave a poor taste in some people's mouths, more specifically the ones who did not benefit from his ACA. After all it isn't like Obama won his two terms on complete landslides or anything. Most of this comes down to Hilary being the most unpopular candidate to have ever run for President, and unlike Trump who actually did do a decent job of pleading his case for what he'd be better, Clinton had no idea what she was doing.
Cleaning up the mess Bush made, creating healthcare for everyone, making it easier for people to go to college, killing Osama Bin Laden, these are noteworthy achievements. Again I say noteworthy, because once again, I am still waiting for someone to explain to me what Trump has done so far that is better than any of this. I shit on Obamacare because it deserves my criticism. It's still a greater achievement than anything Trump's done yet.
In terms of foreign policy, he was totally incompetent. Bush made a total mess of the Middle East, but Obama somehow made it actually worse. Look at the husk of what used to be Libya now. Pretty nice if you like slavery. Look at Syria - the war in which the US was attacking IS terrorists one side as well as the administration fighting IS on the other, whilst also supporting Jihadist 'moderate rebels' who hate the west but are happy for the support and also the kurds who are perpetually at war with US NATO ally Turkey? Thank God Trump is pulling the troops at of that mess - which is not US responsibility. In Iraq troops were actually required since the administration was so weak (much like Libya post-intervention) that leaving created a vacuum - I don't really blame him for this one, but in hindsight it was shortsighted. The Syria situation, imo, is different in that there are actually forces to fill that vacuum - Assad has quite strong support and is backed by the Russians - if they want to waste lives and money mopping up the remnants of IS then they are welcome.
I will give him credit for giving better access to education as I don't really know much about it other than US college education is v. expensive. I happen to think that in the UK there are too many people who go to University, despite not being clever enough, lacking the will to finish and doing degrees that have no hope of leading to employment - but that is a different situation. The less said about Obamacare the better I think - a total disaster.
Trump has only been in office for two years, so I think it's hard to make an assessment yet in the same way we can on Obama or Bush. I would say there are some promising signs.
Brinkmanship and then Dialogue with N. Korea - This could be his legacy if this works out. I hope it does.
Pulling out of Syria and eventually Afghanistan - Difficult to say at this point, but I think that this is a good move and that it marks the beginning of the end for US military intervention in foreign, sovereign nations.
Reform of NATO - I am no fan of NATO but I can see why US citizens might be annoyed that they pay huge amounts towards their military and the protection of Europe (protection against Russia) while Germany deals heavily with Russia buying huge amounts of natural gas from them for example, while also paying a tiny amount towards their defence. It's a joke.
Pulling out of NAFTA and TPP - This was a really good move for the American worker although its effects will not be seen for a little while perhaps. The US had to do something about the number of corporations moving jobs abroad as it was really hurting workers across the country. There are jobs, but they are not 'good jobs' this could potentially put a stop to that. USMCA will be an improvement and anyone saying different is a partisan hack.
'The Trade Wars' - Never understood why people were so critical of Trump for raising tariffs on certain countries. In all circumstances, they had already placed tariffs on the US. It is economically smart for the US to throw its economic weight around, there might be some short term pain, but long term there is much to gain. The key example may be China, they seem willing to come to the table now - the cost was having to subsidise farmers for a while. China's economy on the other hand shrank by 25% in 2018. In agreement can come to pass then it will be much more beneficial for the US than current arrangements.
The border - If his plans go ahead then I think it can only be an improvement. It is really difficult to migrate into the US legally, so it does seem very unfair that so many illegal, and often unskilled immigrants are able to enter the US. I believe that work migration should be based on what the host country wants and not what the immigrant wants - If they want unskilled labour, then congrats it's your lucky day - if not then that's unfortunate, go elsewhere. The immigration system needs to be reformed and the southern border problem is a key part of that.
It's too early to assess Trump yet - I think he could be good, there are certainly some promising things which he has started doing, but they have either not yet come into action or the effects can not yet be seen. I think it is also very difficult when the entire media is constantly negative and the establishment are generally doing everything that they can to stop him from achieving his aims. I don't think I could deal with that at all - so he has done well to remain upbeat and seem to shake it off. It is certainly a hyperbole to say he is the worst president ever, or even close to the worst at this point. Most controversial? maybe. By the next election we can reassess, but at the moment he hasn't been a disaster. (There's still time yet)Great is not something I would call Obama. Good is even a bit of a stretch. Decent? Sure. Competent? Yes. Better than Trump? Absolutely.
Obama we can assess - he was hugely disappointing and when he left, much of the world where he had intervened was a mess. Many innocent people died due to his incompetence, he was not decent. He also failed to achieve nearly all of his campaign aims. He was... poor. Still there have been worse presidents, and he was a charismatic figure who represented the country well abroad I suppose, but in his main role as executive and commander-in-chief, he will always be a disappointment.
Hope this brief overview answers some of the questions you have been asking :laugh: