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Roy "Gambit" Mustang
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really excited we triggered article 50 and put a deadline on us leaving the eu even though we hadn't and still don't have any fucking clue what our plan post brexit is

just a+ stuff from all concerned here but at least we're GETTING OUR COUNTRY BACK right
This. Such a fucking mess. These incompetent morons had no plans for leaving the EU and will fuck the country for years.
 

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SMILEY GOD
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Bit of a shambles really. Was always going to happen with a remain voter trying to lead us out of the EU. She should've gone after that calamitous snap GE - does anyone like her? :lol

Just pull out with no deal. We were never going to get much back from the EU because they're scared of other countries doing the same thing.

Some of the dread/panic going round this thread is amusing though - with all the usual cliches (blame the elderly, blame the uneducated, etc). We're one of the strongest economies and most influential countries in the world and we're leaving a political union - we'll be fine.
 

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You need to be yourself, you can't be no-one else.
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My thinking over the situation is that they called a vote over europe with the idea of "oh everyone will vote to stay, don't worry" and therefore didnt even plan for an eventuality of the UK leaving Europe,

Then people voted to leave and they put themselves in a situation where they had no fucking idea what to do but couldnt go back on the peoples vote so they then had to cobble together a plan at last minute.

overall the government were absolute fucking idiots for throwing out a vote and gambling that people would vote to stay (not sure cameron wouldve gambled his job like that had I knew it was possible). You dont call a vote without having plans for both outcomes. Saying that though there shouldve never been a vote. These bastards get paid enough to sort this shit for themselves. I dont think throwing out a vote to the uneducated public was wise in any case.

I actually had some faith in may to get this done but not anymore, shes useless. I personally can't stand europe but I wouldve hoped for a better exit than this shitfest.
 
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Discussion Starter #86 (Edited)
I mean it all boils down to this very simple fact: It's impossible for the EU to give into the vast majority of "promises" given by the Leave campaign with regards to our future relationship - the EU is literally designed to make all of those demands impossible, to allow them would be giving membership benefits to non-members. Because our economy is so tied into the EU (which makes the "we're one of the strongest economies in the world laughable - yes we are, but ONLY because the majority of our GDP comes from financial services to the EU!) there was literally no possible way the country could be better off outside of the EU than we are in it. We've already lost insane amounts of wealth and standing simply because of the vote result - never mind actually leaving the EU. The reason people blame the "uneducated" is because the uneducated don't do the research and their opinions basically amount to "I don't know fuck all, but it's alright because British Pride!!!" Which is retarded. The fact remains, and will remain that anybody who DID do the research knew this was a terrible idea. Any economic expert worth their salt knew this was a terrible idea. MP's knew this was a terrible idea which is why they overwhelmingly voted Remain. The only people who thought it was a good idea were the elite tax-dodgers who saw an easy way for them to gain more power (they don't care if the economy plummets, they're still millionaires regardless) and the idiots who bought into their bullshit, don't know what they're talking about and voted for the shitstorm. There was literally NO plan that could be made that would give us a positive outcome in leaving the EU - it's impossible. Anybody thinking there was is flat-out fooling themselves, most likely doesn't work in an industry that deals with economics on a large scale, and frankly is a lot more gullible and foolish than an adult should ever be in their life. Fact.
 

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The "taking back control of our borders" is my favourite argument. Go and try and live in Germany for 3 months and not get a job, and they'll make you leave. People were brainwashed into thinking this was all about immigration. People coming here and living off the state. Under EU law we are allowed to deport people if they choose to do that, but we never enforce it here, because reasons (laziness mostly!)

I mean it all boils down to this very simple fact: It's impossible for the EU to give into the vast majority of "promises" given by the Leave campaign with regards to our future relationship - the EU is literally designed to make all of those demands impossible, to allow them would be giving membership benefits to non-members. Because our economy is so tied into the EU (which makes the "we're one of the strongest economies in the world laughable - yes we are, but ONLY because the majority of our GDP comes from financial services to the EU!) there was literally no possible way the country could be better off outside of the EU than we are in it. We've already lost insane amounts of wealth and standing simply because of the vote result - never mind actually leaving the EU. The reason people blame the "uneducated" is because the uneducated don't do the research and their opinions basically amount to "I don't know fuck all, but it's alright because British Pride!!!" Which is retarded. The fact remains, and will remain that anybody who DID do the research knew this was a terrible idea. Any economic expert worth their salt knew this was a terrible idea. MP's knew this was a terrible idea which is why they overwhelmingly voted Remain. The only people who thought it was a good idea were the elite tax-dodgers who saw an easy way for them to gain more power (they don't care if they economy plummets, they're still millionaires regardless) and the idiots who bought into their bullshit, don't know what they're talking about and voted for the shitstorm. There was literally NO plan that could be made that would give us a positive outcome in leaving the EU - it's impossible. Anybody thinking there was is flat-out fooling themselves, most likely doesn't work in an industry that deals with economics on a large scale, and frankly is a lot more gullible and foolish than an adult should ever be in their life. Fact.
Didn't you hear? Apparently, people are sick of experts

:eyeroll
 

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Discussion Starter #88
Didn't you hear? Apparently, people a sick of experts

:eyeroll
And that's very obvious by the pro-Brexit community knowing absolutely fuck all about how anything in the economy works, how anything in the EU works, in fact how anything in the UK works and mostly just parroting long-since ridiculed talking points they heard from the people who manipulated them with ease.
 

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You're Pretty Good
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I could go into greater detail about how absolutely fucked this idea of a “no deal” would actually be for the UK. The most obvious point from my perspective would be the immediate possibility of the UK literally breaking up as for the first time an independent Ireland would be more economically viable than the absolute disaster that would be the hard border, tariff heavy existence which would immediately destroy both economies. There needs to be a deal with the UK to prevent a genuinely horrific situation over here.

The Brexiters were spinning a web of lies that were so fucking blatantly obvious it hurts. Boris is jumping ship becuase he can point at the mess May made of his disaster to save face. Anyone who believes Boris Johnson or Nigel Farage have anything but their own personal ambition in mind need a punch in the face. They are con artists, with very suspicious financial backing. As do the DUP, the ultimate chest thumping goons, the likes of which cannot be found anywhere in the world. They didn’t even bother trying to make a coherent defence of Brexit in NI, just parroted the “sure it’ll be fine, BRITAIN STRONG” nonsense while taking money from unnamed sources to distribute propaganda across the water because they knew it was a waste of fucking time over here. The lot of them should be tried as criminals, they’ve betrayed ever person in the nation with their bullshit. If the imaginery glorious Brexit existed then why the fuck would the Tories not go through with it?!?! They’d secure every election for the next 20 years if this great deal/no deal was viable. It isn’t. It never was. Boris lied, Davis lies, the bus lied. It was all a crock of shit.
 

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My thinking over the situation is that they called a vote over europe with the idea of "oh everyone will vote to stay, don't worry" and therefore didnt even plan for an eventuality of the UK leaving Europe,

Then people voted to leave and they put themselves in a situation where they had no fucking idea what to do but couldnt go back on the peoples vote so they then had to cobble together a plan at last minute.

overall the government were absolute fucking idiots for throwing out a vote and gambling that people would vote to stay (not sure cameron wouldve gambled his job like that had I knew it was possible). You dont call a vote without having plans for both outcomes. Saying that though there shouldve never been a vote. These bastards get paid enough to sort this shit for themselves. I dont think throwing out a vote to the uneducated public was wise in any case.

I actually had some faith in may to get this done but not anymore, shes useless. I personally can't stand europe but I wouldve hoped for a better exit than this shitfest.
David Cameron made a calculated gamble.

He called the Scottish referendum to cripple the Lib Dem and Labour vote in Scotland by stoking Scottish nationalism.

He called the EU referendum in an attempt to cripple UKIP and the persistent thorn in the side of the Tories in their euroskeptic wing.

This entire mess is down to an arrogant Prime Minister who saw an opportunity to secure a Tory government for years by undercutting all his political rivals who has left this country with a complete mess whilst he simply faded away into the background, leaving the rest of us to tidy up the chaos.

David Cameron should be a social pariah, widely condemned and blamed for this absolute shit show, instead he's been able to silently fade away, the victim of a few pig related jibes.
 

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Discussion Starter #91
David Cameron made a calculated gamble.

He called the Scottish referendum to cripple the Lib Dem and Labour vote in Scotland by stoking Scottish nationalism.

He called the EU referendum in an attempt to cripple UKIP and the persistent thorn in the side of the Tories in their euroskeptic wing.

This entire mess is down to an arrogant Prime Minister who saw an opportunity to secure a Tory government for years by undercutting all his political rivals who has left this country with a complete mess whilst he simply faded away into the background, leaving the rest of us to tidy up the chaos.

David Cameron should be a social pariah, widely condemned and blamed for this absolute shit show, instead he's been able to silently fade away, the victim of a few pig related jibes.
Cameron's fuck up only allowed the vultures to start creating the carcass they're going to pick over tbh. His move was a bad one, but the true "villains" here are the ones who actually pushed it through and the ways they've been continually making millions (through short-selling the pound and cashing in via their hedge funds) whilst everybody else feels the negative effects on the economy. Once the economy is in the toilet they'll make even more when they asset-strip the nation with the convenient excuse of "well, we didn't know this would happen because of Brexit (you did) but we're going to have to sell everything now to cope." Only the uneducated fools like @Seb think there was ever a good end-result for the country and not just a small group of elites who can make serious bank on the wholesale destruction of a nation's economy and credibility.
 

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Cameron's fuck up only allowed the vultures to start creating the carcass they're going to pick over tbh. His move was a bad one, but the true "villains" here are the ones who actually pushed it through and the ways they've been continually making millions (through short-selling the pound and cashing in via their hedge funds) whilst everybody else feels the negative effects on the economy. Once the economy is in the toilet they'll make even more when they asset-strip the nation with the convenient excuse of "well, we didn't know this would happen because of Brexit (you did) but we're going to have to sell everything now to cope." Only the uneducated fools like @Seb think there was ever a good end-result for the country and not just a small group of elites who can make serious bank on the wholesale destruction of a nation's economy and credibility.
Of course, there is a reason they keep hammering home "will of the people" (despite it being a slim margin and more people didn't or couldn't vote), it is so in a few years time, when the economy tanks and they begin to asset strip more public services like the NHS they can hide it behind "people experiencing the consequences of their choices, they voted for this, so they need to ride through the storm, they knew what they were voting for" etc.

The more they keep drilling it into our collective heads that this is democracy, will of the people etc they can also then spin the blame on us and have us divided and fighting each other when shit hits the fan, too distracted to go after the absolute bastards who engineered it all.
 

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You need to be yourself, you can't be no-one else.
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Thats pretty much what I meant though, cameron basically wanted a vote to confirm that people wanted to remain in europe they could happily move on from the whole europe debate then it all did a left turn. I highly doubt he wouldve even of entertained the idea if there was sufficient doubt that the vote would go to leave (same happened recently with the snap election as a power grab that fucked things up more when it didnt go as planned).

goes without saying that politicians are spineless bastards. A doctor doesnt "throw out a vote" to the public on whether someone needs heart surgery or not, they judge it based on their own knowledge and expertise in the medical field, why should we make a decision to leave europe? do it your fucking self. You know the country and its economy better than "dave" from the local butchers.
 
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Discussion Starter #94
Thats pretty much what I meant though, cameron basically wanted a vote to confirm that people wanted to remain in europe they could happily move on from the whole europe debate then it all did a left turn. I highly doubt he wouldve even of entertained the idea if there was sufficient doubt that the vote would go to leave (same happened recently with the snap election as a power grab that fucked things up more when it didnt go as planned).

goes without saying that politicians are spineless bastards. A doctor doesnt "throw out a vote" to the public on whether someone needs heart surgery or not, they judge it based on their own knowledge and expertise in the medical field, why should we make a decision to leave europe? do it your fucking self. You know the country and its economy better than "dave" from the local butchers.
Actually a lot of them don't, that's the biggest problem with politics. A significant portion of politicians are just wealthy people who convinced people to vote for them, they're not experts. There are some INCREDIBLY competent politicians too (Vince Cable's one tbh) but politics is one of the very few "industries" where you can blag your way into a job by chatting shit and still keep the job when you don't perform because all you have to do is continue blagging. Enough money and/or charisma and any old retard can get elected, it's less about competence and more about the ability to persuade people that you're their guy. Boris Johnson has a friggin 2:1 in Classics, his "skills" are in his character - he actually pretended to be a liberal at Oxford in order to get elected president of the Union, he's been convincing working class people to buy into his crap since he was a student. What we need are more politicians who are less bothered about the money they can make and the people they can influence and are more bothered about the country and utilising the skills they studied their lives for. We do have a lot of those, but they're very rarely the ones with power in the 2 big parties. Politics is fucked, it pays better to be good looking or charismatic than it does to be a god damned genius and expert in your field. It's basically pro wrestling but the fights are proper shit.
 

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SMILEY GOD
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Only the uneducated fools like @Seb think there was ever a good end-result for the country and not just a small group of elites who can make serious bank on the wholesale destruction of a nation's economy and credibility.
I didn't even vote leave you absolute cabbage. I just think some of the fear mongering going round is massively OTT.

Nice job assuming i'm uneducated as well (you're throwing assumptions all over the place here) just because I don't think leaving a political union is going to be the "wholesale destruction of a nation's economy and credibility".
 

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Discussion Starter #96
I didn't even vote leave you absolute cabbage.
Thus proving my point that you're both uneducated and the bearer of an invalid opinion. Thanks for letting everybody know you're irrelevant to the discussion because you don't really understand any of it.
 

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tombstone blues
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I didn't even vote leave you absolute cabbage. I just think some of the fear mongering going round is massively OTT.

Nice job assuming i'm uneducated as well (you're throwing assumptions all over the place here) just because I don't think leaving a political union is going to be the "wholesale destruction of a nation's economy and credibility".
Rick turns into a sneering tantrum-throwing authoritarian on this issue, don't feel bad
 
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SMILEY GOD
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Thus proving my point that you're both uneducated and the bearer of an invalid opinion. Thanks for letting everybody know you're irrelevant to the discussion because you don't really understand any of it.
You've made assumptions that I voted leave (I didn't) and that i'm uneducated (i'm not) and now you've decided that I don't understand what's going on, purely because i'm not going ridiculously over the top about what leaving the EU will mean for the country.

Glad we both know where we stand.
 
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