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If it's a work, it's the single greatest one in the history of the industry. In my personal opinion, I think it was just a lot of incredible coincidences that lined up matched with Vince attempting to lean into it as more of a work during the aftermath. If it were simply McMahon telling the story, I could buy it as him trying to put one over on the audience as he's never been one to shy away from that sort of thing.

The big argument I hear for it being a work is that people who know Vince say he would never sell anyone's punch like that as far as leaving the locker room limping and then coming out on TV with a black eye. I think if it were a private incident, he might not have, but the "Bret screwed Bret" interview was him milking the Bret punch for sympathy and trying to spin it. It ultimately didn't work and he instead used it to turn heel.

With Bret, this is where I would call it a "great work". He would literally be lying to the point of killing his own integrity if this were a work. He's made it too much about his own word for it to be believable and at this point, if it were fake, what would be anyone's reasoning for still keeping it secret now? Owen's death kind of made it clear to me. He still had genuine animosity toward Vince and I feel like in the very real weird where an active investigation on Owen's death and subsequent civil trial were going on, someone would have admitted under deposition that Bret and Vince staged the whole Montreal Screwjob.

Another argument for it being a work is that Bret never sued Vince for breaching the "creative control" clause in his contract but I feel like that wouldn't have been as easy a lawsuit as it seems. He had "reasonable creative control" but an argument could be made that not agreeing to lose a match might not fit that criteria and it's been argued that Bret assaulting Vince after the fact would have given WWF a little legal ammo of their own.
 

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brett literally wrot
If Shawn Michaels hadn't opened his drug addled, insecure, miserable mouth and told Bret that he wouldn't lose to him(even though he was never asked to) in the summer of 97, the whole situation never would've happened. Bret would've lost to Shawn on the way out and gone to WCW undamaged and started fresh from there

But Shawn just had to be a miserable prick and symbolically spit in Bret's face when Bret had just told him that he would put him over
It wasnt about losing to shawny boy it was about where he lost to him. If it was anywhere but canada, he wouldve dropped the belt then peaced the fuck out without so much as a peep
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
I’ve considered this. Let’s assume it was a work.

1. Bret and Vince were in on it. But only them. It serves two potential purposes - helping to launch Bret’s WCW run (a nice sweetener for him) and it solidifies Vince as the evil owner.

2. It’s such a work that even Davey and Neidhart don’t know it’s a work. They leave WWE, with Davey paying six figures to get out of his deal.

2. But, this work becomes even harder to disclose. Davey suffers a serious injury in WCW in the fall of 1998, and he’s only there because Bret lied.

3. Owen dies in May 1999, and Bret’s kayfabe anger turns real. Bret blames Vince for his brother’s death, and any chance that the work is revealed goes out the window.
If I am the owner of a company, and I am gonna screw my employee for not doing a job. Why in the god's name am I sitting at ringside? Why am I KNOWING Medusa before showing the Women's title on TV on WCW knowing Bret MIGHT jump ship taking the title off of him thinking that he possiblity of him having known problems with Shawn not forsee that what happened could happen?
To us looking at Vince's decisions it may not make sense. But I think people think Vince is dumber than he looks
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
If it's a work, it's the single greatest one in the history of the industry. In my personal opinion, I think it was just a lot of incredible coincidences that lined up matched with Vince attempting to lean into it as more of a work during the aftermath. If it were simply McMahon telling the story, I could buy it as him trying to put one over on the audience as he's never been one to shy away from that sort of thing.

The big argument I hear for it being a work is that people who know Vince say he would never sell anyone's punch like that as far as leaving the locker room limping and then coming out on TV with a black eye. I think if it were a private incident, he might not have, but the "Bret screwed Bret" interview was him milking the Bret punch for sympathy and trying to spin it. It ultimately didn't work and he instead used it to turn heel.

With Bret, this is where I would call it a "great work". He would literally be lying to the point of killing his own integrity if this were a work. He's made it too much about his own word for it to be believable and at this point, if it were fake, what would be anyone's reasoning for still keeping it secret now? Owen's death kind of made it clear to me. He still had genuine animosity toward Vince and I feel like in the very real weird where an active investigation on Owen's death and subsequent civil trial were going on, someone would have admitted under deposition that Bret and Vince staged the whole Montreal Screwjob.

Another argument for it being a work is that Bret never sued Vince for breaching the "creative control" clause in his contract but I feel like that wouldn't have been as easy a lawsuit as it seems. He had "reasonable creative control" but an argument could be made that not agreeing to lose a match might not fit that criteria and it's been argued that Bret assaulting Vince after the fact would have given WWF a little legal ammo of their own.
The problem is too many things went right. If you can be so mad at losing a fake belt in Canada a belt that in reality never won okay. You are not Losing that belt ,becuse it was given to you, if you hold THAT much weight on that belt, I don't think it is too unbelievable to sell this as a work. You can't make hte argument losing the title would lose Bret's stock because he left WWF anyway.
And if Bret REALLY Hated Vince. He would never come back, or even run a whole Storyline with him. if Bret really had integrity, why would he work a storyline for money against a man he held responsible for basically killing his brother?

If you wanna look at what a true disastor looks like, Watch Mike Tyson biting Holyfield,compare everything that happens in that ring during that. Watch the aftermath, read the court cases, the suspension and how Mike Tyson's reputation went in the shitter making him the most hated man in boxing and losing all his money etc . That is what a true disaster looks like.

If it was a work, what does Vince have to gain by keeping it a secret today?
What would he lose? He says that he does the WWE for fun, so why wouldn't this be part of the fun?
 

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There are a lot of people that still believe it is real. There are tons of arguments for this , the timing of the documentary, The perfect camera work during the match. Vince for some reason being out there, Bret having so many promos about people screwing him before this and the fact that no one really lost. I ultimately believe that only Bret and Vince are the people that knew everything and the rest didn't know Bret knew.

My main reason for why this is all a work is this; Whenever something happens that Vince disapproves of,he makes it his mission to almost never mention any of it in any way. Meanwhile this one thing about Montreal they just keep headlining. They will do revisionism on the MNWs they will say Austin was bigger than Hogan or the like, But Montreal for some reason doesn't have a changed narrative at all.
So that is why I believe it is a work, Vince will make it his mission to make sure you forget something he doesn't want you to remember
Next you will claim that the Earth is flat and question why people think it's not.....grow up.
 

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Didn’t scott hall say he thinks it’s a work??

I am convinced it was real. Vince isn’t that smart.

The irony is, Vince thought he was doing the right thing and would be a face … yet it lead to him being the biggest heel going around, the perfect foil to the exploding austin, and of course the explosion of the attitude era. Unintended consequences hey.
The only way I think it was a work is if Bret himself came up with the idea. For Vince to suggest it to Bret opens himself up to tremendous risk - it takes the Screwjob off the table for real if Bret says no.
 

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Didn’t scott hall say he thinks it’s a work??

I am convinced it was real. Vince isn’t that smart.

The irony is, Vince thought he was doing the right thing and would be a face … yet it lead to him being the biggest heel going around, the perfect foil to the exploding austin, and of course the explosion of the attitude era. Unintended consequences hey.
That's the thing. Vince was playing face after the screwjob and even played it straight when Vince brought Tyson on RAW. Vince started to play up being the boss wanting HBK for his champion instead of Austin during the Road to Mania. HBK denied being "Vince's boy." It was Post WM Raw where they cut the line with Vince being a heel against Austin as before it was Vince playing straight trying to do what was best for his employees like the first time he got stunned By Austin. He was a face in that with the irony.
 

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In the age of sports entertainment, the World Wrestling Federation REFUSES to insult it audience in terms of "Baby Faces" and "Heels". In 1997, how many people do you truly know that are strictly "good" guys or "bad" guys? World Wrestling Federation programming reflects more of a reality based product in which life, as well as World Wrestling Federation superstars are portrayed as they truly are--in shades of gray...not black or white.

That's a quote from Vince McMahon a few days before the screw job. He didn't think he was going face. He knew the fans would boo the sh out of him no matter how he acted and this was just about creating his character as well convincing the back that he screwed Bret because it is the right thing to do.
 
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