WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read) - Page 6 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:52 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

Why is anyone arguing with the OP? He's never going to accept that 17 was the GOAT WM and has completely convinced himself that 19 was better, going as far to say that there was absolutely nothing bad on the card (the Taker match and the Miller catfight girls beg to differ). He also way over hypes the matches that were good. Brock/Angle was very solid, Rock/Austin 3 was as well and Jericho/HBK was MOTN, IMO. However, in terms of importance, outcome build, NOTHING on the WM19 card can hold a candle to Rock/Austin 2. That was one of the biggest matches in history. The atmosphere for the entire event was almost unparalleled. And the actual matches overall were a lot better. Were you expecting the Battle Royal at 17 to be some masterpiece? No, it was a nostalgia trip and did exactly what it was meant to do.

On the whole, 17 had the better wrestling (and that includes everything-not just technicality), better storytelling, better hype, better crowd, more important matches, better buys, and overall the best matches. Every match on that card had a built up story and all of the stories had a conclusion or satisfying way of continuing the feud. That's the point of WM, to be that season finale of the wrestling year and 17 did that better than 19 did.
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Old 10-10-2013, 11:34 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

Great matches at Wrestlemania 17:
Angle vs. Benoit
TLC II
Rock vs. Austin

Great matches at Wrestlemania 19:
Y2J vs. HBK
Rock vs. Austin
Brock vs. Angle

In my opinion, they're tied as far as great matches goes. I'd probably choose the top 3 from 17 though. The rest comes down to undercard, atmosphere, and entertainment value. I'll go through it.

- Jericho vs. Regal and Mysterio vs. Hardy are about even for me. One was 7 minutes and the other was 5, so the duration wasn't very different. Both matches delivered and were good choices for openers.
- Women's match was better at 19.
- Pillow Fight and the gimmick battle royal were equally bad.
- McMahon/Hogan and McMahon/Shane are about the same for me.

I think they're very close, but 17 wins because it made better use of video packages, promos, and backstage segments. Wrestlemania 19 probably would've surpassed it if it got those things right, since you can make a case for the wrestling being superior. Also, I don't consider Undertaker vs. Triple H to be a "great" match. It was just a solid brawl between the two. Neither show was perfect.
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Old 10-11-2013, 10:24 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

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Originally Posted by KO Bossy View Post
Why is anyone arguing with the OP? He's never going to accept that 17 was the GOAT WM
Please do not waste my time with idiotic statements like this. This is all completely a matter of opinion, there are no facts involved in this. It's about the reasoning behind your opinions that I care about, and so far from what I've seen, not a lot of them have made sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KO Bossy View Post
and has completely convinced himself that 19 was better, going as far to say that there was absolutely nothing bad on the card (the Taker match and the Miller catfight girls beg to differ).
The Miller Cat fight was not an official match on the card. If you can't even get simple parts like this right why should I take the rest of your post seriously?

And the Taker match was most certainly not a bad match. It wasn't anything special, but they deserve a lot of credit for managing to make the match itself turn out to be decent.

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Originally Posted by KO Bossy View Post
He also way over hypes the matches that were good. Brock/Angle was very solid, Rock/Austin 3 was as well and Jericho/HBK was MOTN, IMO. However, in terms of importance, outcome build, NOTHING on the WM19 card can hold a candle to Rock/Austin 2.
When was I ever denying any of this? I was talking about the wrestling aspect, NOTHING MORE. That is it. You guys can't bring out all this irrelevant bullshit and expect me to think it makes a difference. It doesn't.

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Originally Posted by KO Bossy View Post
On the whole, 17 had the better wrestling (and that includes everything-not just technicality), better storytelling, better hype, better crowd, more important matches, better buys, and overall the best matches. Every match on that card had a built up story and all of the stories had a conclusion or satisfying way of continuing the feud. That's the point of WM, to be that season finale of the wrestling year and 17 did that better than 19 did.
WM 17 had a lot of great wrestling, yes, but for as many good matches, they had almost as many bad or worthless matches, the part you cannot deny. The fact you're trying to make excuses for that pretty much shows that you know I am right. The only thing I have convinced myself of is that, when talking about consistency, WM 19 consistently had better wrestling than WM 17 did, and if you deny that, then you don't understand the concept of the word "consistency". And WM 19 definitely had a shit ton of great wrestling, and imo beats out WM 17 as a whole. The atmosphere of course was better, as was the crowd. And yes they had more important matches. But none of that is relevant to what I am trying to say. If you can't understand that, then I can't help you.
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Old 10-11-2013, 10:51 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

In the Moment = 17
On DVD = 19.

19 is one of my favorites of all time. 17 I do find overrated, but the show meant more at the time.
Honestly, for me 17's real re-watchable match is the TLC match.

Mania 19's undercard brought it. I really don't fast forward to much when I watch that show.
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Old 10-12-2013, 02:10 AM   #55 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

Yeh WM 19 was way better in my eyes.It even had the better Rock/Austin match, as well as 2 other classics in HBK/Y2J and Angle/Lesnar. It isn't without its faults though, Taker had a completely throwaway match and I didn't think Hogan/Vince was as good as Vince/Shane at 17. Also, that Miller Lite catfight girls skit was downright awful.

Meanwhile, 17's low points were Tazz and the APA vs RTC, Eddie/Test, Chyna/Ivory and the gimmick battle royal. It had TLC 2 which will go down as one of the greatest matches of all time and Angle/Benoit was brilliant too but apart from that I would not label any of the other matches as classics on a quality basis.

WM 19 takes it for me.
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Old 10-12-2013, 09:25 AM   #56 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ninealevyn View Post
In the Moment = 17
On DVD = 19.


19 is one of my favorites of all time. 17 I do find overrated, but the show meant more at the time.
Honestly, for me 17's real re-watchable match is the TLC match.

Mania 19's undercard brought it. I really don't fast forward to much when I watch that show.
In a way you could probably say this, I personally did not feel the same way, but I digress.
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Old 10-12-2013, 09:30 AM   #57 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

Tbh, I wouldn't even call WrestleMania 19 the best PPV in 2003. Vengeance 2003 was easily better.
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Old 10-12-2013, 10:05 AM   #58 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

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Originally Posted by SLIM SHADY LP™ View Post
Tbh, I wouldn't even call WrestleMania 19 the best PPV in 2003. Vengeance 2003 was easily better.
Seriously? The one that had Sable vs Stephanie McMahon and Vince McMahon vs the one legged dude? Don't get me wrong the main event kicked ass in so many ways, but really? Please do enlighten me.
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Oh A Swagger push? Give it 3 hours and he'll be behind bars again. This time around it will be for driving while firing a rocket launcher from atop a tank into an orphanage full of down syndrome kids waiting for Cena for their make-a-wish.
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Old 10-12-2013, 10:32 AM   #59 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

Great WM, but 17 was better and the best WM card of all time.
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Old 10-12-2013, 10:32 AM   #60 (permalink)
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Default Re: WrestleMania 19: The greatest WrestleMania of all time? (long read)

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Originally Posted by TheGMofGods View Post
Seriously? The one that had Sable vs Stephanie McMahon and Vince McMahon vs the one legged dude? Don't get me wrong the main event kicked ass in so many ways, but really? Please do enlighten me.
Eddie Guerrero vs Chris Benoit
TWGTT vs Rey Mysterio & Billy Kidman
The Undertaker vs John Cena
Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle vs The Big Show

Four great matches that are at the ★★★3/4-★★★★ range for me. There's also a fun APA Invitational Bar Room Brawl and a solid match between Ultimo Dragon and Chris Kanyon on the pre-show. Even the Vince McMahon vs Zack Gowen and Stephanie McMahon vs Sable matches weren't as bad as I expected it to be. They were terrible from an in-ring perspective but still watchable.

With WrestleMania 19, I only found three matches from that show to be great with everything else being average/bad.
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