Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFETIME - Page 164 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Indy Wrestling, Debate League, Women of Wrestling Forums
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post #1631 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-08-2013, 11:52 PM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

Where did that car pic come from?
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post #1632 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 12:05 AM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

What I tell you guys before? Cena's turning heel, and I'm not some troll who claims to "know backstage stuff", I just looked at the proof and examined carefully with logic.

Key Points,

1. Cena never had the Opportunity to turn Heel Before,

Anything before 2010 doesn't count as 1, PG era was brand new and the current cena superman style character just started in 2008-2009ish and 2010 was about the middle of the pg era.

So we start with 2010.

in 2010 he beat batista and had nothing to gain(when he had the orange shirt), was at his height.

Nexus - it was 2010, PG era was new, they had nobody else, and wwe made it obvious that he wasn't turning(he was at his 2nd colored t shirt at the time, pg cena was fresh)

2011 - they were building to wrestlemania 28, impossibility

Embrace the hate, just a tease, if he was turning heel, we wouldn't have known, it would've been a surprise with minor hints.

Wrestlemania 28 - it was miami and rock just came back, no way was cena winning and no signs of him turning(he wasn't mad after the loss at wm 27, and wasn't as desperate, he was like rocky balboa in this match with the I need to win, etc)

However now he does.

Wrestlemania 29 - obvious heel stuff here from the evidence, cena is desperate, life has become ruin(in storyline), look at his face at the end, the rock exposed him, he's had a bad year, is acting like a whiner instead of the cena we know that dust himself off and tries again, this cena is angry about his loss, and had hate on his face when the rock told him how it is.

So there ya go he never had the chance to turn heel

2, In the promo on raw he was obviously angry and had hate on his face(not obvious tease like "embarace" the hate but for real this time, rock compares him to the phony lance armstrong, etc,

Quote:
Originally Posted by SavedByChrist94 View Post
Look at the promo from raw and tell me he's not turning heel.

lets examine,



Lets start off in the beginning with fact that Cena says that Wrestlemania 28 sent his life into a tailspin, obvious if his life went down the drain because of that match he's going do anything it takes to ensure it doesn't happen again.

Then at 2:10 he says he's not throwing this chance away, hmm.

Then please look at 5:40 and on and please try to tell me he's not turning heel, this is uncharacteristic of cena, he usually laughs this stuff off, he has not just anger is his face but hate.

Remember Wrestlemania 17?

Look at the signs,

austin returned and tryed all throughout 2000 to get the wwf title and revenge, and when he finds the guy who masterminded it, he loses to him at no way out in '01, then look at the promo with austin/rock the day after no way out 2001,



Look at 8:43, it was the EXACT same promo at the end. come one guys cena is turning heel.

most likely vince wants to redo the austin heel turn because it failed in 2001, this time he wants to do it right.
and

3, The Rock will be at extreme rules, having him lose twice cleanly is impossible, there is nothing to gain and it's damaging so, only 2 possibilities.

1, Cena wins uncleanly via heel turn at wrestlemania, then at the rematch in extreme rules, loses again uncleanly(like wrestlemania 17 and night after)

2, The Rock wins again at wrestlemania and cena wins the rematch

if the rock loses he then has to face Cena again, he cannot face someone else because of the wwe title rematch clause, so those are the only two possibilities, the latter is most likely not happening and all the evidence points to 1, therefore watch out because john cena is turning heel and remember I wasn't looking for a heel turn, I thought cena would just win cleanly at mania, but with promo on raw and The rock being at extreme rules, cenas turning heel.


you disagree? then you must refute each point, saying he's the golden boy means nothing because austin was the golden boy in 01 yet they turned him heel for no reason, when the rock was leaving after mania 17 and with no other babyface on par. with cena there is no excuse, he will sell more t shirts as a heel(nwo), and his kid fans are probably teenagers now guys, my 15(going to be 16 year old brother was a cena fan in 2003/2004(thugnomics) as kid, now hes entering adulthood and he doesn't even care about cena,

the kids from 2009-2011 are probably also now 13-17


EDIT: Even more proof, wwe's june ppv will probably be called 'payback', http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...r-view-payback

come on guys, never before has cena had evidence for a heel turn, never, only because people wanted it or "felt" it, now that it's evident, everyones saying "impossible" etc, vince got you all, that was probably why he waited so long for a heel turn so you wouldn't expect it.

Last edited by SavedByChrist94; 03-09-2013 at 04:42 AM.
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post #1633 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 05:18 AM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazayum View Post
It makes sense for Cena to turn heel but I don't see him turning heel at a filler Mania.
wwe won't do a big heel turn at wrestlemania 30, no way we're leaving wrestlemania 30 without a celebration, so it's heel turn now or wait til 2015, the latter is unlikely, therefore he's turning heel at this mania.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stone Hot View Post
I say this with all the cena heel turn threads. Ill see it to believe but to the people who say hes never turning well never say never cena will be heel one day before he retires. Back on topic i like the comparisons to Austin back in 2001 the question is if cena does turn heel at WM 29 how does he do it?

Remember last year at wrestlemania 28, during rock/cena near the end, cena looked like he was contemplating something? I honestly at that very moment thought cena was turning heel, however he took his wrist pads to mock the rock and lost the match.

well cena has that exact face, he can't win, and he ain't losing his life again like 2012, so what does he do? he either snaps and cheats, or gets re-enforcement.

what I would do is this, make him snap at mania 29 and let him beat rock via heel turn(low blow), yelling "I can't do it", get a chair etc, shield comes out of the blue, lights go off, referee gets knocked out, shield holds rocky while cena hits him, and referee counts earl hebner style, cena wins the wwe title for the first time since 2011 via heel turn, cena starts yelling and screaming, "I did it! I'm back, and what?" etc, tells the shield "i love you guys"

vince mcmahon(promoter and rockys boy) comes out and says "what is this", and cena hits him too(will get extreme heat for hitting vince), rock gets up and gets rock bottomed, attitude adjusted, mocked, etc, they show cena and his boys go up the ramp, while jerry lawler stays speechless, michael cole says this is the worst night in history, the end of an era, career thrown in the trash etc. everybody takes their headsets off in disbelief.

they show the rock being assisted by medical personal, rock leaves and then they show the empty ring with the crowd screaming(or booing), fade to black, wwe logo, and that's it end of the pg era and cena era, it ran it's course.(2008-2013 for pg era is too long,(ET era was 2002-2007 and AE was 97-01),cena era was 2005-2013(way too long, look at hogan, he became the man in 85 but lets be real wasn't big til wm III, 87 was the year so 87-96, 9 years, however after 92 the boom was over so more like 85-92 or 87-92

cena has been the guy since 05, that's already passing hogan(if you count realistically from 87 to 92 would be 2 more years than hogan) or at least equal to hogan(from 85 would be 8 years to 92 making them even)

cena's turning. after that they can do all kinds of stuff. maybe instead of shield joining cena, randy orton(rumored to turn heel) actually joins his arch rival john cena in the john cena heel turn against the rock, setting wm 30 to be randy/rock.

who knows how they'll do it, but all evidence and logic(such as the promo where cena looked like a heel and rock exposed him, and cena being angry and desperate, cena having no one to face throughout the year, rock being at extreme rules, rock not losing twice to cena, rocks not going to look stupid etc)

Last edited by SavedByChrist94; 03-09-2013 at 05:44 AM.
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post #1634 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 05:23 AM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

Quote:
Originally Posted by SavedByChrist94 View Post
wwe won't do a big heel turn at wrestlemania 30, no way we're leaving wrestlemania 30 without a celebration, so it's heel turn now or wait til 2015, the latter is unlikely, therefore he's turning heel at this mania.
-If John Cena doesn't turn heel against Rock;Rock's return has been of no use.

-Comes back for a few matches,PPV buys increases,loses to Cena.Cena remains as face.Everything back to normal

-John Cena turning heel against Rock-It doesn't get bigger than this for Cena.Do it WWE
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post #1635 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 05:52 AM
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Re: Proof and Evidence that John Cena Will turn Heel at Wrestlemania 29

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Originally Posted by NoLeafClover View Post
I would argue that gives Cena all the more momentum as a top villian if he were to turn at Wrestlemania. A top heel that can't be stopped is something WWE has failed to create in years...about a decade actually.

And Austin won the Rumble in '01...just an FYI...



I don't think the turn in this case is about a superstar being turned on, but rather the "Cenation" being turned in. One could argue that Austin turned on the people, but I would beg to differ as I think it was a completely different situation. Austin, while a hero, was never a fighter for, or defender of the people. His character was a lone wolf, anti- hero, that was always in it for himself. The fans were more or less just along for the ride, where as with a babyface like Rock, Hogan or Cena, the fans are what fuel them. The People/Hulkamaniacs/Cenation are just as important a part of those characters as the ideas they fought for. But Austin? He was different and his turn on Rock was truely done for his gain, not to prove anything to the fans...because for the Austin character, it never was about the fans to begin with.

I think the OP makes some good points, but I think too much is being put on "what Austin did". While there are similarities, the turn of John Cena (whenever it does happen) will be different from those of Austin and Hogan because the motives are so dradtically different. If Austin had faced HHH at Wrestlemania 17 and went to desperate measures to beat him, then a parrallel could be drawn between Cena and Rock - but that's not what happened. Austin faced Rock, who he had already beat at Wrestlemania for the title, two years prior so he wasn't trying to avenge anything. He wanted the WWF title back and was going to do whatever he had to to do so. Cena needs this win, not for the title, but to finish what he failed to finish the year before in the "biggest match of his career". Cena is not fighting for the fans going into Wrestlemania 29, or even the boys in the back like many would say he was doing last year, but rather he's fighting for himself. THAT is the biggest change I'm seeing in Cena right now, and think is the greatest possible indicator for a heel turn to ensure he gets the job done this year.

As many others on the thread have stated, I'll believe it when I see it. However, I do think the possibility for it is stronger than ever as I think WWE realizes two things. #1: There are/will be very few ways and opportunities in which Cena can be turned at this point...the stage has to be the biggest (only Mania will suffice) and the opponent has to be larger than he is (which at this point is only Rock). #2: Rock vs Cena II is far too predictable. Something needs to go down in this match to add the flare to it that it currently doesn't have. WWE needs something huge to carry the company post Mania once the likes of Rock/Taker/HHH go away, and a fresh John Cena as the top villian in the company (as WWE Champion mind you) could be just the answer they are looking for.
That would be a good heel promo, "last year I did it for you guys, and it got me nowhere, because I cared for what you thought, just before I mocked the rock's peoples elbow at mania 28(remember the look on his face before he mocked rocks elbow, as if he was going to turn heel), I was contemplating on cheating, but then i thought of all of you, so i changed my mind and committed the greatest error in my life, for what? for you, I lost my wife because of you, my confidence, my hustle, my loyalty to myself and my respect, I had the worst year of my life, and when i finally think forget the "cenation" and fight for myself and do what it takes(cheat, heel turn at mania) I finally beat the rock, so I'm done with y'all, because ya'll got me nowhere, my time is now." something like that.
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post #1636 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 08:14 AM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

I feel this feud is similar to the plot of the movie "Rocky II" except the roles of Creed and Rocky are reversed to where The Rock plays a Rocky (except as a champion) and Cena as Creed who is hungry, tired of people saying it was a fluke loss, wanting to prove his worth, that he needs that rematch and to hell with the consequences.

Anyway, I don't buy this redemption angle at all mainly because he's not clear that he's redeeming anything except his pride.

I mean, wasn't it him who wanted The Rock in the first place? What actually is he redeeming? Confidence, his self worth? His fans? A chance to rewrite the history books? Oh Cena after years of winning, being handed championships and title shots you want to rewrite the history on your only major loss as if were a blot, a fluke, something that didn't really happen. Sorry it doesn't work like that. This loss you had Cena was charma and it came around and bit you on the ass, and now you want a rematch because you don't like the bitter taste of losing.

I wish The Rock had called out his "redemption" line and called for what it really was, something like -- "Redemption? Seriously? Redemption? Wasn't it you, John Cena, who wanted that match? Wasn't it you, John Cena who went around the world, from pillar to post talking to anyone who'd listen saying 'Where's the Rock? Why did he have to leave? Why isn't The Rock here?' -- well John Cena I came back just like you asked -- you got your ass handed to you. Redemption? Redemption?! No, no, no Cena; this isn't redemption, this is the John Cena Worldwide Apology tour"
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post #1637 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 08:31 AM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

Quote:
Originally Posted by austin316 G.O.A.T View Post
-If John Cena doesn't turn heel against Rock;Rock's return has been of no use.

-Comes back for a few matches,PPV buys increases,loses to Cena.Cena remains as face.Everything back to normal

-John Cena turning heel against Rock-It doesn't get bigger than this for Cena.Do it WWE
That's exactly what is gonna happen. This is just Vince trying to get Cena over more again. Make more money then back to normal. Other than money, Rocks return will have no impact at all.

"Stand...while you still can. You are a weak and disgusting people. If I am alone, so be it. I no longer desire to be a part of your bickering commune. This desert will bury your monuments. History shall sweep you under - a forgotten people. And know this - that is when I will return. For I shall be there at the end."

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post #1638 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 11:53 AM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

To be honest the promo segment was pretty good but unless a certain superstar turns i won't care

I'm a fan of these two i don't give a fuck
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post #1639 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 11:54 AM
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Cena rapping again about Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson is something I really want to see in this buildup



When you see the smile from Stephanie's face you already know the winner of this match .

P.S. Sry for the double-post

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Last edited by Clique; 03-09-2013 at 12:32 PM. Reason: double post
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post #1640 of 3421 (permalink) Old 03-09-2013, 12:54 PM
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Re: Official The Rock vs. John Cena Thread: Greatness vs. Redemption, TWICE IN A LIFE

I re-watched the promo from Monday and this picture is revealing to me:



That's the look of a man that will do ANYTHING not to lose. There's a difference between Cena trying to do everything to win and everything not to lose. I really believe Cena will win doing something that will get the Universe to look at him differently, and not for the right reasons.

Hey Smarks, You MAD?
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