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Old 11-17-2012, 03:17 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

Not in the company, and who gives a shit? Where was Stone Cold when Bret Hart won his first world title? I guess Austin not being in the company then means Bret is the bigger star according to your logic.

Yeah, he faced all of those guys, and never went over, if Hogan and Goldberg were in the company today, Punk would be facing them just like Lesnar if he was full time today. Talking about facing Rock is irrelevant, Rock was still a regular member of the roster and it wasn't an honor to face him like it is now when his time is so rare, not to mention it was a tag match, so who cares. Punk is getting Rock at the biggest level he's ever been, he's a legitimate movie star, in the top 5 highest paid actors on Earth is what I heard reported, at a major PPV after a GIGANTIC title reign (whether he loses the title before then or not, which he won't). You'll never see Rock waste his time with a loser like Orton he won't be able to draw with today.

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#1 - That's subjective and I also rank HBK above Orton but still... to create a star, you continue pushing instead of giving up.
And they did, when he was ready (I say ready in the backstage, personal life context, obviously not in the wrestling context). Pushing a guy when he's 24 is stupid anyway, most of the time, because they usually aren't mature enough and let the success go to their head, like he did.

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#3 - To be honest, in 2004, after Lesnar walked out, they were desperately looking for a new guy to become #1 since HHH was the heel. They eventually did that with Cena and Batista but first it was Orton and let's just say they mishandled it.
He couldn't handle it. Both from a life standpoint and from a personal standpoint, it's not WWE's fault. I guarantee you Vince has been kicking himself for 8 years that he couldn't make Orton his #1 guy and it KILLS him that it's John Cena, I guarantee it.

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As for him being built up... if he was as terrible as you make him out to be, I'm pretty sure fans would have eventually stopped giving a fuck in the end. But they obviously see something in Orton that they continue to react to him even when comes back from a suspension or never gets to talk on a mic to connect with the crowd or anything other than random matches.
Yeah, they see an incessent 10 years of pushing, that's what they see. Like I said, he's like Michaels or Bret Hart, people will react to them if they're already there, they won't specifically come to see him, he can't DRAW anyone into the building, he can only elicit cheers from the diehards that would go to the shows whether he ever existed or not, that's not special. And honest to god, his pops aren't even that big anymore, so I don't know what you're talking about. He's not John Cena or Ryback level over, not even CLOSE, not now.

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say he has charisma because my definition of the word is being able to get people to notice you and that's exactly what has happened with Orton. You want an example of somebody getting everything handed to them? Look no further than Alberto del Rio. And despite all the achievements, Alberto can't get a crowd to react to him for more than some cheap heat by insulting the city or something.
Being able to get people to "notice you" is easy, so I wouldn't assign such a definition to charisma. I don't see how anybody can think Del Rio doesn't have charisma based on a crowd reaction is beyond me, his mannerisms, actions, etc are top of the line and he speaks in such a way that it's obvious he's charismatic, but it's not that funny ha ha charisma that people like Rock have. Whatever, though. Del Rio got everything handed to him, I won't deny that, but I WOULD'VE handed everything too him because look at him, he's got the look, he can wrestle his ass off, he can talk (I don't care if people deny it, and you will, vehemently I'm sure, I haven't the time to argue. He CAN talk), he plays the assigned gimmick to him perfectly, and WWE doesn't utilize the gimmick well, they don't do anything with him but he still plays that part exceptionally. He's got everything you should want in a main eventer except the crowd reaction, but to be honest, the crowd doesn't matter in 2012 unless you're the face of the company, because at this point, it's PURELY the brand itself that draws, not the individual unless, like I said you're Cena. Del Rio, Orton, Punk, etc, it doesn't matter, they're all gonna do the same job, just in a less talented or more talented manner, depending on which one you are.

Furthermore, Del Rio's gimmick, as I mentioned, has been COMPLETELY mishandled and despite getting handed a lot, he never wins any big time matches like Orton, so who gives a shit? He choked at WrestleMania, he choked at Extreme Rules in his first 2 title shots, he rarely ever wins on PPV. His push has flopped back and forth so many times that I'm hardly surprised he's not over to the level he should be. They never mishandled Orton once he got on the ground, it was full on, he's the top heel, the end. Of course you get different results.

I don't even care enough to dissect the promos, I've been at this too long, but I know those promos and I'm still not gonna change my opinion. The guy just can't carry a promo, if you compare him to anybody who's respected on the mic you'll see why.
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:18 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

Quote:
Originally Posted by greendayedgehead View Post
Time will tell on that one, it's only two months until they start prepping the important angles for RTWM 2013. If you look at the logistics of it though, it's not looking in his favour. Rock, Brock and Cena have already been billed as the main attractions. In all likeliness Punk will join them somewhere in that fold. They're still very keen on the idea of Sheamus as a top guy, and of course who could forget Ryback. I don't see any opening for Orton anywhere in there, unless they turned him heel and put him against Sheamus.

He was wrestling in the indies.

well , thank you for the information bro, do you agree with ortonīs career has been better than cm punkīs career?
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:21 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

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Originally Posted by Tyrion Lannister View Post
Not in the company, and who gives a shit? Where was Stone Cold when Bret Hart won his first world title? I guess Austin not being in the company then means Bret is the bigger star according to your logic.

Yeah, he faced all of those guys, and never went over, if Hogan and Goldberg were in the company today, Punk would be facing them just like Lesnar if he was full time today. Talking about facing Rock is irrelevant, Rock was still a regular member of the roster and it wasn't an honor to face him like it is now when his time is so rare, not to mention it was a tag match, so who cares. Punk is getting Rock at the biggest level he's ever been, he's a legitimate movie star, in the top 5 highest paid actors on Earth is what I heard reported, at a major PPV after a GIGANTIC title reign (whether he loses the title before then or not, which he won't). You'll never see Rock waste his time with a loser like Orton he won't be able to draw with today.


orton and the rock had heat backstage, in 2004 wwe hint a match between this two http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sH2aXOq_W4

and I will tell you something orton as heel in his prime vs the rock sell more than cm punk vs the rock now, and I think im not the only one here that think this

and by the way cm punk will never go over the rock, maybe cena, but punk never
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:25 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

^It's useless to speculate on things like that.
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well , thank you for the information bro, do you agree with ortonīs career has been better than cm punkīs career?
Hm, tough call. I'd say Orton probably has more classic matches under his belt due to sheer longevity. I think in terms of significance overall, Punk edges him out.
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:29 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

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Originally Posted by greendayedgehead View Post
^It's useless to speculate on things like that.


Hm, tough call. I'd say Orton probably has more classic matches under his belt due to sheer longevity. I think in terms of significance overall, Punk edges him out.

but I think orton wins here, one example. cm punk is wwe champion the worst era ever in wrestling , even in 2008 when orton was the champ, raw scored better ratings
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:33 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ImuYxtptC4 great promo
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:43 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

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Originally Posted by frankieorton View Post
orton and the rock had heat backstage, in 2004 wwe hint a match between this two http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sH2aXOq_W4

and I will tell you something orton as heel in his prime vs the rock sell more than cm punk vs the rock now, and I think im not the only one here that think this

and by the way cm punk will never go over the rock, maybe cena, but punk never
I guess we'll never know though, will we, because Rock is giving Punk the time of day and is ignoring Orton.

It's not about going over, it's about having the match and the moment they create. I wouldn't expect the guy who beat Hogan, Stone Cold and John Cena at WrestleMania, all 100% clean, to lose to CM Punk, I also wouldn't expect him to lose to Ryback, to Randy Orton, to Sheamus, Big Show, whoever else you want to throw into the hat of names. It's ROCK.

However, I will say, it is possible, virtually impossible, but with the mindset WWE has, it is POSSIBLE that Punk goes over Rock, because it's SO predictable that Rock is going to win that match that WWE may swerve us, then they have Rock win the Rumble, they have Cena win the Elimination Chamber and take the title from Punk, which sets up a 3 way at Mania where Cena pins Rock and gets his win back. Rock is probably going to win but I wouldn't be surprised if they found a way to extend this further.
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:46 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

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Originally Posted by Tyrion Lannister View Post
I guess we'll never know though, will we, because Rock is giving Punk the time of day and is ignoring Orton.

It's not about going over, it's about having the match and the moment they create. Hogan didn't go over Rock, I guess he should've walked off then right?


in 2006 hogan vs orton, happened why not cm punk vs hogan in 2006? lOL
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:49 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

Because Punk was a rookie in WWE?

Orton was losing to Bob Holly in his rookie year for fucks sake. Have some perspective. If you're a guy like Hogan, you don't work with a rookie on a part time schedule, it's not a big money dream match. Today is a COMPLETELY different story.
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:51 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2013 The age of orton returns????

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Originally Posted by Tyrion Lannister View Post
Because Punk was a rookie in WWE?

Orton was losing to Bob Holly in his rookie year for fucks sake. Have some perspective.
im going to finish arguing with you, one thing is for sure, randy ortonīs career so far is more impresive than cm punkīs career
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