2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - GAME OVER YEEEAAAHHH!!!!!!! - Page 379 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:12 AM   #3781 (permalink)
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Yeah but we play much better football and Roy hodgeson came out with the dumb comment after dumb comment.
Frankly at least Under Rodgers they look like they give a shit. Didn't even feel like they were even trying at times under Hodgson
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:13 AM   #3782 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

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Isnt it? Or do you think PSG is bigger than Marseille too? Team isnt equal to club
That is an absolutely woeful comparison. Villa last won a major trophy thirty years ago. Marseille were ligue 1 champions only two years ago.

There has to be a cut off point when it comes to relying purely on history for club status. I agree that history should be a deciding factor when it comes to seperating clubs that have a similar recent history, but when your success, attendances and relevancy are all dwindling then it's far reaching to call yourself a big club. Villa have a big history but I certainly wouldn't call them a big club anymore, more of a sleeping giant. Is one European Cup win thirty years ago enough to cement big big club status? If so then Chelsea must be a big club, otherwise it's hypocritical to say that they aren't.

At least with clubs like Liverpool you can say that they won the UEFA cup just over a decade ago and the Champion's League only seven years ago, despite being poor in the last few years. They were also challenging for the top four places in the premier league not so long ago. Any clubs that have dominated eras of European football should have some kind of grand recognition because it's a rarity, so Liverpool will always be a big club in that sense.

I guess it's really hard to define what makes a club 'big' in modern football, so many different factors are involved so it's not as if you can make a definitive check list of what needs to have been accomplished. It's probably premature to call Citeh a big club, but they have laid the foundations in order to become one in the future. Regardless of this, they're one of the most powerful clubs around because money speaks volumes in football.

Staying on the subject of dismissing clubs as being big due to the avaiability of money, are we saying that Real aren't a big club due to alfonso XIII and Franco's involvement? Just curious to see what people say on that one, considering 'Ziggs' thinks that big clubs should not be built on riches.
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Old 12-27-2012, 12:48 PM   #3783 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

Fergie says should feature on saturday


waiting for him on friday to say he will start training on monday instead
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Old 12-27-2012, 01:38 PM   #3784 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

Great news to have Kagawa finally back, was hoping he would maybe take a wide spot off Valencia or Young due to them being shite, but he will probably take Rooney's spot now.
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Old 12-27-2012, 01:58 PM   #3785 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

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Originally Posted by AndreBaker View Post
That is an absolutely woeful comparison. Villa last won a major trophy thirty years ago. Marseille were ligue 1 champions only two years ago.

There has to be a cut off point when it comes to relying purely on history for club status. I agree that history should be a deciding factor when it comes to seperating clubs that have a similar recent history, but when your success, attendances and relevancy are all dwindling then it's far reaching to call yourself a big club. Villa have a big history but I certainly wouldn't call them a big club anymore, more of a sleeping giant. Is one European Cup win thirty years ago enough to cement big big club status? If so then Chelsea must be a big club, otherwise it's hypocritical to say that they aren't.

At least with clubs like Liverpool you can say that they won the UEFA cup just over a decade ago and the Champion's League only seven years ago, despite being poor in the last few years. They were also challenging for the top four places in the premier league not so long ago. Any clubs that have dominated eras of European football should have some kind of grand recognition because it's a rarity, so Liverpool will always be a big club in that sense.

I guess it's really hard to define what makes a club 'big' in modern football, so many different factors are involved so it's not as if you can make a definitive check list of what needs to have been accomplished. It's probably premature to call Citeh a big club, but they have laid the foundations in order to become one in the future. Regardless of this, they're one of the most powerful clubs around because money speaks volumes in football.

Staying on the subject of dismissing clubs as being big due to the avaiability of money, are we saying that Real aren't a big club due to alfonso XIII and Franco's involvement? Just curious to see what people say on that one, considering 'Ziggs' thinks that big clubs should not be built on riches.
A) I didnt said that Villa was a big club either, because it never had that long spawn of glorious conquists in Europe, like the majority of the big clubs did like Madrid 50's, Benfica 60's, Bayern 70's etc You simply can't compare the big clubes in Europe that i talked about, like Ajax with a Manchester City, just cant, but in the end what rules modern football is the money, so its natural that clubs like Chelsea, City, PSG or Malaga start gaining relevance on the European panoram.

B) They were spanish, they really liked Madrid, well not Franco because political interests spoked higher at the time, but they were built on people who loved their clubs, like Juventus. The really proud thing of me being a Benfica fan is that Benfica never had any helps, the first Estadio da Luz,i think you know him, was built by Benfica's associateds, with donations and even manual work.
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Old 12-27-2012, 02:10 PM   #3786 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

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A) I didnt said that Villa was a big club either, because it never had that long spawn of glorious conquists in Europe, like the majority of the big clubs did like Madrid 50's, Benfica 60's, Bayern 70's etc You simply can't compare the big clubes in Europe that i talked about, like Ajax with a Manchester City, just cant, but in the end what rules modern football is the money, so its natural that clubs like Chelsea, City, PSG or Malaga start gaining relevance on the European panoram.

B) They were spanish, they really liked Madrid, well not Franco because political interests spoked higher at the time, but they were built on people who loved their clubs, like Juventus. The really proud thing of me being a Benfica fan is that Benfica never had any helps, the first Estadio da Luz,i think you know him, was built by Benfica's associateds, with donations and even manual work.
A) You were quoting a post where I was comparing Villa and Man City, so obviously you've got a bit lost somewhere down the line...I never compared Citeh to clubs like Ajax, that would be unfair. I really don't understand where you're going with a lot of your 'points' seeing as they have nothing to do with anything being discussed at particular times.

B) So it's justifiable because the money was born from love of the club? Buying success is buying success, end of. Nice to see all of these extra parameters included!
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Old 12-27-2012, 02:26 PM   #3787 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

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A) You were quoting a post where I was comparing Villa and Man City, so obviously you've got a bit lost somewhere down the line...I never compared Citeh to clubs like Ajax, that would be unfair. I really don't understand where you're going with a lot of your 'points' seeing as they have nothing to do with anything being discussed at particular times.

B) So it's justifiable because the money was born from love of the club? Buying success is buying success, end of. Nice to see all of these extra parameters included!

A) Comparing in a national term its fair, because Villa is bigger than City, just like Hamburg is bigger than Bayer Leverkusen that was a product of the pharmaceutical giant, european wide its an obvious answer.

B) Benfica never had a strong investment from anyone but still managed to be a big European club, and then are other cases like Madrid that started to winning because they had more money, but you should know that is in the foundation of a club, they did started winning from the beggining without any statal help, and the difference between a club like Madrid and City or even Chelsea, is that they stay with their associatdes, there are no owners, their origin is in their supporters.
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Old 12-27-2012, 03:19 PM   #3788 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

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A) Comparing in a national term its fair, because Villa is bigger than City, just like Hamburg is bigger than Bayer Leverkusen that was a product of the pharmaceutical giant, european wide its an obvious answer.

B) Benfica never had a strong investment from anyone but still managed to be a big European club, and then are other cases like Madrid that started to winning because they had more money, but you should know that is in the foundation of a club, they did started winning from the beggining without any statal help, and the difference between a club like Madrid and City or even Chelsea, is that they stay with their associatdes, there are no owners, their origin is in their supporters.
A) I've already answered why this is an irrelevant point. Are Forest and Derby bigger than Citeh. There has to be a cut off point.

B) ...but Madrid had strong links with the state when the club first formed.
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Old 12-27-2012, 03:50 PM   #3789 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

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As a Gunner, I'd rather City win it
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But they raided your squad.
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Old 12-27-2012, 03:50 PM   #3790 (permalink)
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Default Re: 2012-13 English Premier League/Cups Thread - Where attempted murder happens

Walters' 2nd goal against Liverpool has to be one of the best of the League season.
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