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post #161 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 12:44 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

Oh I forgot, she is from Sanford, Florida, which is 30 mins from Orlando. Wrestlemania 33 is in Orlando . . . you're all smart enough. It's the it's her hometown (but not really) reason.
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post #162 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 01:07 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

I don't think Naomi deserves it right now. That's the problem I have. She was injured for 2 months and just comes back and gets a title shot and wins it with 3 weeks of build. If she had at least a couple of months of build then fine, but now it just looks like they just put the title on her because her "hometown" is at Mania this year. Which is a stupid reason. If they take the belt off her at Maina(likely) or after quick how does that help the division? Especially doesn't help Naomi. Just makes the belt look like a useless prop when they just give the title away for dumb reasons and not because they truly earned it.

I don't care how long she's been with the company. I care what she's doing right now and that's what matters. In just 3 weeks that's a hard sell for me to believe anyone's championship worthy or deserves it.

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post #163 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 03:32 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

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Originally Posted by ColeStar View Post
Actually, no, I've never said any such thing about Naomi. Not even once. You've also got no good reason whatsover to assume I would have said such a thing.



How precisely have you deduced that I am fragile? Because I dared to point out the fact - not an opinion - that many on here immediately pointed to Naomi's race as the sole or primary factor for her title win?

Utterly ludicrous.
Is also a fact - not an opinion - that she was gifted a title run from completely out of nowhere due to it being FEB and WM coming up in her home town.
And people who deny this are fragile and shy away from the truth.

Tell me this - Why do you think she was given a title run from completely out of nowhere ? No runup, no feud, no story line, nothing. Just comes back from a months long injury, then waltzes in and handed 3 clean wins over Bliss.
[tipoff for me for the WM part at least was the announcers for 3 weeks straight, up to and including the Raw title match, kept repeating that WM is in her home down, and how nice it would be if she walked in Orlando as champ]
They just don't drop those little hints for nothing, they obviously knew the script well in advance and were told to prep the audience with these not so subtle hints.

As far as the black history month part, its pretty obvious but of course no way to actually prove it short of an admission from Vince. Wouldn't be the 1st FEB title gifted to a black performer, won't be the last. I trust you do notice their incessant black segments during FEB - Alls you really need to do is put 2+2 together.

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post #164 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 04:12 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

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Originally Posted by LowRida View Post
Is also a fact - not an opinion - that she was gifted a title run from completely out of nowhere due to it being FEB and WM coming up in her home town.
And people who deny this are fragile and shy away from the truth.

Tell me this - Why do you think she was given a title run from completely out of nowhere ? No runup, no feud, no story line, nothing. Just comes back from a months long injury, then waltzes in and handed 3 clean wins over Bliss.
[tipoff for me for the WM part at least was the announcers for 3 weeks straight, up to and including the Raw title match, kept repeating that WM is in her home down, and how nice it would be if she walked in Orlando as champ]
They just don't drop those little hints for nothing, they obviously knew the script well in advance and were told to prep the audience with these not so subtle hints.

As far as the black history month part, its pretty obvious but of course no way to actually prove it short of an admission from Vince. Wouldn't be the 1st FEB title gifted to a black performer, won't be the last. I trust you do notice their incessant black segments during FEB - Alls you really need to do is put 2+2 together.
You seem unable to discern the definition of the words 'fact' and 'fragile'.

It being Black History Month may well have played into the decision. It would be silly of me to insist otherwise because I was not party to the decision-making process.

Likewise, neither were you involved in the process nor do you have first-hand knowledge of what occurred, so you cannot speak accurately about the facts of what took place. Of course you can have suspicions and beliefs, even be very sure of what you think happened. But you can't call them facts, because a belief or suspicion - no matter how strong or well-founded - is not the same as a fact.

Also, someone disbelieving your version of events or disagreeing with your opinion does not equate to them being fragile. The two have absolutely no correlation.

To return to the issue of Naomi's title win and the reasons behind it, for your sake, again I will concede that Black History Month may well have been a factor. However, consider this. As you pointed out, she won the title with little build or story behind it. But this is far from the first time such a thing has ever occurred. Multiple wrestlers and teams from numerous promotions have won championships in similar circumstances before. Do we in all circumstances assume that race must've been the sole or primary motivator behind their wins? Of course not.

Once again, I'm not saying that Black History Month had no bearing on events, but I would encourage you and everyone else to consider all possible influences and factors rather than simply grab eagerly at the low hanging fruit.

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post #165 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 04:16 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

I don't have a problem with her or anything.

I just hate the booking of a rushed push to get a title on a babyface. I would have preferred the heel champ to have a longer run and if Naomi is going to beat her, I would have liked to have her get built up for a longer period of time instead of being a non-factor for months.

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post #166 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 06:03 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

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Originally Posted by ColeStar View Post
You seem unable to discern the definition of the words 'fact' and 'fragile'.

It being Black History Month may well have played into the decision. It would be silly of me to insist otherwise because I was not party to the decision-making process.

Likewise, neither were you involved in the process nor do you have first-hand knowledge of what occurred, so you cannot speak accurately about the facts of what took place. Of course you can have suspicions and beliefs, even be very sure of what you think happened. But you can't call them facts, because a belief or suspicion - no matter how strong or well-founded - is not the same as a fact.

Also, someone disbelieving your version of events or disagreeing with your opinion does not equate to them being fragile. The two have absolutely no correlation.

To return to the issue of Naomi's title win and the reasons behind it, for your sake, again I will concede that Black History Month may well have been a factor. However, consider this. As you pointed out, she won the title with little build or story behind it. But this is far from the first time such a thing has ever occurred. Multiple wrestlers and teams from numerous promotions have won championships in similar circumstances before. Do we in all circumstances assume that race must've been the sole or primary motivator behind their wins? Of course not.

Once again, I'm not saying that Black History Month had no bearing on events, but I would encourage you and everyone else to consider all possible influences and factors rather than simply grab eagerly at the low hanging fruit.

Possible there was, but I doubt if there was a conference where all the WWE honchos got together and said "Hey, you know black history month is coming up, maybe we should toss a bone to minorities and enhance our ad nauseum multi weekly promotions and give a short title run to a black star !" These people know each other well enough, more than likely the script came from the top on short notice, and was implemented without anyone having to get into the reasons behind it, which they already knew with a wink of an eye.

As far as "numerous promotions have won championships in similar circumstances before", care to name some examples ?
You might point to the swaps of Charlotte/Banks, but the swaps themselves developed into a build and angle, and there weren't many if any people saying neither one deserved it or came from out of nowhere. When you have a whole series of champ vs #1 challenger title matches, someone has got to win and its not always going to be the champ.
Cena has had some short reigns lately in the build to make him all time champ, but his at least are plot heavy and designed to put a younger talent over. Outside of that, most title reigns have been relatively stable.

Was probably the ideal time to make such a move though, now or never really. With the brand split and creation of 2 titles, that eases the heat they would have got if she was gifted a unified title over all divas instead of less than half.
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post #167 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 06:48 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

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As far as "numerous promotions have won championships in similar circumstances before", care to name some examples ?
Poor typo on my part, I meant to type 'performers' rather than 'promotions'. Thank you for not making a big deal out of that.

As for the examples, I was hoping we could take it as a given that we accept as wrestling fans that once in a while titles get put on someone or some team seemingly out of nowhere with no build. I'm sure with long enough and sufficient input several examples could be given, though of course individual circumstances would differ and the exact situation is never going to be replicated in its entirety.

From the top of my head the one that comes to mind is Sheamus' first WWE title win, which came over John Cena in a Tables Match. He'd been called up from ECW only recently, he had minimal heat and was placed into a world title match at a time when the fans remained largely indifferent to him. He then won the match, which wasn't in the PPV main event, to everyone's shock. People were so surprised at the lack of build to the title change that I recall as I followed the PPV thread on this forum, loads of people genuinely thought it was either an accidental finish with Cena falling through the table by mistake, or that Cena would come back for a rematch later in the show and win it straight back.

As it turned out neither scenario was true and the case was simply that Vince had given the title to Sheamus at a time that he was still so cold and almost everyone expected it would be a routine Cena win over the latest 'monster of the week' to be fed to him.

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post #168 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 06:55 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

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post #169 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 08:38 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColeStar View Post
Poor typo on my part, I meant to type 'performers' rather than 'promotions'. Thank you for not making a big deal out of that.

As for the examples, I was hoping we could take it as a given that we accept as wrestling fans that once in a while titles get put on someone or some team seemingly out of nowhere with no build. I'm sure with long enough and sufficient input several examples could be given, though of course individual circumstances would differ and the exact situation is never going to be replicated in its entirety.

From the top of my head the one that comes to mind is Sheamus' first WWE title win, which came over John Cena in a Tables Match. He'd been called up from ECW only recently, he had minimal heat and was placed into a world title match at a time when the fans remained largely indifferent to him. He then won the match, which wasn't in the PPV main event, to everyone's shock. People were so surprised at the lack of build to the title change that I recall as I followed the PPV thread on this forum, loads of people genuinely thought it was either an accidental finish with Cena falling through the table by mistake, or that Cena would come back for a rematch later in the show and win it straight back.

As it turned out neither scenario was true and the case was simply that Vince had given the title to Sheamus at a time that he was still so cold and almost everyone expected it would be a routine Cena win over the latest 'monster of the week' to be fed to him.
True, no need to even debate the point that weird title runs out of the blue are not unprecedented or rare.

In the case of Sheamus though, it was used to try to establish an emerging star, so at least it had a valid objective - And we needn't go very far comparing Sheamus with Naomi, I hope you agree. Sheamus was an is close with HHH, he is a great performer and legit tough guy. May be in a charisma/gimmick vacuum but that doesn't take away from his proven performance.

You seem Ok, I'm sorry if I'm a jerk sometimes. I have a major pet peeve against entitlements, and rightly or wrong, that is the way I perceive this whole thing. Is a precedent now established that a home town performer is always going to be a champ at WM ,,, Or is that just for certain people at a certain time of year ?
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post #170 of 252 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 08:52 PM
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Re: Why the weird backlash over Naomi's title win?

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Shes boring, generic, botches a lot, kinda ugly too, no mic, probably got the title for a Total Divas angle shit.

Say what you want about her but she's far from ugly smh.
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