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Old 11-15-2012, 06:27 PM   #791 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

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Originally Posted by The Great Below View Post
Has nothing to do with the commercials, immediately announcing the 8 man tag match and then backstage segments before the tag match. Noooo. Notice how they tallied all those lost viewers to that segment rather than everything between it and the end of the tag match?

People trying to fit numbers into their assumptions, instead of the other way around.
So now we are going to blame everything else, except for the main segment of the quarter? Ok, that sounds awesome.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:41 PM   #792 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

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Originally Posted by Sparta101 View Post
So now we are going to blame everything else, except for the main segment of the quarter? Ok, that sounds awesome.
This isn't difficult to see.

We have:

1. 745k tune in for Punk/Lawler/Foley
2. Vote for the Team Foley member announcement
3. Maddox backstage spot
4. Tag team match announcement
5. Commercials
6. Backstage Punk segment
7. Tag Match (middle)

876k viewers were lost from the #1 to #7, but somehow it's all supposed to be attributed to #1? We're expected to believe that #2-#7 are such rating draws that people weren't tuning out? Look how much Sheamus/Otunga lost (900k+) and you're trying to tell me those between segments were even on that level? Let's get real here.

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Old 11-15-2012, 07:54 PM   #793 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

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Originally Posted by Taker2theMoon View Post
This is why I have no real issues with it, but there will always be folks who still think it is politically incorrect. Just because something taken from real life is mocked in a story line that doesn't mean that that's how anyone in the show truly feels about it. The issue of the heart attack has now become a part of a fictitious story that is turning it into something else entirely. There's nothing wrong with thinking it's messed up to mock someone who had a heart attack generally, but at this rate it's just actors playing their parts now. To those who do take this personally, you had might as well think that Jerry, himself, is messed up for allowing a storyline to be based off of something tragic like this and then that leaves you with no one to feel sorry for really. Maybe Lawler IS messed up individual. Maybe he just cares about the business and KNOWS that it's all acting at this point, now. Either way, it was good drama.
Even if it is actors playing a part, the issue is that they decided to go down that road in the first place. It just gives the company this slimy look when they take the near death experience of one of their most famous, loyal and long time workers and try to make money off of it. That goes for everything-the t-shirts they made, the footage of Lawler they kept replaying showing him passing out and making it into an angle. Regardless if Lawler WAS cool with it, they're trying to push a story where he WASN'T cool with it. They don't see Jerry on screen saying "yeah, its cool, I don't mind." On top of that, even if he was ok with it, that doesn't mean there are people in the audience who are. What about the people watching at home who have had friends or family who have died of a heart attack, then they see WWE making fun of it for the purpose of making money. I just get kind of turned off by all of it, not because I'm offended, but its more due to the fact that its a sign that they can't use legitimate, tactful means of getting heat. It comes across as a sign of desperation that they're willing to go to very questionable extremes in order to advance the product. Time and time again they've proven they can keep things tasteful and succeed, and then every so often they bust something like this out, and I have to wonder why. It could have been achieved another way, and instead the way they chose comes across as very low class-hence why people here are referring to it as cheap heat. Its a shortcut guaranteed to work, but they're treading touchy waters. Does the end justify the means? I don't think so. They had the ability to work around this and find another equally, if not more, effective way that they could have used to display their creativity. It wasn't like this was the ONLY way to go. The fact that they did makes it seem like they're grasping for anything that will work, and if its easier, all the better, regardless if that method is pretty apparently offensive to a lot of people.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:13 PM   #794 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

All of this arguing is extremely upsetting and certainly not good for mental health

So let's just be thankful that WWE were even able to make a work from this scenario, because Jerry is still alive

Uh oh, Bi-Bolar
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:25 PM   #795 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

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Originally Posted by AndreBaker View Post
All of this arguing is extremely upsetting and certainly not good for mental health

So let's just be thankful that WWE were even able to make a work from this scenario, because Jerry is still alive

Uh oh, Bi-Bolar
How much do you want to bet we'd see a "Jerry is in hell!" storyline if he'd died? Vince knows no limits.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:36 PM   #796 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

The backlash they're receiving justifies why they should never be edgy again. People are so easily offended nowadays.
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Old 11-15-2012, 09:32 PM   #797 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreBaker View Post
All of this arguing is extremely upsetting and certainly not good for mental health

So let's just be thankful that WWE were even able to make a work from this scenario, because Jerry is still alive

Uh oh, Bi-Bolar
As a Bi-Polar Manic Depressive I am deeply offended by your comments. You sir have crossed the line of good taste and have proven yourself to be scum by mocking said real life affliction.

Whom should I file a complaint with?
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Old 11-16-2012, 12:58 AM   #798 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Great Below View Post
This isn't difficult to see.

We have:

1. 745k tune in for Punk/Lawler/Foley
2. Vote for the Team Foley member announcement
3. Maddox backstage spot
4. Tag team match announcement
5. Commercials
6. Backstage Punk segment
7. Tag Match (middle)

876k viewers were lost from the #1 to #7, but somehow it's all supposed to be attributed to #1? We're expected to believe that #2-#7 are such rating draws that people weren't tuning out? Look how much Sheamus/Otunga lost (900k+) and you're trying to tell me those between segments were even on that level? Let's get real here.

uh, didnt punk/lawler/foley take up a good majority of the top of hour 2? None of this is verifiable now, but I swore that Lawler's return topped off hour 2 of the broadcast.
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Old 11-16-2012, 09:18 AM   #799 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by KO Bossy View Post
Even if it is actors playing a part, the issue is that they decided to go down that road in the first place. It just gives the company this slimy look when they take the near death experience of one of their most famous, loyal and long time workers and try to make money off of it. That goes for everything-the t-shirts they made, the footage of Lawler they kept replaying showing him passing out and making it into an angle. Regardless if Lawler WAS cool with it, they're trying to push a story where he WASN'T cool with it. They don't see Jerry on screen saying "yeah, its cool, I don't mind." On top of that, even if he was ok with it, that doesn't mean there are people in the audience who are. What about the people watching at home who have had friends or family who have died of a heart attack, then they see WWE making fun of it for the purpose of making money. I just get kind of turned off by all of it, not because I'm offended, but its more due to the fact that its a sign that they can't use legitimate, tactful means of getting heat. It comes across as a sign of desperation that they're willing to go to very questionable extremes in order to advance the product. Time and time again they've proven they can keep things tasteful and succeed, and then every so often they bust something like this out, and I have to wonder why. It could have been achieved another way, and instead the way they chose comes across as very low class-hence why people here are referring to it as cheap heat. Its a shortcut guaranteed to work, but they're treading touchy waters. Does the end justify the means? I don't think so. They had the ability to work around this and find another equally, if not more, effective way that they could have used to display their creativity. It wasn't like this was the ONLY way to go. The fact that they did makes it seem like they're grasping for anything that will work, and if its easier, all the better, regardless if that method is pretty apparently offensive to a lot of people.
I'm sure that the company has been slimier. A heart attack is a terrible thing, but Stratus degrading herself and barking like a dog on all fours for Vince's amusement and in front of the world was pretty damn bad too.

Granted, I would personally punch a guy who was mimicking a heart attack in front of a person who just suffered one if it happened in real life, but this is no longer real life anymore. Choosing to do the heart attack angle wasn't against Jerry's, Foley's, Punk's, Cole's, JR's or anyone else's own will (Jerry most importantly), so I personally don't see a problem in taking that road. Sure there are plenty of other options they could have taken, but as "cheap" as some of you say this angle was it was still effective.

If the audience decides that the WWE is making fun of anyone's heart attack issues other than Lawler's then maybe they deserve to stick with lighter shows on TV. I have family that have dealt with some of the issues that the WWE has made angles on and I know better. Not everyone knows better, though.

In your opinion what would have been a more tactful, legitimate means of getting heat? A move like this is something that a villain character would do. Punk just needs to do more. OR take a break and return as a face if doing more does Punk no good and the crowd always remains on his side.

I don't see it as desperation. I see it as them finally able to flex their wings a little without politics overshadowing them and Linda thus influencing what Vince needs to do to keep that shadow away.

I just got back into watching it this year. How often is the show tasteful and successful and I don't just mean in parts.

Like I said before, offensive can be good. Maybe the WWE will get a different audience demographic over time. Maybe it won't. Maybe there will be so much backlash that Cena will have to go back to "son-of-a-beez-wax". Again, I would rather be offended and hating a fictional character than to sit there rolling my eyes at the stories I see unfold.

Those are just my views, though. I know not everyone is going to think like me and that's fine.
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Old 11-16-2012, 11:53 AM   #800 (permalink)
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Default Re: Punk & Heyman mocking King's heart attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taker2theMoon View Post
I'm sure that the company has been slimier. A heart attack is a terrible thing, but Stratus degrading herself and barking like a dog on all fours for Vince's amusement and in front of the world was pretty damn bad too.

Granted, I would personally punch a guy who was mimicking a heart attack in front of a person who just suffered one if it happened in real life, but this is no longer real life anymore. Choosing to do the heart attack angle wasn't against Jerry's, Foley's, Punk's, Cole's, JR's or anyone else's own will (Jerry most importantly), so I personally don't see a problem in taking that road. Sure there are plenty of other options they could have taken, but as "cheap" as some of you say this angle was it was still effective.

If the audience decides that the WWE is making fun of anyone's heart attack issues other than Lawler's then maybe they deserve to stick with lighter shows on TV. I have family that have dealt with some of the issues that the WWE has made angles on and I know better. Not everyone knows better, though.

In your opinion what would have been a more tactful, legitimate means of getting heat? A move like this is something that a villain character would do. Punk just needs to do more. OR take a break and return as a face if doing more does Punk no good and the crowd always remains on his side.

I don't see it as desperation. I see it as them finally able to flex their wings a little without politics overshadowing them and Linda thus influencing what Vince needs to do to keep that shadow away.

I just got back into watching it this year. How often is the show tasteful and successful and I don't just mean in parts.

Like I said before, offensive can be good. Maybe the WWE will get a different audience demographic over time. Maybe it won't. Maybe there will be so much backlash that Cena will have to go back to "son-of-a-beez-wax". Again, I would rather be offended and hating a fictional character than to sit there rolling my eyes at the stories I see unfold.

Those are just my views, though. I know not everyone is going to think like me and that's fine.
This. Everyone was all ecstatic that Linda lost the election and stated she wasn't going to run again --- meaning their was a possibility that WWE was going to be a little edgier again (not as edgy as the Attitude Era, but a bit edgier) --- and when they pulled the trigger on a very edgy segment not even a week later - people say they went too far. Now I know everyone that claims they know the business say Linda's campaign and WWE programming aren't connecting - but I can guarantee that they wouldn't have done this segment prior to Election Day (thus WWE definetly played it a bit safer when she was running). I was fine with the segment because they've definetly done worse (like Cole mocking Jerry's mother passing away right after that happened - also a real-life situation - one where the person ACTUALLY died - Jerry's okay and went through with the segment - so let's move on). I'm hoping that moving forward they have at least one "edgy" segment a week to spark this much relevant conversation to their shows --- again it's not the Attitude Era, but at least it would be a consistently edgier, and in my opinion, better product than they've had...
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