[x78]

Originally Posted by jonoaries

Dude in reality shouldn't be main eventing yet. Vince is like the high school a slut that let's dudes fuck on the first night hoping it'll make her more popular. He pushes these dudes waaaaaay too fast just based off "the look". But considering there's a lot of sheep people who are willing to go along with the farce I guess it is what it is.

Why shouldn't he be main eventing? You don't think he's over enough?

[jonoaries]

Originally Posted by x78

Why shouldn't he be main eventing? You don't think he's over enough?

No. I don't think he's experienced enough, I don't think he's proven anything. What is Ryback? He's big and roidy. That's it. He has yet to wrestle a real match, he has yet to be involved with any meaningful promo, he has yet to prove he can do anything. You can't just throw the title on some jackoff because fans make noise. He's been in the picture 3 months, 3 main events and hasn't proven a gotdamn thing.


The standards everyone else from Cena to Punk, from Orton to Sheamus are held up to he's not being held up to. People constantly whine about Orton's horrible promos...this guy is WORSE. Cena is a terrible wrestler...he's WORSE lol, wtf is the excitement about? Where's the need to microwave this guy? There's no rush.

[shought321]

Originally Posted by x78

Why shouldn't he be main eventing? You don't think he's over enough?

Let's put Santino in the main event then.

[x78]

Originally Posted by jonoaries

No. I don't think he's experienced enough, I don't think he's proven anything. What is Ryback? He's big and roidy. That's it. He has yet to wrestle a real match, he has yet to be involved with any meaningful promo, he has yet to prove he can do anything. You can't just throw the title on some jackoff because fans make noise. He's been in the picture 3 months, 3 main events and hasn't proven a gotdamn thing.


The standards everyone else from Cena to Punk, from Orton to Sheamus are held up to he's not being held up to. People constantly whine about Orton's horrible promos...this guy is WORSE. Cena is a terrible wrestler...he's WORSE lol, wtf is the excitement about? Where's the need to microwave this guy? There's no rush.

He's proven that he can elicit the desired reaction from the fans, arguably moreso than anyone we've seen for years. And really that is all you need to be a successful wrestler, how you go about doing it is irrelevant. I don't have any issues with Ryback's promos or in-ring ability, in fact I find him more enjoyable than most of the roster in both regards, but that is beside the point. He should be main-eventing because fans want to see him in the main event. Making him job out or jump through imaginary hoops before he is deemed 'ready enough' is exactly the mindset that has seen the company struggle to create new stars and meant that the product has been so stale for so long. Ryback was thrown into the main event as a filler while Cena was injured, and showed that he belongs there. He could easily have bombed and been back to squashing jobbers or whatever by now, but he has put himself in a position where he cannot be overlooked because of how popular he has become and how much the fans have bought into him. So if people don't personally like Ryback then fair enough, but to complain about his booking or that he 'shouldn't be there' or whatever is just stupid IMO, because he has clearly shown that he should.

[jonoaries]

Originally Posted by x78

He's proven that he can elicit the desired reaction from the fans, arguably moreso than anyone we've seen for years. And really that is all you need to be a successful wrestler, how you go about doing it is irrelevant. I don't have any issues with Ryback's promos or in-ring ability, in fact I find him more enjoyable than most of the roster in both regards, but that is beside the point. He should be main-eventing because fans want to see him in the main event. Making him job out or jump through imaginary hoops before he is deemed 'ready enough' is exactly the mindset that has seen the company struggle to create new stars and meant that the product has been so stale for so long. Ryback was thrown into the main event as a filler while Cena was injured, and showed that he belongs there. He could easily have bombed and been back to squashing jobbers or whatever by now, but he has put himself in a position where he cannot be overlooked because of how popular he has become and how much the fans have bought into him. So if people don't personally like Ryback then fair enough, but to complain about his booking or that he 'shouldn't be there' or whatever is just stupid IMO, because he has clearly shown that he should.

You wrote a titangraph and didn't say what he did. He belongs there because of the fans? The same people who were chanting "Woo Woo Woo" "We Want Ryder" during The ROCK's fuckin promo! C'mon man, raise your standards lol. These people still chant "Yes Yes Yes" and DB is barely shown on TV. The crowd doesn't have jack to do with Ry being pushed. So many others have been snuffed out for not being "good enough" and here comes someone who is subpar in every way and the answer is to continue pushing him as he is now?
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Let me be straight up. There's only so long a one-dimensional character like this can last. His matches are 10 mins or less...who is going to pay $50-60 to see a 10 min main event? Nobody. You need to develop characters in order for them to have staying power. Ryback has ZERO staying power right now. He hasn't even been in a proper feud.

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People like to chant, it is what it is. That's not a mandate to put the title on him. If you need a new FoC (face of the company) roll with Fella (and I don't even like him), at least he's shown to put on real main events and can carry himself in real feuds. This Ryback dude is way too inexperienced and untested to get strapped up anytime soon.

[Mr.Socko2101]

Originally Posted by itssoeasy23

Listen to the pop he got on RAW this past week, there's you answer.

He's very over, his catchphrase is over, and he's only 31. He's got the look and believabiliy as a legit monster who tares through people and smashes shit. And it's working.

The last guy to come around that got over by himself that had Ryback's look and intensity was Brock Lesnar. You shouldn't even compare guys like Bobby Lashley and Mason Ryan to Ryback. Sure, their big, but they didn't have the believable intensity and over-ness that Ryback has.

Ryback brings to the table something we haven't seen for a long while, a legit powerhouse who tares through shit and looks believable doing it.

Trust me, he will be a star. And I'm not just saying that best I'm a fan, I'm saying it because he's got "Star" written all over him. He'll be a Champion in 2013 I guarantee that.

Listen to the crickets he got at Survivor Series. The pop on RAW whilst impressive was manufactured by what was happening in the ring and was built up very well with Hell No and Cena being outmatched by The Shield. If A-Ry returned out of nowhere and came out and cleared out he probably would've gotten a huge pop too.
Since Lesnar? are you forgetting about Batista who was one of if not the biggest star in the company in late 2005(YMMV).

And since when do breathing heavily and snorting count as a vital ingredient of being a maineventer because in terms of promo intensity he is laughable. His promos are unintentionally hilarious which doesn't scream intense badass to me. I honestly believe Mason Ryan is just as big and intense as Ryback and if given this push would've done similar and he's about as talentless as you can get. Hell Tyson Tomko could pull off Feed me more whilst being just as intense. Ryback is not a one in a million talent and I feel pretty insulted as a fan that Vince is trying to pass him off as such. At least Cena is a charismatic big guy who can work a great match even if his character is stale as hell.

Originally Posted by x78

Taste is subjective. I could quite easily ask what you or anyone else could possibly find appealing about Curt Hawkins, it just depends what you look for in a wrestler. Ryback is intense, exciting and a fresh face in the main-event scene. Is he original? No, not really, but he has a believability and a presence that doesn't come around too often, as evidenced by the reaction he gets. Guys have received harder, more sustained pushes than Ryback and gained nowhere near as much traction. To use your own comparison, Bobby Lashley received a similar push to Ryback, he was undefeated for about 5 months.

As for 'lazy', I don't see how you can complain about the booking at all when less than a year after debuting people are already talking about Ryback replacing Cena as face of the company. How could things have possibly worked out any better from a company standpoint?

And I can answer that with the fact that Curt Hawkins has shown me in what little time he has been given that he can be humorous and entertaining whilst also being a very capable in ring performer. I don't know if he's main event material though.

Lashley's push involved him being eliminated by Kane at Survivor Series about a month into his career albeit after a strong performance. He didn't receive a world title shot until No mercy more than a year after his debut and even Finlay got a shot then.

Ryback's push hasn't had the same build and dominating one superstar after another IS lazy booking as you book yourself into a corner. What happens when he loses cleanly or struggles against an opponent? Will people still cheer for him?

The only reasons I can see you both mentioning are he's big, intense and wins a lot oh and because he gets cheers from people? you like him because other people do? He is just leaching off the popularity of the main eventers just like AJ did.

The booking is 'lazy' because it is short term orientated and unsustainable as it leads to a situation where you make the rest of your roster look unbelievably weak in comparison to one guy and damage their legitimacy in the eyes of the audience if you let Ryback keep running through the roster with no problems or else you risk his popularity plummeting following a clean loss.

Goldberg in WCW is a prime example of what happens when you let one guy dominate everyone and that was with an even more athletic and charismatic performer. Booking yourself into a corner like this is lazy and ill thought out regardless of short term spikes in the popularity of one performer.

[x78]

Originally Posted by jonoaries

You wrote a titangraph and didn't say what he did. He belongs there because of the fans? The same people who were chanting "Woo Woo Woo" "We Want Ryder" during The ROCK's fuckin promo! C'mon man, raise your standards lol. These people still chant "Yes Yes Yes" and DB is barely shown on TV. The crowd doesn't have jack to do with Ry being pushed. So many others have been snuffed out for not being "good enough" and here comes someone who is subpar in every way and the answer is to continue pushing him as he is now?
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Let me be straight up. There's only so long a one-dimensional character like this can last. His matches are 10 mins or less...who is going to pay $50-60 to see a 10 min main event? Nobody. You need to develop characters in order for them to have staying power. Ryback has ZERO staying power right now. He hasn't even been in a proper feud.

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People like to chant, it is what it is. That's not a mandate to put the title on him. If you need a new FoC (face of the company) roll with Fella (and I don't even like him), at least he's shown to put on real main events and can carry himself in real feuds. This Ryback dude is way too inexperienced and untested to get strapped up anytime soon.

What he 'does' is get people behind him. A hell of a lot more than Sheamus who has been pushed harder than Ryback for over a year and has pretty much completely failed to connect with the crowd. Wrestling is about creating characters that people get behind and want to see. I don't know if Ryback's popularity will last or not, I don't want him to be the champion for that reason but right now he is the hottest face in the company and deserves his status in the main event.

[x78]

Originally Posted by Mr.Socko2101

And I can answer that with the fact that Curt Hawkins has shown me in what little time he has been given that he can be humorous and entertaining whilst also being a very capable in ring performer. I don't know if he's main event material though.

Lashley's push involved him being eliminated by Kane at Survivor Series about a month into his career albeit after a strong performance. He didn't receive a world title shot until No mercy more than a year after his debut and even Finlay got a shot then.

Ryback's push hasn't had the same build and dominating one superstar after another IS lazy booking as you book yourself into a corner. What happens when he loses cleanly or struggles against an opponent? Will people still cheer for him?

The only reasons I can see you both mentioning are he's big, intense and wins a lot oh and because he cheers from people? He is just leaching off the popularity of the main eventers just like AJ did.

The booking is 'lazy' because it is short term orientated and unsustainable as it leads to a situation where you make the rest of your roster look unbelievably weak in comparison to one guy and damage their legitimacy in the eyes of the audience if you let Ryback keep running through the roster with no problems or else you risk his popularity plummeting following a clean loss.

Goldberg in WCW is a prime example of what happens when you let one guy dominate everyone and that was with an even more athletic and charismatic performer. Booking yourself into a corner like this is lazy and ill thought out regardless of short term spikes in the popularity of one performer.

Your arguments could be applied to everyone who has ever received strong booking. Ryback hasn't buried anyone, if he starts burying people or being pushed to the detriment of the rest of the roster than I will be unhappy but that hasn't been the case at all so far. Like I said, I don't know if he has staying power, nobody can say for sure whether he does or doesn't, it depends how WWE handle it. But to try and criticize the guy for something that hasn't yet happened seems a little harsh.

[-Skullbone-]

Originally Posted by shought321

Let's put Santino in the main event then.

Santino's been typecast. It's fair to say most fans will turn if it were to happen.

Originally Posted by jonoaries

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Let me be straight up. There's only so long a one-dimensional character like this can last. His matches are 10 mins or less...who is going to pay $50-60 to see a 10 min main event? Nobody. You need to develop characters in order for them to have staying power. Ryback has ZERO staying power right now. He hasn't even been in a proper feud.

.
People like to chant, it is what it is. That's not a mandate to put the title on him. If you need a new FoC (face of the company) roll with Fella (and I don't even like him), at least he's shown to put on real main events and can carry himself in real feuds. This Ryback dude is way too inexperienced and untested to get strapped up anytime soon.

Here's the issue with what you're saying: a guy who's looking promising in the fan's eyes and someone the genuinely want to see has to be scaled back because he's too limited talent-wise. Pro wrestling is about perception, and Ryback is perceived to be near a unstoppable wrecking ball because that's what he's built up to be. You want your guys playing up to their strengths and, in Ryback's case, it's about presenting him being as monstrous as he looks. No frills, no spills. Keep everything in the domain of his talents, so long as the smark crowd doesn't pick apart any noticeable vulnerability and it catches on with other haters on a larger scale.

WWE have done a good job in building him up in the fan's eyes, despite their methods being pretty questionable in some cases from a traditionalist's standpoint (starting the feud with WWE champ Punk inside HIAC being the worst example). They're in too far now to start reconsidering their move in pushing Ryback. I think it's a bit unfair to he has absolutely no staying power. He looks the part, is being built up as one, and is received as one by the major collective of fans. They're trying to make stars, and whether or not he becomes one with long lasting appeal depends on if WWE can handle it properly over the long term.

So yeah, I largely agree with what x78 and people with similar sentiments. This is all in regards to the current era and the limited star appeal available. Whether or not you or I like it, the company should continue going through with it for the sake of a prospect-turned-potential future star.

[Shawn Morrison]

Originally Posted by jonoaries

Dude in reality shouldn't be main eventing yet. Vince is like the high school a slut that let's dudes fuck on the first night hoping it'll make her more popular. He pushes these dudes waaaaaay too fast just based off "the look". But considering there's a lot of sheep people who are willing to go along with the farce I guess it is what it is.

ummm are you ignoring the fact that Ryback is really over with the fans and that he is pretty decent in the ring? not to mention his push was never meant to be this early, Cena's injury before HIAC triggered his push.

Originally Posted by shought321

Let's put Santino in the main event then.

don't be stupid. Does Santino have a credible gimmick/look/presence like Ryback does? go figure.