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Old 09-29-2012, 05:19 PM   #6321 (permalink)
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I don't think Raw ratings will gain if Punk isn't there, specially if its last week, ratings will plummet some more. Nobody gained viewers last week put a side Punk segments. I'm not sure what others are trying to say. I'm not saying Punk is a Big draw but he's a draw none or less, all the big draws are very well established and have been constant on what they do. Punk in the other side is a very complicated case, he's not fully booked, things with him just get squashed, even if he didn't do anything wrong. Punk was great in 2009, until they decided to stop his push against Taker, and the question is what went wrong with him, he was great. Same thing happened in the last year summer, he got squashed by Trips (technically) and every thing went down with him, and again what did he do wrong. If you wanna be a big draw you need to beat the biggest draws. If you lose to them you're nothing, that what I have noticed from the casual point of view. In the IWC it doesn't matter who you beat, you will still be worshiped.
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Old 09-29-2012, 05:38 PM   #6322 (permalink)
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Punk probably would've been, but for every really good thing Punk has had, it's been screwed up.

His first WHC? He wasn't quite at that level yet, and it ended in a poor way.

His second WHC/Jeff Hardy feud? It was all going good, and great for him he ended Hardy's career but Punk got himself buried by Taker with some remarks behind the scenes (not sure if ever confirmed though) and this probably would've been the run to cement Punk had that not happened.

The SES/New Nexus? Both led to nothing because they were treated as such. Mysterio handled SES and shaved Punk's head, and then Show comes in and dismantles them. New Nexus? Same thing and it got destroyed by Cena, and then Orton. Not to mention Nexus was a dead group by the time he began to lead it.

His shoot promo/Summer of Punk 2011? Comes back early, has an uneventful feud with HHH, loses, and then the night after he apologizes to HHH and becomes a squeaky clean babyface. He turns from an edgy babyface to a cringe-worthy jokester, much like Cena and now Sheamus.

His 300+ day title reign? He's been overshadowed by Cena constantly and has only main evented 2 PPV's. Sure, Cena main eventing with Rock and Lesnar makes sense. Hell, I even understand somewhat Cena/Laurinaitis main eventing over Punk's match (not like we could see the future and how much of a classic match Punk/Bryan was going to be). Also I suppose Cena ending MITB would be alright if it wasn't for the fact the MITB has never ended the PPV before. But Cena/Kane's ambulance match main eventing EC? Cena/Show main eventing NWO? Absolutely no reason they couldn't have at least put Punk's feuds/matches at that time on that level and main eventing Raw half the time. But they proceed to make him an afterthought.

Punk's Raw 1000 heel turn? He goes from a face who takes on all comers, had been in a couple triple threat title matches, one of which being a TLC, and having a lot of respect to all of a sudden having no respect, having a big issue with triple threats and becoming your standard cowardly heel number 156 who outside of his Summerslam match always gets out-smarted and made to look weak. There's nothing interesting about him as a heel besides the fact he's aligned with Heyman. The problem is Punk doesn't need a mouthpiece and it just feels like filler for Heyman until Lesnar comes back.

So while Punk has been graced with a lot of opportunities, he's been fucked out of more than his fair share. Now the first one I mentioned wasn't really anybody's fault, and though his reign ended poorly, he wasn't really ready for being the champion of Raw yet. And his second run his attitude cost him big time as that was probably the run that would've put Punk over as the top heel of WWE. However the crap that happened with his factions, the Summer of Punk, his title run and his heel turn that has been unspectacular is pure terrible booking and not his fault.

And ultimately it's that that's the reason he's not as big of a draw as he should be. He doesn't have the "it" factor where he can draw when doing nothing/having his feuds/runs/storylines ruined. I know a few people claim him to be the next Austin, and hell when he first did that shoot promo and for the first month, I thought the same thing. But it's clear now he can't ever be that. Could he be, say, an HBK? A HHH? Possibly, but at this point with his luck, it's very unlikely. He's certainly not going to be the face of the company, as he's just much more natural as a heel.
While I agree to a degree with your post, mainly the points about how screwed up the pay-off to most of his feuds has been in the past, but i think you fail to realize how much of a push he has been handed consistently for years, despite not entirely deserving it.

Like you said yourself, he wasnt even ready when he won his first world title, but they put the title on him regardless, had him working against Batista the second biggest star of the PG era. For all the IWC bitching about the "big man fetish", here they put the title on a skinny dude with tattoos who looked like a 14yr old school kid standing against batista, despite the fact he didnt deserve it.

The summer of punk 2009 is often regarded as one of the best angles of the post Attitude era. It was a huge main event push on Smackdown against one of the most over stars of the past decade, Jeff hardy. Yes Taker killed the momentum of the feud, but it doesnt take away from how much exposure he got by working with these two top stars.

As for Nexus/SES thing, WWE had enough faith in him to make him the leader of two major heel factions on both the A-show and the B-show of the company. At one point, he was the biggest heel in the company. Once again, you dont realize the magnitude of the push. Cena, Orton, Rey, show are all huge babyface characters, working with them itself is big. Yes, Summer of punk 2011 did not end well but it wasnt drawing much to begin with. MITB bumped 20,000 extra buys and ratings stayed the same throughout.

About the main event thing, I dont exactly understand what difference it would have made even if he did main event over Cena? Whats the point if it isn't the key drawing match for the PPV anyway? Just assume he does main event over Cena/Show and Cena/Laurinaitis, so now he main evented 4 PPVs out of 10, what does that prove? Is he a draw now because of it? Cena matches are still the ones responsible for PPV buys and everyone knows that for a fact. If anything this main event thing is an effective excuse for punk fans, to cover up his lack of drawing power.

He was turned heel on RAW 1000 because his face character completely ran out of steam, it came to a point where its either a heel turn or lose the title to Cena for punk and WWE decided to turn him heel by having him lay out THE BIGGEST STAR IN WRESTLING INDUSTRY today in the middle of the ring, at the end of the biggest RAW show of the decade which drew massive rating as we all know.

See here's my problem with these excuses, If you're a wrestler who needs 6 yrs of constant push and every one of those to end well in your favor with the right pay-off to *atleast* show signs of being a draw, then in my opinion you're NOT worth that investment to begin with.

I mean how many wrestlers who made their debut during the same time as punk, get to say they were ECW world champion, two time MITB winner, 3 time heavyweight champion, leader of two top heel factions, worked with the likes of Edge, Batista, JBL, Jeff hardy(and retired him), Taker, Rey Mysterio, big show, Randy Orton, John Cena, Vince Mcmahon, Triple H, Chris Jericho, the guy who was allowed to "shoot"/break kayfabe on live raw, the guy who turned heel by attacking the biggest star in the company? How many superstars could claim to even half of that push?

As I mention above, like most of the Punk marks on the internet you're so obsessed with these excuses that you fail see how much he has been handed since day one. I am not a big advocate of Kevin Nash's "Vanilla midget" looks theory but in punk's case it might be true. Punk needs tonnes of hype, top stars and main event buzz surrounding him to draw, if at all. When left alone, clearly he cant deliver.

People refuse to see this guy as a top star because he lacks "IT" factor. Simple

And obviously No, he's never going to a hbk or hhh or taker or even Jericho or kurt angle. Thats just not happening.
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Old 09-29-2012, 05:51 PM   #6323 (permalink)
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For what it's worth, whether Punk draws by himself or not, it's silly to underestimate the value of someone who can be such an effective foil to the top draws.
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Old 09-29-2012, 06:29 PM   #6324 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tnmore View Post
While I agree to a degree with your post, mainly the points about how screwed up the pay-off to most of his feuds has been in the past, but i think you fail to realize how much of a push he has been handed consistently for years, despite not entirely deserving it.

Like you said yourself, he wasnt even ready when he won his first world title, but they put the title on him regardless, had him working against Batista the second biggest star of the PG era. For all the IWC bitching about the "big man fetish", here they put the title on a skinny dude with tattoos who looked like a 14yr old school kid standing against batista, despite the fact he didnt deserve it.

The summer of punk 2009 is often regarded as one of the best angles of the post Attitude era. It was a huge main event push on Smackdown against one of the most over stars of the past decade, Jeff hardy. Yes Taker killed the momentum of the feud, but it doesnt take away from how much exposure he got by working with these two top stars.

As for Nexus/SES thing, WWE had enough faith in him to make him the leader of two major heel factions on both the A-show and the B-show of the company. At one point, he was the biggest heel in the company. Once again, you dont realize the magnitude of the push. Cena, Orton, Rey, show are all huge babyface characters, working with them itself is big. Yes, Summer of punk 2011 did not end well but it wasnt drawing much to begin with. MITB bumped 20,000 extra buys and ratings stayed the same throughout.

About the main event thing, I dont exactly understand what difference it would have made even if he did main event over Cena? Whats the point if it isn't the key drawing match for the PPV anyway? Just assume he does main event over Cena/Show and Cena/Laurinaitis, so now he main evented 4 PPVs out of 10, what does that prove? Is he a draw now because of it? Cena matches are still the ones responsible for PPV buys and everyone knows that for a fact. If anything this main event thing is an effective excuse for punk fans, to cover up his lack of drawing power.

He was turned heel on RAW 1000 because his face character completely ran out of steam, it came to a point where its either a heel turn or lose the title to Cena for punk and WWE decided to turn him heel by having him lay out THE BIGGEST STAR IN WRESTLING INDUSTRY today in the middle of the ring, at the end of the biggest RAW show of the decade which drew massive rating as we all know.

See here's my problem with these excuses, If you're a wrestler who needs 6 yrs of constant push and every one of those to end well in your favor with the right pay-off to *atleast* show signs of being a draw, then in my opinion you're NOT worth that investment to begin with.

I mean how many wrestlers who made their debut during the same time as punk, get to say they were ECW world champion, two time MITB winner, 3 time heavyweight champion, leader of two top heel factions, worked with the likes of Edge, Batista, JBL, Jeff hardy(and retired him), Taker, Rey Mysterio, big show, Randy Orton, John Cena, Vince Mcmahon, Triple H, Chris Jericho, the guy who was allowed to "shoot"/break kayfabe on live raw, the guy who turned heel by attacking the biggest star in the company? How many superstars could claim to even half of that push?

As I mention above, like most of the Punk marks on the internet you're so obsessed with these excuses that you fail see how much he has been handed since day one. I am not a big advocate of Kevin Nash's "Vanilla midget" looks theory but in punk's case it might be true. Punk needs tonnes of hype, top stars and main event buzz surrounding him to draw, if at all. When left alone, clearly he cant deliver.

People refuse to see this guy as a top star because he lacks "IT" factor. Simple

And obviously No, he's never going to a hbk or hhh or taker or even Jericho or kurt angle. Thats just not happening.
Whats the point of facing them and not beating them, will that make you a draw. Punk is a draw, not a big draw, nor should he be one. Jeff wasn't a big draw, he was just massively over with the crowed and got high merchindise sales. Didn't know that you can see the future.

Edited: By the way, Punk segments were gaining over a million last year going to MITB, same thing with Trips and Nash, he gained over a million and 500+ every week, until they turned him to a babyface. Of course mainly because of his lose against Trips which effected his momentum real bad.

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Old 09-29-2012, 06:49 PM   #6325 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tnmore View Post
While I agree to a degree with your post, mainly the points about how screwed up the pay-off to most of his feuds has been in the past, but i think you fail to realize how much of a push he has been handed consistently for years, despite not entirely deserving it.

Like you said yourself, he wasnt even ready when he won his first world title, but they put the title on him regardless, had him working against Batista the second biggest star of the PG era. For all the IWC bitching about the "big man fetish", here they put the title on a skinny dude with tattoos who looked like a 14yr old school kid standing against batista, despite the fact he didnt deserve it.

The summer of punk 2009 is often regarded as one of the best angles of the post Attitude era. It was a huge main event push on Smackdown against one of the most over stars of the past decade, Jeff hardy. Yes Taker killed the momentum of the feud, but it doesnt take away from how much exposure he got by working with these two top stars.

As for Nexus/SES thing, WWE had enough faith in him to make him the leader of two major heel factions on both the A-show and the B-show of the company. At one point, he was the biggest heel in the company. Once again, you dont realize the magnitude of the push. Cena, Orton, Rey, show are all huge babyface characters, working with them itself is big. Yes, Summer of punk 2011 did not end well but it wasnt drawing much to begin with. MITB bumped 20,000 extra buys and ratings stayed the same throughout.

About the main event thing, I dont exactly understand what difference it would have made even if he did main event over Cena? Whats the point if it isn't the key drawing match for the PPV anyway? Just assume he does main event over Cena/Show and Cena/Laurinaitis, so now he main evented 4 PPVs out of 10, what does that prove? Is he a draw now because of it? Cena matches are still the ones responsible for PPV buys and everyone knows that for a fact. If anything this main event thing is an effective excuse for punk fans, to cover up his lack of drawing power.

He was turned heel on RAW 1000 because his face character completely ran out of steam, it came to a point where its either a heel turn or lose the title to Cena for punk and WWE decided to turn him heel by having him lay out THE BIGGEST STAR IN WRESTLING INDUSTRY today in the middle of the ring, at the end of the biggest RAW show of the decade which drew massive rating as we all know.

See here's my problem with these excuses, If you're a wrestler who needs 6 yrs of constant push and every one of those to end well in your favor with the right pay-off to *atleast* show signs of being a draw, then in my opinion you're NOT worth that investment to begin with.

I mean how many wrestlers who made their debut during the same time as punk, get to say they were ECW world champion, two time MITB winner, 3 time heavyweight champion, leader of two top heel factions, worked with the likes of Edge, Batista, JBL, Jeff hardy(and retired him), Taker, Rey Mysterio, big show, Randy Orton, John Cena, Vince Mcmahon, Triple H, Chris Jericho, the guy who was allowed to "shoot"/break kayfabe on live raw, the guy who turned heel by attacking the biggest star in the company? How many superstars could claim to even half of that push?

As I mention above, like most of the Punk marks on the internet you're so obsessed with these excuses that you fail see how much he has been handed since day one. I am not a big advocate of Kevin Nash's "Vanilla midget" looks theory but in punk's case it might be true. Punk needs tonnes of hype, top stars and main event buzz surrounding him to draw, if at all. When left alone, clearly he cant deliver.

People refuse to see this guy as a top star because he lacks "IT" factor. Simple

And obviously No, he's never going to a hbk or hhh or taker or even Jericho or kurt angle. Thats just not happening.
Absolutely amazing post that brings up lots of valid points. Shit like the main event thing are just nitpicking by Punk marks because they refuse to admit he failed to become the top star WWE hoped for when he was given the big angle of 2011 to work with.
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:07 PM   #6326 (permalink)
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Absolutely amazing post that brings up lots of valid points. Shit like the main event thing are just nitpicking by Punk marks because they refuse to admit he failed to become the top star WWE hoped for when he was given the big angle of 2011 to work with.
Anything negative about Punk is amazing to you. . He gains viewers and be blamed for it not being that much of a gain, like if others could do the same in the current roster, everybody lost viewers last week besides Punk segments, why don't you talk about them, they are the problem, you don't expect one man to carry a 3 hours show.

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Old 09-29-2012, 07:31 PM   #6327 (permalink)
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lol at the idea that HHH not showing up at a house show would result in people asking for refunds.
PFFFFFFfff

What were the buys for the Kevin Nash vs HHH Sledge Hammer on a string ladder match?
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Old 09-29-2012, 07:38 PM   #6328 (permalink)
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Anything negative about Punk is amazing to you. . He gains viewers and be blamed for it not being that much of a gain, like if others could do the same in the current roster, everybody lost viewers last week besides Punk segments, why don't you talk about them, they are the problem, you don't expect one man to carry a 3 hours show.
There are no expectations from them. Most of them just come out, wrestle some random meaningless matches and leave. I would be surprised if they DON'T lose viewers. Punk pretty much has the show built around him and gets all the meaningful angles. It's only right that he gets a large portion of the blame since he's the most exposed person on the show. And it also makes sense that he gains viewers because everything else loses. Plus he also gets all the 'big gain' spots (opener, 9PM and closer) and has the likes of Mick Foley and John Cena covering his ass to assure that viewers do tune in.

Lastly, where are the opportunities Punk has gotten for the rest of the roster so I can judge their drawing abilities? They have got zero opportunities so it would just be dumb to expect them to magically draw just for being there.
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Old 09-29-2012, 08:44 PM   #6329 (permalink)
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While I agree to a degree with your post, mainly the points about how screwed up the pay-off to most of his feuds has been in the past, but i think you fail to realize how much of a push he has been handed consistently for years, despite not entirely deserving it.


Like you said yourself, he wasnt even ready when he won his first world title, but they put the title on him regardless, had him working against Batista the second biggest star of the PG era. For all the IWC bitching about the "big man fetish", here they put the title on a skinny dude with tattoos who looked like a 14yr old school kid standing against batista, despite the fact he didnt deserve it.
As I said, the reign shouldn't have happened (at least at that point without more building up of Punk) but he didn't exactly look strong against Batista from what I recall, and once again that has to do with booking. He looked like a weak champ because he was booked as a weak champ. Going against Batista at the time while not bad, didn't do Punk any favors either.

Quote:
The summer of punk 2009 is often regarded as one of the best angles of the post Attitude era. It was a huge main event push on Smackdown against one of the most over stars of the past decade, Jeff hardy. Yes Taker killed the momentum of the feud, but it doesnt take away from how much exposure he got by working with these two top stars.
While against Jeff Hardy, he got great exposure. But not all exposure is good. He was essentially Taker's whipping boy for a couple of months, and even though Taker is a legend and it's never bad to lose to him, it's terrible to look as bad as Punk did to Taker to anyone. Once again gets exposure, but it's not exactly good when you're booked to look like you don't belong in the main event. Like I said this is what I think really hurt Punk's image in the eyes of the casual, and the worst part is if the reports are true, Punk did it to himself.


Quote:
As for Nexus/SES thing, WWE had enough faith in him to make him the leader of two major heel factions on both the A-show and the B-show of the company. At one point, he was the biggest heel in the company. Once again, you dont realize the magnitude of the push. Cena, Orton, Rey, show are all huge babyface characters, working with them itself is big. Yes, Summer of punk 2011 did not end well but it wasnt drawing much to begin with. MITB bumped 20,000 extra buys and ratings stayed the same throughout.
But once again, him and his groups were made to look like chumps. Bad exposure is bad. It hurts his image to see time and time again that he fails in his feuds and it makes it harder for the casuals to get behind him.

Quote:
About the main event thing, I dont exactly understand what difference it would have made even if he did main event over Cena? Whats the point if it isn't the key drawing match for the PPV anyway? Just assume he does main event over Cena/Show and Cena/Laurinaitis, so now he main evented 4 PPVs out of 10, what does that prove? Is he a draw now because of it? Cena matches are still the ones responsible for PPV buys and everyone knows that for a fact. If anything this main event thing is an effective excuse for punk fans, to cover up his lack of drawing power.
He's the WWE Champion. It devalues the title when it's never the main event despite the fact that it's supposedly the most prestigious prize in the business, and hurts Punk's reign (and image once again) that he's constantly playing second-fiddle to Cena, even when he has the title. So even if it's not the key drawing point, if it's promoted on Raw as the main event as it should be, at the very least the title credibility and reign is preserved to some extent. Casuals don't really know who draws and who doesn't... at least as far as I know. It's not something they think about.

And the other thing is when I say for Punk to main event, I don't necessarily mean him just being the last match on the PPV, but to week in and week out be the focus of the show. Now I know you're just going to point to this Monday's Raw as an example that you can't use Punk as the center of the show, but once again there are plenty of reasons why the rating was so low that had nothing to do with Punk. For all we know even if Cena was the one featured throughout the show it would've still been a low number. Hell Cena was advertised in the last part of the show and it still did underwhelming. Essentially all we know is Punk's first two segments kept the show afloat.

Now if Punk was given the opportunity to go out there for the next 3-4 weeks and be the center of the show and ratings get lower or don't budge, and then they give Cena a week as the center and ratings go back up, then yes, that would be proof Punk can't be the main event and center of the show, and as such he has no business being WWE Champion for the more than a couple of months. But Punk never had that opportunity. He had one terrible overrun that lost viewers in an uninspired match which put him against Tensai and Bryan (which by the way I'm not sure if he was the center of that show either, but I'd need to check), but even HHH has lost viewers in the overrun on more than one occasion. But Punk has never been given a shot to prove he could consistently hold the numbers together for the show and to prove that number was just an odd occurrence. Instead he's a very little or non-factor as a mid-card WWE Champion while Cena is treated as the top prize in the company. He can never prove his worth if not given the chance, and only giving him a one-off shot every few months isn't giving him a chance.

Quote:
He was turned heel on RAW 1000 because his face character completely ran out of steam, it came to a point where its either a heel turn or lose the title to Cena for punk and WWE decided to turn him heel by having him lay out THE BIGGEST STAR IN WRESTLING INDUSTRY today in the middle of the ring, at the end of the biggest RAW show of the decade which drew massive rating as we all know.

See here's my problem with these excuses, If you're a wrestler who needs 6 yrs of constant push and every one of those to end well in your favor with the right pay-off to *atleast* show signs of being a draw, then in my opinion you're NOT worth that investment to begin with.

I mean how many wrestlers who made their debut during the same time as punk, get to say they were ECW world champion, two time MITB winner, 3 time heavyweight champion, leader of two top heel factions, worked with the likes of Edge, Batista, JBL, Jeff hardy(and retired him), Taker, Rey Mysterio, big show, Randy Orton, John Cena, Vince Mcmahon, Triple H, Chris Jericho, the guy who was allowed to "shoot"/break kayfabe on live raw, the guy who turned heel by attacking the biggest star in the company? How many superstars could claim to even half of that push?

As I mention above, like most of the Punk marks on the internet you're so obsessed with these excuses that you fail see how much he has been handed since day one. I am not a big advocate of Kevin Nash's "Vanilla midget" looks theory but in punk's case it might be true. Punk needs tonnes of hype, top stars and main event buzz surrounding him to draw, if at all. When left alone, clearly he cant deliver.

People refuse to see this guy as a top star because he lacks "IT" factor. Simple

And obviously No, he's never going to a hbk or hhh or taker or even Jericho or kurt angle. Thats just not happening.
First, it's not needing every single push to be successful, it's needing a few of them. He's looked weak time and time again after a short time of looking like a main eventer. No top draw got over by having their pushes constantly derailed. Hogan, Austin, Rock, Taker, Lesnar, HHH, Cena, etc. All almost always were booked to succeed in their feuds and never made to look like chumps as WWE Champion, even as heels. Imagine if Austin had tapped out to Bret at WM13 and then stopped being Austin 3:16. No way Austin/McMahon would've been as successful. Imagine Rock never leading the Nation. Imagine Evolution getting destroyed by Benoit in 04 and Orton and Batista becoming nothing. Imagine HHH losing the title to Foley at the RR and the WM ME that year being Rock vs. Foley. How about during HHH's 9 month reign, not only does he get overshadowed by Rock/Austin and Rock/Goldberg, but then Goldberg's feuds overshadow HHH's and HHH looks like a mid-card act in comparison, along with the title? Or how about JBL defeating Cena at WM21 and Cena getting traded to Raw before he could win the title? Or how about winning the title, but then losing in the I QUIT match to JBL? Lastly, what about Taker beating Lesnar in the cell at NM?

None of those men would be the same if those things happened, and for Punk I still believe that the time he could've been big originally was 2009, but what we saw was what would've happened if the last thing I said happened in that last paragraph. Punk's SES would've been more successful if he was champion similar to Evolution. He would've never had to take over the New Nexus or they would've just had him convert them to the SES. He would've been a top heel and a top draw.

You don't need the "IT" factor to be a big draw. You need the "IT" factor to be the biggest superstar of all time. Punk would've never been that, but he could've been big draw by now. But they fuck up his heel run, and then they fuck up his face run. Now he's back to heel trying that again, but it's only a matter of time before that's fucked up. I don't believe HHH had the "IT" factor, but he had proper booking, character development, and excellently written storylines. I'd say if he did have the "IT" factor, he could've very well been the biggest star of all time. But that's just me.

Are these excuses? I prefer to think of them as reasons. Are they valid reasons? Absolutely. Fact is none of his runs were booked properly all the way through. Because of that all those championships. accolades and guys he worked with in the past were all for naught. It's exactly why a poorly executed push can destroy someone. Punk's been dealing with it for the majority of his career. He's dealt with it for the past year and his title run, his face run, and his drawing power have suffered because of it.

Hell, another example of someone who's been failed by failed runs constantly is Randy Orton. 2004? Evolution's bitch, but he was also still emotionally immature so that falls on him. 2006? Again, fucked himself up after having all the momentum and getting put back over by Taker with his immature behavior. 2007, they failed to give him the title at SS when they should've, but he still did go on to have a good reign as champion, though he looked weak at times, like getting SCM every week for like 5 weeks in a row (I think). 2009 he had his gigantic push though, and that was fucked up. He remained a draw and the people he worked with helped and the storyline he had helped, but once he was taken away from them and given the title in 2010 and forced into the same position Punk's been in for the majority of the last year (playing second fiddle to Cena), his numbers suffered and he wasn't a "draw" by the standards we've been using for Punk. His title run went nowhere, his World Title reigns flopped, and he's been doing nothing of relevance ever since. And Orton's peak was actually hotter than Punk's, so if that could happen to Orton after failed push after failed push, it's no wonder it happens to Punk.
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Old 09-29-2012, 10:25 PM   #6330 (permalink)
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Default Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Choke2Death View Post
There are no expectations from them. Most of them just come out, wrestle some random meaningless matches and leave. I would be surprised if they DON'T lose viewers. Punk pretty much has the show built around him and gets all the meaningful angles. It's only right that he gets a large portion of the blame since he's the most exposed person on the show. And it also makes sense that he gains viewers because everything else loses. Plus he also gets all the 'big gain' spots (opener, 9PM and closer) and has the likes of Mick Foley and John Cena covering his ass to assure that viewers do tune in.

Lastly, where are the opportunities Punk has gotten for the rest of the roster so I can judge their drawing abilities? They have got zero opportunities so it would just be dumb to expect them to magically draw just for being there.
I'm not sure when was the last segment of Cena alone that gained big. Punk gained a lot of viewers in the past. Zero opportunities lol, what were they doing in the last 5 shows, you're putting excuses on them, just like what I thought. You said no excuses for Punk, but in the end he was the one gaining viewers in that last 5 shows or more. Sheamus the champion have been losing viewers a lot in the past 5 shows or more. I don't see you pointing fingers on him, I bet if Punk was the WHC instead you will talk about how he have been losing viewers every week, but since it's Sheamus it's Okay, he's a huge guy not a skinny fat ass to put the blame on. I remember you said soemthing like this about Sheamus "oh Sheamus gained viewers he's a draw" but when he doesn't you don't talk about him. I'm not sure about that but it seems this way, as you dont say anything about him. Mick Foley gained viewers not Punk, really? That segment will mean nothing if Punk wasnt there, and I'm sure it will not get that kind of gain. I wish Cena was alone in that last segment so I can see how he can do.

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