**The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here) - Page 100 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
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post #991 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:08 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

Orton isn't much of a draw. He doesn't have the big-name appeal of guys like Cena, HHH and 'Taker. Put him in an interesting storyline/angle, the fans will tune in. Put him in a random thrown-together match with no accompanying storyline, they won't. Just like the rest of the roster except for top stars like Cena.
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post #992 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:08 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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Originally Posted by Starbuck View Post
I touched upon it in my other post but I think we've become so used to the 10pm slot doing so badly over the past year that any gain at all is praised lol. Given how utterly shit some segments/matches have done in recent months, a lot of them including Punk mind you, I think it's a positive sign that viewership went up, even if it wasn't some astronomical number. Were it WHC Batista vs. WWE Champ John Cena I think we'd all be expecting HUGE gains. But it wasn't. It was WHC Bryan vs. WWE Champ Punk. Both of them are making strides in terms of being legit drawing stars but they aren't there yet.



Because Orton has never really been able to draw on his own without some form of help and because every single person in Q2 has lost viewers apart from Rock in the past year. Orton losing viewers isn't news or a big deal. In fact, I can't remember the last time he gained viewers on Raw tbh. Granted, he hasn't had a storyline and has just been in random matches but still, he isn't a ratings powerhouse by any stretch of the imagination. Over as fuck? Absolutely. A legit draw? Not on your life and I say all that as a huge Orton mark. When he was white hot back in mid 2010 business didn't move at all.
I don't quite get Orton. When you listen to the crowd reaction during his matches only Cena rivals it. The crowd was 3x more alive for Ziggler Orton than Punk Bryan, but he's got no drawing power whatsoever.

He's the rare wrestler that engages the crowd and gets them to react but then gets nothing to show for it.
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post #993 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:17 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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I don't quite get Orton. When you listen to the crowd reaction during his matches only Cena rivals it. The crowd was 3x more alive for Ziggler Orton than Punk Bryan, but he's got no drawing power whatsoever.

He's the rare wrestler that engages the crowd and gets them to react but then gets nothing to show for it.
It is rather curious. I guess haters would start their speech on how he was force fed for years and didn't ascend to the top naturally [insert Pyro Orton rant here lol] and maybe that does play a role. I don't know. I guess maybe you can look at him like the Hardy Boys back in the AE. They were super over and sold a shit ton of merch but were people buying tickets to shows just to see them or paying money for PPVs just to see them? No, they were paying for Austin, Rock, HHH, Taker etc who did everything the Hardys did but to an even higher level. But I really don't know why Orton, being as over as he is and the investment that the fans have in him hasn't translated over to boat loads of $$$.

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post #994 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:17 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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Champion v champion match really isn't that special anyways. Nothing is ever at stake, it's only about bragging rights and usually ends in some kind of interference.
No, but champion vs champion is similar to an allstar game where the two greatest (kayfabe) wrestlers right now perform and exhibition match against each other. This is supposed to be one of the greatest non-title match that is available for live television. And to Starbuck's point, Batista vs John Cena would be a whole different story in terms of the amount of ratings it would get.

And to the punk marks, not to take RockAE316's side but when you start to conjure up memes to celebrate a 210k viewership gain for a WWE Champion vs World Heavyweight Champion match, you really are only helping his argument.
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post #995 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:19 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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Why are people surprised or feel that it is an accomplishment for a WWE Champion vs World Heavyweight Champion to draw 210k viewers? Has the bar been set so low on Punk and Bryan? This is a match against (kayfabe) arguably the top two stars right now on WWE.
Nobody is saying that except their fans who can't accept reality, 200k for 10pm timeslot is a terrible gain like Meltzer said no matter what, it's not a WWE change, if you want to argue against it, you need to change the entire TV concept, And this shouldn't be a surprise because there was no drawing power in that segment.

Like I said, the only reason Orton lost because he was in the second quarter, Cena also lost there because it's stronger than the person, it's the show. the reason Orton is in random segments because he's a SD wrestler and gets his main timeslots there, When he comes back to RAW after the draft, you will see him in storylines and main slot every show because he's the second biggest full time star and name in the company.

When you put him in a storyline, he's a great TV draw like he proved in 2009 and even before that.
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post #996 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:38 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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Nobody is saying that except their fans who can't accept reality, 200k for 10pm timeslot is a terrible gain like Meltzer said no matter what, it's not a WWE change, if you want to argue against it, you need to change the entire TV concept, And this shouldn't be a surprise because there was no drawing power in that segment.

Like I said, the only reason Orton lost because he was in the second quarter, Cena also lost there because it's stronger than the person, it's the show. the reason Orton is in random segments because he's a SD wrestler and gets his main timeslots there, When he comes back to RAW after the draft, you will see him in storylines and main slot every show because he's the second biggest full time star and name in the company.

When you put him in a storyline, he's a great TV draw like he proved in 2009 and even before that.
So you give credit for orton when he draws and when Punk and DB gain viewers you don't. I see hmm!.
Yeah go look for more excuses, Orton can't draw its not just now it mostly always have been like this.
Yeah like when Punk had the best feud in 2009.. He proved that he's a draw.
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post #997 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:41 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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So you give credit for orton when he draws and when Punk and DB gain viewers you don't. I see hmm!.
Yeah go look for more excuses, Orton can't draw its not just now it mostly always have been like this.
Yeah like when Punk had the best feud in 2009.. He proved that he's a draw.
Orton didn't become a top guy until 2009, and he drew good ratings then. However, what matters is the here and now, and he hasn't been drawing well for quite some time.
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post #998 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:49 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

I'm not celebrating the fact that they gained 220k, because really that isn't relevant because what says more is the rating for the segment, 3.54 with 5 mil viewers. That's a good number. If the segments before it lost even more and Bryan/Punk brought back like 700k of the viewers but still had the same rating and viewership number, that would make no difference. The same amount of people would've still watched the match.






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post #999 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:56 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

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I'm not celebrating the fact that they gained 220k, because really that isn't relevant because what says more is the rating for the segment, 3.54 with 5 mil viewers. That's a good number. If the segments before it lost even more and Bryan/Punk brought back like 700k of the viewers but still had the same rating and viewership number, that would make no difference. The same amount of people would've still watched the match.
Of course it's relevant. How can you say it isn't? Whatever many people were already watching Raw without Punk/Bryan being on. Only an extra 200k viewers tuned in to see their match. Of course that's relevant. If the segments before had lost even more and then 700k viewers came back for Punk/Bryan, what does that say about Punk/Bryan? That 700k people couldn't be fucked watching whatever was on before them but came back when their match was on to see it. It's what has been the main problem with Raw's ratings for ages now. People are tuning in at the start, not giving a fuck, leaving and then coming back at the end to varying degrees depending on who's there and what's happening. Of course it's relevant.

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post #1000 of 9175 (permalink) Old 02-02-2012, 03:57 PM
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Re: **The Official Raw Ratings Thread** (Discuss Ratings In Here)

Yeah, but they were irrelevant to this 3.54 and a different segment there would have probably done much better.

Quote:
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Orton didn't become a top guy until 2009, and he drew good ratings then. However, what matters is the here and now, and he hasn't been drawing well for quite some time.
He never got the opportunity to do it in quite some time, he was on SD and when he makes RAW shows, it's just a filler match in random time slot because of the "supershow" concept...
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