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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:02 PM Thread Starter
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The Epitome of Ludicrous

Okay, this is just to vent of some frustration

I don't know how screwed up laws are around the US and other parts of the world but my uncle is about to be sentenced for murder for beating up and killing 2 muggers armed with knives because the jury deemed his actions to be "too extensive" as he is an mma instructor aka my former sensei, and they felt that he was capable of stopping his assailants(armed with knives) without killing them with his years of knowledge and experience in mma. Granted the one attacker was 17 and the other 20. So to sum it up: A 53 year old man with a leg brace gets attacked at the beach at night by 2 muggers armed with knives, who incidentally managed to stab him in the thigh in the process of trying to KILL HIM and his actions are deemed as unnecessary and "racist" because his attackers were black individuals involved in gang initiation killings...

Thing I'm getting at is this. In which part of the world is the law actually put into place to protect the rights of individuals and not the criminals? It seems like reading up on news from around the world that no matter the country you live in, the law only serves to protect a select few members of society.

Edit: Please note that this isn't meant to turn into a racist argumentative thread.

Last edited by Simply...amazing; 06-12-2012 at 07:29 PM.
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:13 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

He's white, of course it was racist.


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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:19 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

That is fucked up.

But then again, it is South Africa. Racism has fucked that place up a long time.

But America wouldn't be better. No one listens to the right opinion in America.
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:26 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

OMG this is the shit that just be making me so mad sometimes..my condolences to you and your family this justice system is all fucked up... your uncle should definitely not be going to jail right now.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:27 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

What part of any of that even remotely implies racism? Two guys attack him, he apparently goes nuts defending himself and kills both of them, it's decided that his special skills and training in an art of self defense mean he could have incapacitated them, hence he went too far and committed murder. Anyone bringing race into it is a fucking moron.

If you've got a link to an article about it that shows exactly where 'racism' comes into it, I'll agree that it's ridiculous. I'm just not seeing it, probably more boring self pitying from white folk pissed off they don't have anything decent to complain about.

Whether there should be a limit to how much you can defend yourself, that's another matter. I think there should be. It's such a difficult and arbitrary point to decide, though.
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:30 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

I don't see how it's racist, they attacked him at night, if anything that makes it harder for him to fight because he can't see them.


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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:43 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

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Originally Posted by NoGimmicksNeeded View Post
What part of any of that even remotely implies racism? Two guys attack him, he apparently goes nuts defending himself and kills both of them, it's decided that his special skills and training in an art of self defense mean he could have incapacitated them, hence he went too far and committed murder. Anyone bringing race into it is a fucking moron.

If you've got a link to an article about it that shows exactly where 'racism' comes into it, I'll agree that it's ridiculous. I'm just not seeing it, probably more boring self pitying from white folk pissed off they don't have anything decent to complain about.

Whether there should be a limit to how much you can defend yourself, that's another matter. I think there should be. It's such a difficult and arbitrary point to decide, though.
Exactly the fucking point. There is supposed to be a news article in the paper about it all next week as far as I know. The supposed "attack on the attackers"

He didn't kill them because they're black, he killed them in a moment of self defence. He was stabbed ffs. It didn't help matters that he was still wearing his brace because of injury prior to being attacked.

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Whether there should be a limit to how much you can defend yourself, that's another matter. I think there should be. It's such a difficult and arbitrary point to decide, though
I do see your point though but if you were fighting for your life, being over 50+ and already injured wouldn't you do whatever you can to survive? Limiting ourselves to what we can and cannot do to defend ourselves is ridiculous. If I were to be attacked by multiple assailants out to kill me the last thing on my mind would be "is breaking his neck too far"? How does one determine something like that? Do i miss my chance to perhaps break the neck of someone trying to kill me in favor of rather trying out my luck and hoping I don't get stabbed to death in the process?

Last edited by Simply...amazing; 06-12-2012 at 06:55 PM.
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:45 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

Well that's fucked up! How bad was his lawyer? I'm no lawyer but he could have argue that under the circumstances (having his life endangered after being stabbed) had no time to figure out what was the "right amount of force" to subdue two attackers. The worst he should have been tried for involuntary manslaughter.

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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 06:54 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous


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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2012, 07:05 PM
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Re: The Epitome of Ludicrous

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Originally Posted by Simply...amazing View Post
I do see your point though but if you were fighting for your life, being over 50+ and already injured wouldn't you do whatever you can to survive? Limiting ourselves to what we can and cannot do to defend ourselves is ridiculous. If I were to be attacked by multiple assailants out to kill me the last thing on my mind would be "is breaking his neck too far"? How does one determine something like that? Do i miss my chance to perhaps break the neck of someone trying to kill me in favor of rather trying out my luck and hoping I don't get stabbed to death in the process?
This is where it gets interesting, from a hypothetical standpoint. Could he have used his training to, for example, break the wrist of an attacker and disarm him of the knife? If I was on a jury, I'd have to think the answer would be almost certainly. If that happened, then the danger has passed and anything more than an attempt at physical restraint may be legally considered too much. It's difficult to know where that line is drawn.

Of course, if someone I loved was prosecuted for using excessive force in such a scenario, I know what my instant reaction would be. It's a very personal issue.
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