The 2012 MOTYC thread - Page 62 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:28 AM   #611 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Originally Posted by rizzotherat View Post
Ascribing genius and "OMG he is making things matter WOW" to him just taking a mid match breather. He's good but people only started to write poetry about him after the DVDR board adopted him as a hero in the late 00s.
Okay, but what's bad about him? You haven't actually pointed out any flaws.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xgi...?search_algo=1

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Old 04-16-2012, 05:39 AM   #612 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Okay, but what's bad about him? You haven't actually pointed out any flaws.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xgi...?search_algo=1
He doesn't really connect with most audiences with his wrestling and he is actually fairly slow & out of shape during this indy run.

No idea why you are linking to that match. Bar underscoring he only had one really memorable match WCW and that was due to the stip.
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:43 AM   #613 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Originally Posted by rizzotherat View Post
He doesn't really connect with most audiences with his wrestling and he is actually fairly slow & out of shape during this indy run.

No idea why you are linking to that match. Bar underscoring he only had one really memorable match WCW and that was due to the stip.
I linked that match because it was great.

Okay. Yeah he is slow paced, but I fail to see how that is a bad thing. It allows for selling, which is the cornerstone of professional wrestling. I don't see how he is out of shape, other than his stomach is a little rounder. Don't think that takes away from match quality.

Also, out of curiosity, who are guys working the indies right now that are better in your opinion? Just so I can have some kind of an idea of what you like in your professional wrestling.
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:57 AM   #614 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Also, out of curiosity, who are guys working the indies right now that are better in your opinion? Just so I can have some kind of an idea of what you like in your professional wrestling.
Off the top of my head El Generico, Steen and Tozawa when he is over. Neither a huge strong style or flippy guy. I just like good wrestling.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:01 AM   #615 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Off the top of my head El Generico, Steen and Tozawa when he is over. Neither a huge strong style or flippy guy. I just like good wrestling.
The bolded part is probably the most obvious thing you could say. Nobody watches (what they consider) bad wrestling and likes it.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:04 AM   #616 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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The bolded part is probably the most obvious thing you could say. Nobody watches (what they consider) bad wrestling and likes it.
You are getting cranky now. Settle down dear.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:09 AM   #617 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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You are getting cranky now. Settle down dear.
I wouldn't say I'm cranky, I am just trying to have a discussion with you.

So, what do those guys do better than Finlay?

Do they sell better? Do they have better offense? I am just trying to figure out how those guys are better. Because to me, Finlay has really brutal offense. Which none of those guys can touch. Finlay sells better than any of those guys. Those guys may get a smarky crowd fired up more than Finlay, but Finlay is a no-nonsense asskicker. So why would he try to clap his hands to get the crowd fired up? Or anything similar to that?

You see, I just want to see what you see, or at least see why you see what you see.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:14 AM   #618 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Really? How were the near-falls anti-climactic?
No excitement and weren't built at all. Finlay kicked him to the outside and just smacked him with Celtic Cross. That was it....oh and Sami kicked out randomly at one. The only real nearfall that was built up was the Tombstone due to their previous match and I didn't really care for it. Plus Sami not knowing where to appropriately taught made his deviant acts seem like amateur hour.


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How is stiffness random? Especially when the whole match was stiff? How is there no drama in a match where the resilient youngster that has no respect tries to take the torch by force from the grizzled veteran, but the veteran is too smart for him? I will take this "drama" over the Hell in a Cell B-Movie bad acting + dialogue "drama" any day of the week.
Being stiff is awesome like Finlay headbutting the nonsense out of Calihan but they began to over do and made me not care at all about it. Instead of structuring a great match, it was just "O
LEZ HIT ECH OTTER HARD". If there is no real importance on selling, timing, or facial expressions, it isn't real hard for your average Joe to replicate. It's real fucking boring compared to a match with Ki/KENTA where they have the insanely stiff match but the other elements which make a match great(Like comebacks, storytelling, and facial expressions).

Your idea if what you thought was drama/story is great and all but if it isn't executed properly, there isn't exactly a reason for the crowd to give a fuck. I got the idea of Callihan didn't like Finlay and Finlay was some combination of a hard hitting vet but the way it was portrayed was done absolutely poorly. Sami's drooling and attempts at saying f you didn't draw sympathy or really lead to great face in peril like in his last match. The one where he was getting his ass beat and there actually didn't seem like there was nothing he could do about it. HHH/Taker had a near flawless match because everything made sense and while you may say there was a over acting(All opinionated of course), it was built up off of previous matches. More importantly from last year.

Triple H beat the ever loving dog shit out of Taker the previous Mania and it was so bad that Taker couldn't even show face despite being the victor. As soon as HHH gets the chance in the Cell, he makes Taker his own personal Kunta Kinte and HBK, a former wrestler with injuries and has also got his ass whipped by HHH on several occasions, tries to stop it so Taker(A man he respects) can at least do a feat he didn't do last year and that is not look a vegetable. It makes sense, it is executed well, and everything is on point.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:22 AM   #619 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Originally Posted by milkman7 View Post
I wouldn't say I'm cranky, I am just trying to have a discussion with you.

So, what do those guys do better than Finlay?

Do they sell better? Do they have better offense? I am just trying to figure out how those guys are better. Because to me, Finlay has really brutal offense. Which none of those guys can touch. Finlay sells better than any of those guys. Those guys may get a smarky crowd fired up more than Finlay, but Finlay is a no-nonsense asskicker. So why would he try to clap his hands to get the crowd fired up? Or anything similar to that?

You see, I just want to see what you see, or at least see why you see what you see.
I think you've your mind already made up given your "smarky crowd" line. Just seems like a waste of time discussing this. Also Finlay doesnt really light a fire under casual fans either so again I dont get the whole smarky crowd distinction. At least the guys I mentioned have an audience and connect with them. He may know the right the time to kick an opponents knee out from under them but the positive bias can be really overblown and silly at times.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:22 AM   #620 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread

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Originally Posted by Caponex75 View Post
No excitement and weren't built at all. Finlay kicked him to the outside and just smacked him with Celtic Cross. That was it....oh and Sami kicked out randomly at one. The only real nearfall that was built up was the Tombstone due to their previous match and I didn't really care for it. Plus Sami not knowing where to appropriately taught made his deviant acts seem like amateur hour.




Being stiff is awesome like Finlay headbutting the nonsense out of Calihan but they began to over do and made me not care at all about it. Instead of structuring a great match, it was just "O
LEZ HIT ECH OTTER HARD". If there is no real importance on selling, timing, or facial expressions, it isn't real hard for your average Joe to replicate. It's real fucking boring compared to a match with Ki/KENTA where they have the insanely stiff match but the other elements which make a match great(Like comebacks, storytelling, and facial expressions).

Your idea if what you thought was drama/story is great and all but if it isn't executed properly, there isn't exactly a reason for the crowd to give a fuck. I got the idea of Callihan didn't like Finlay and Finlay was some combination of a hard hitting vet but the way it was portrayed was done absolutely poorly. Sami's drooling and attempts at saying f you didn't draw sympathy or really lead to great face in peril like in his last match. The one where he was getting his ass beat and there actually didn't seem like there was nothing he could do about it. HHH/Taker had a near flawless match because everything made sense and while you may say there was a over acting(All opinionated of course), it was built up off of previous matches. More importantly from last year.

Triple H beat the ever loving dog shit out of Taker the previous Mania and it was so bad that Taker couldn't even show face despite being the victor. As soon as HHH gets the chance in the Cell, he makes Taker his own personal Kunta Kinte and HBK, a former wrestler with injuries and has also got his ass whipped by HHH on several occasions, tries to stop it so Taker(A man he respects) can at least do a feat he didn't do last year and that is not look a vegetable. It makes sense, it is executed well, and everything is on point.
I don't think there is anything I will say that would change anything you think about either match. So I guess it's cool that you found stuff to like in the Hell in a Cell match, personally I thought it was garbage. But, it sucks you didn't like Finlay/Callihan as much as me.
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