Location: Christmas Card from a Hooker in Minneapolis
Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread
Originally Posted by Nervosa
Only watched it once, and I loved it. Maybe I'm losing my grip on reality. Or maybe I just need to rewatch it.
I loved it too on my first watch. Got sucked into Nigel egging on Elgin. On the second watch, I thought it was fucking terrible though.
Originally Posted by Cactus
Davey Richards vs Michael Elgin - ROH Showdown in the Sun Day 2
I really don't know why I was so high on this when I first watched this. It was probably the spots that lured me in on my first time but on a second watch I can really see how terrible this match was. There are admittedly some awesome looking spots like the top rope tiger suplex and the fisherman's buster to the floor but there really is nothing behind them and both guys brush themselves off and no-sell their way to next less-impressive spot.
Davey's flaws really can be seen here. Elgin is meant to be a fucking machine and he should be dominating Davey for a good portion of the start and middle of the match but he just keeps fucking reversing everything and it makes Elgin look like any other ROH midget. It's okay to reverse the odd move and hint at a comeback when you are doing a big man vs little man match but Davey really took the piss and killed any sense of structure that Elgin was building.
Don't get me wrong, Elgin wasn't exactly a star here and he's certainly no Mark Henry when it comes to establishing himself as a force to be reckoned with. While Davey's levels of no-selling Elgin's suplexes did really annoy me, Elgin kept resorting to that 'Fighting Sprint' comeback way too many times and it was almost comical. One of the best parts of the match was due to Elgin trying to do his little comeback but collapses due to the punishment his ankle has taken. It's the first sign of selling in this match and it was awesome... until Elgin decides to resort back to no-selling once again.
I'm going on way too much. It's funny how I sometimes struggle to come up with 4-5 lines why I love a match but when tearing this match a new asshole, it all comes naturally. In a nutshell, Richards/Elgin is unstructured mess of a match which spots I would enjoy on their own, but it's really not worth the effort to sit through this sorry excuse of a match.
I'm on the same boat with Edwards/Richards at BITW last year. I loved it initially, but on a rewatch it felt like bit of a mess and even if you visually sell a limb, it means jackshit if that injury isn't going to disable you from pulling of big moves. That's a main problem I have with Davey's selling when he does choose to sell.
I will give credit where credit is due and I will say that I loved ending spot where Davey boots Eddie in the head and the opening 10 minutes or so were solid stuff.
I would do the obligatory "how could Meltzer give that 5 stars" comment. Not going to. That guy is so out of touch with what generally makes a good match these days. It leaves me wondering why he even continues to watch.
He seems to recognize what's brilliant about NJPW at least.
We will sing as one in solidarity, we will sing together. And still we will be here - standing like statues.
Location: In an alley in Burbank trying to re-enter the earth's atmosphere in an old refrigerator box.
Re: The 2012 MOTYC thread
I liked it a bit more than Cactus, but yeah overall it wasn't a match that won me over when I heard the praise for it going in. Davey did sell for most of the match, even though the only time the selling actually really played into a sequence was Elgin's great slip when trying to stand after being in an ankle lock leading to Davey hitting a running kick. I thought the pacing and structure was off for the most part. They had this weird pacing where both guys would go on offence every 2-3 minutes rather than letting one guy get a consistent workover. This was particularly problematic when Elgin hit that beautiful counter on the outside to establish control and really should have been allowed to destroy Richards and make you question how he could come back and retain, but instead nothing really kicked off from that transition spot and they just sort of traded control before the finishing stretch.
I can see why people can look at how it made Elgin look legit (in the eyes of the ROH fans in attendance, as I didn't really think it came close to other breakthrough matches/performances) and why people who love the ROH style would dig it, but its just not a match for me. It wasn't as bad as I feared going in, but it was hardly that much better than I could have expected.
I really should watch more Allmark. I think I'll watch the Mason series over the next couple of days. I've seen bits and pieces of Wayne, a match with Escobar from June that was pretty good (but not as good as I'd seen others pimp it) and a brawl/No DQ match in some obscure setting which again had some great things going for it but overall wasn't 'amazing'. He has really good punches and is a good heel, also seems to be able to work a more general indy match and put enough structure, pacing and selling into it for a lot of the bigger spots to have meaning. The Escobar match for example had a few sequences that could have been really bad if they weren't timed/sold as well as they were, the suicide dive into a DDT on the guardrail being an obvious one here.
Watch this if you haven't already Yeah1993:
Really good and fun match. Think I'm right in saying it was Seabs who pimped this match and got me to check it out. Certainly didn't disappoint and another feather in the Finlay indy run.
Allmark has potential, but he picks up a lot of bad habits from All-Star, he's the equivelant of a cruise ship singer auditioning for The X Factor. He panders to the crowd too much, but he definately has the skills.