The 2011 MOTYC Thread - Page 321 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, ROH, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
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Old 02-10-2012, 02:11 PM   #3201 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

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Originally Posted by Segunda Caida View Post

The whole point of a forum is to discuss contrasting opinions and create good discussion, I understand people get bored of the same Angle/Eddie/Davey bashing but usually the sole reason the discussions get tedious isn't because its been discussed before..but rather only one side seems to be making valid points whereas the other side resorts to 'obvious troll is obvious' comments. I'm sure a lot of people remember that Davey discussion a couple of months back in here involving Capone, Crabtree, Legend, Bubz, Myself, Jawbreaker and maybe Seabs as well as Antonio, SuperduperSonic and possibly McQueen which basically broken down into numerous well made points about Davey being rejected by people saying it wasn't a discussion worth having.
Are you talking about when Nervosa and I argued in this thread for about 10 pages where I was basically making points and he was like "Nah that didn't happen"? Holy shit that was the most uneventual argument I've ever had going nowhere. I also have no problem defending/making a point but there is certain ways you should go about it without trying to make your opinion seem like fact when it is isn't. No one is stupid for liking Richards/Edwards the same way no one is stupid for liking Hero/Claudio or Dragon Gate Matches. You know how much stuff I watched by word of Seabs praising that I didn't think was worth a buck 50 soaking wet? Lord only knows. Fact is that I have my opinion and he has his. I hated Hero/Claudio because I thought it was a long, boring, stupid, and anti-climatic contest that was drawn out only because Hero thinks 40+ contests means instant great. I love psychology and I(As well as the crowd) were waiting for it to end. Doesn't justify me calling Bubz a dipshit for liking it. Hence the argument here and why I have a problem with what Jawbreaker says. Him thinking Richards/Edwards is garbage is entirely different story.
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Old 02-10-2012, 03:58 PM   #3202 (permalink)
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Thumbs up Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

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Originally Posted by Nervosa View Post

for every Davey/Eddie, there is Shinobu/TEIOH vs. Madoka/Mashimo.
Fuck you man. Just when I just want to have a little fun trolling you, you make this statement...I fucking love that tag match, Shinobu's selling is one of the best things I've ever seen.
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Old 02-10-2012, 04:34 PM   #3203 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

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Originally Posted by Caponex75 View Post
Are you talking about when Nervosa and I argued in this thread for about 10 pages where I was basically making points and he was like "Nah that didn't happen"? Holy shit that was the most uneventual argument I've ever had going nowhere. I also have no problem defending/making a point but there is certain ways you should go about it without trying to make your opinion seem like fact when it is isn't. No one is stupid for liking Richards/Edwards the same way no one is stupid for liking Hero/Claudio or Dragon Gate Matches. You know how much stuff I watched by word of Seabs praising that I didn't think was worth a buck 50 soaking wet? Lord only knows. Fact is that I have my opinion and he has his. I hated Hero/Claudio because I thought it was a long, boring, stupid, and anti-climatic contest that was drawn out only because Hero thinks 40+ contests means instant great. I love psychology and I(As well as the crowd) were waiting for it to end. Doesn't justify me calling Bubz a dipshit for liking it. Hence the argument here and why I have a problem with what Jawbreaker says. Him thinking Richards/Edwards is garbage is entirely different story.
You mean that 10 page argument where you made things up that didn't happen in order to create story for a match where both competitors clearly never bothered? Yeah, I remember that one.

But that is not the conversation he is talking about. That was entirely different. Far after I stopped posting here.

But as you said, that is a different story.

I don't think you really understand what Jaws is saying. He isn't saying people don't have a right to there opinions. all of you have a right to it. We just have a right to

1. Ask for more
2. Ask for reasonable support
3. Call people stupid when condition #2 isn't met. Hopefully using ridicule.

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Originally Posted by antoniomare007 View Post
Fuck you man. Just when I just want to have a little fun trolling you, you make this statement...I fucking love that tag match, Shinobu's selling is one of the best things I've ever seen.
ain't that the truth. That sell-job was incredible.

The truly great brings us together, that's for sure.
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Old 02-10-2012, 04:56 PM   #3204 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

Nervosa is correct, I recall that long debate between you two but the one I was on about started when I think Legend said something along the lines of 'Davey hate is just that time of the month'. It prompted myself and others to cite what about Davey we didn't particularly like, but between Crabtree and a few others we somehow ended up on people arguing we thought Kevin Nash was a better worker or something crazy like that.
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Old 02-10-2012, 04:57 PM   #3205 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

Having a different opinion is fine really but you really should be able to back up why a match that a lot people hated was amazing.

I know when the whole Undertaker/Triple H debate was going I went and posted one of the longest reviews of the match that I've ever written to back up my unpopular opinion.

I really think that if you say something is a MOTYC and someone asks you why you should be able to come up with more than, "It was awesome!" or something along those lines.
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Old 02-10-2012, 06:05 PM   #3206 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

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Originally Posted by Caponex75 View Post
Are you talking about when Nervosa and I argued in this thread for about 10 pages where I was basically making points and he was like "Nah that didn't happen"? Holy shit that was the most uneventual argument I've ever had going nowhere. I also have no problem defending/making a point but there is certain ways you should go about it without trying to make your opinion seem like fact when it is isn't. No one is stupid for liking Richards/Edwards the same way no one is stupid for liking Hero/Claudio or Dragon Gate Matches. You know how much stuff I watched by word of Seabs praising that I didn't think was worth a buck 50 soaking wet? Lord only knows. Fact is that I have my opinion and he has his. I hated Hero/Claudio because I thought it was a long, boring, stupid, and anti-climatic contest that was drawn out only because Hero thinks 40+ contests means instant great. I love psychology and I(As well as the crowd) were waiting for it to end. Doesn't justify me calling Bubz a dipshit for liking it. Hence the argument here and why I have a problem with what Jawbreaker says. Him thinking Richards/Edwards is garbage is entirely different story.
Screw you man! That match was awesome!

But seriously, you backed up your argument man (you always do) and I understand why you didn't like it. It's something I wish more people would do better like Taylor said above.

Last edited by Bubz : 02-10-2012 at 06:09 PM.
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Old 02-12-2012, 01:41 PM   #3207 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

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Originally Posted by jawbreaker View Post
how have I blindly defended Strong/Edwards? At no point did I ever pretend that it wasn't an overbooked clusterfuck with a whole bunch of stupid shit that dragged it down, but I'm not pretending it was ***** or even close to it. It was an okay match with some really stupid booking and needless shoehorning in of Truth Martini and Jim Cornette, made really good by Strong's fantastic heel performance. I've defended it at great length several times now, I've responded to criticism and explained why I don't agree, and nobody has said anything sufficiently convincing for me to change my mind (something I'm entirely open to doing and have done several times in the past).
LMAO this is exactly what you're attacking him for..

Ignoring the criticism of others because it doesn't suit your agenda. You think it was "made really good" despite the obvious flaws, and that's your subjective opinion, but going by your very own logic, that opinion is wrong. You don't agree with the criticism of Edwards/Strong, and neither does he toward your criticism of Edwards/Richards...

I mean, how can you not see the hypocrisy here?
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Old 02-12-2012, 02:27 PM   #3208 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

Can you seriously not see the difference between my review of Strong/Edwards and saying Richards/Edwards was "a pure *****" and then clarifying to say that that meant that it "had some epic sequences, was hard-as-hell and the ending was a feel-good moment"?

The post above wasn't clear: it should read "responded to criticism and explained why I don't agree with other ratings". Most of the criticisms of Strong/Edwards I agree with, and that's why I have it at **** (and a pretty weak ****). But Strong's performance was one of the best heel performances I saw in 2011 and that's why I felt comfortable giving it a moderately high rating. Just because it had flaws, obvious, glaring ones even, doesn't mean it wasn't good. It means it wasn't perfect, but where am I arguing that it was perfect?

I mean, how can you not see the difference between accepting a match's obvious flaws and still enjoying it and claiming a match was perfect and ignoring the obvious flaws?
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Old 02-12-2012, 02:34 PM   #3209 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

I can see the difference, but I don't see where you get off telling someone that their opinion is wrong, while you're guilty of very similar faults.

I mean, it wasn't a good match, it did have very obvious, glaring flaws that made it a bad match. You're unwilling to accept that those flaws made it a bad match, the same way he's not able to accept that of Richards/Edwards. Yeah, he's a much more extreme example of it than you are, but you're such a hypocrite for calling him out on it, while being guilty of the exact same thing (lesser extent or not).
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Old 02-12-2012, 03:39 PM   #3210 (permalink)
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Default Re: The 2011 MOTYC Thread

His opinion was objectively wrong because he said it was perfect. If I'd said it was my opinion that Strong/Edwards was perfect, then I couldn't hide behind the "it's my opinion" defense either.

And no, Strong/Edwards wasn't a bad match. It had lots of the characteristics of bad matches (predictability, overbooking, gimmicky stipulations), but what it did well, it did well enough that it wasn't a bad match overall.

I'm not saying there's no room for subjectivity in match evaluations, rather that you can't say something ridiculous, not back it up, and get offended when people say that what you said was ridiculous.
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