[-Mystery-]

Originally Posted by Spartanlax

It's because of the repitition, I did the same thing with Suffocation. ROH matches tend to follow a similar formula, but most of the time it's varied enough that each match seems new, different, and interesting. On Suffocation for example, despite some really solid matches, three seperate matches followed almost the exact same formula. After watching Shingo vs. Jimmy Rave and then watching Austin Aries vs. Claudio Castagnoli, it was like the same match with different wrestlers, felt like I had seen Aries/Castagnoli already (since Shingo/Rave is earlier on the card).

Although, I also said I enjoyed Suffocation overall because of the good matches, so I'm not sure if 'hate the show, avoid it' is the best advice just because of really poor angles. MrPaiMei, do you think you were a bit harsh with the last statement, since you can skip the angles and stuff, or was it really well-deserved?

I didn't find The Bitter End that repetitive. Sure, 3 tag matches in a row can be labeled at reptitive but they really didn't follow the same formula.

Now, the whole Cornette/Konnan thing did suck but I wouldn't say avoid it solely based on that. Like you said you can just skip those segments and still enjoy the show awhole lot. Segments aside the show was really enjoyable and shouldn't be completely ignored.

[MrPaiMei]

Originally Posted by Spartanlax

It's because of the repitition, I did the same thing with Suffocation. ROH matches tend to follow a similar formula, but most of the time it's varied enough that each match seems new, different, and interesting. On Suffocation for example, despite some really solid matches, three seperate matches followed almost the exact same formula. After watching Shingo vs. Jimmy Rave and then watching Austin Aries vs. Claudio Castagnoli, it was like the same match with different wrestlers, felt like I had seen Aries/Castagnoli already (since Shingo/Rave is earlier on the card).

Although, I also said I enjoyed Suffocation overall because of the good matches, so I'm not sure if 'hate the show, avoid it' is the best advice just because of really poor angles. MrPaiMei, do you think you were a bit harsh with the last statement, since you can skip the angles and stuff, or was it really well-deserved?

Dude, I felt it absolutly ruined the show. I tend to watch my shows straight up 3 hours in a row (gives me something to do while my friends have bball practice) so I can see if I'm more affected by it than someone who just watches some matches here and there. But here's my major beef. the crowd was TOTALLY into Cross-Daniels. Then they were absolutly dead. you have a Dragon-Joe staredown... to a dead crowd. Think about that. And then Homicide, who came out to a sizeable pop earlier, and who came out to the biggest ROH pop in history in the same building a few months earlier, comes out to silence FOR THE END OF THE STEVE CORINO FEUD, a match FOUR YEARS in the making. Yes, it probably has more *** matches than the average ROH show, but the average ROH show also has one match that was better than Cide-Corino, my MOTN, and most shows have two that are better. Plus the show staright up is bad to watch. Its not fun at all. No excitement, no varied styles, nothing. While HRB may have had a few less *** matches, it was much more entertaining, had a match in the main that blew away Cide-Corino, had a title match that was on equal level with it, and the six man was just as good as the acclaimed KENTA-Sydal. And that show had a crowd that was into everything. The Konnan thing was fucking stupid and as far as I'm concerned, it ruined a show with good potential.

[-Mystery-]

Originally Posted by MrPaiMei

Dude, I felt it absolutly ruined the show. I tend to watch my shows straight up 3 hours in a row (gives me something to do while my friends have bball practice) so I can see if I'm more affected by it than someone who just watches some matches here and there. But here's my major beef. the crowd was TOTALLY into Cross-Daniels. Then they were absolutly dead. you have a Dragon-Joe staredown... to a dead crowd. Think about that. And then Homicide, who came out to a sizeable pop earlier, and who came out to the biggest ROH pop in history in the same building a few months earlier, comes out to silence FOR THE END OF THE STEVE CORINO FEUD, a match FOUR YEARS in the making. Yes, it probably has more *** matches than the average ROH show, but the average ROH show also has one match that was better than Cide-Corino, my MOTN, and most shows have two that are better. Plus the show staright up is bad to watch. Its not fun at all. No excitement, no varied styles, nothing. While HRB may have had a few less *** matches, it was much more entertaining, had a match in the main that blew away Cide-Corino, had a title match that was on equal level with it, and the six man was just as good as the acclaimed KENTA-Sydal. And that show had a crowd that was into everything. The Konnan thing was fucking stupid and as far as I'm concerned, it ruined a show with good potential.

I warned folks of an awful crowd but I don't think people shouldn't buy the show solely based on a crowd. I mean if everyone bought a show based on it's crowd half the ROH shows wouldn't sell nearly as much as they do. Now, a crowd is an important part of a show but I don't think it makes or breaks a show.

Also, I agree that the Konnan/Cornette segments sucked but by no means did they ruin the show. Simple solution is skip the segments and watch the highly enjoyable matches.

When it comes down to it minus the bad Konnan/Cornette segments (which are easily skippable) and the less than good crowd the show was very solid and deserves a look. The amount of feud progression was tremendous and the matches were really fun to watch.

Finally, a show shouldn't be bought solely based on a good/bad crowd or good/bad segments. In my opinion, a show should be bought based on its match quality. Having a good crowd and segments is just an added bonus. This show deserves look based on its match quality as stated above.

[MrPaiMei]

Dude, were kinda saying the same thing here. My basic beef is that when I watched it straight through, I did not enjoy it at all because of the booking style and stupid segments. if you buy it and watch Cide-Corino and joe/Nigel-Dragon//Rave one day, Daveylirious-Briscoes and Cross-Daniels the next, etc. you'll like it a hell of a lot more than me. But thats not how I roll, so I don't like it.

[Jack Evans 187]

Sorry to interrupt the intense dicussion here, but I have a question. I have Delirious/AmDrag & Homicide/Necro from ROHomicide on a DVD-R. I haven't seen anything from Weekend of Champions Night 2. Is everything else from ROHomicide good enough to buy or should I get WOC N2, which I haven't seen anything??

[MrPaiMei]

I'd suggest WOCN2, especially if you haven't seen Dragon-Nigel, its an awesome match.

[Spartanlax]

Originally Posted by Jack Evans 187

Sorry to interrupt the intense dicussion here, but I have a question. I have Delirious/AmDrag & Homicide/Necro from ROHomicide on a DVD-R. I haven't seen anything from Weekend of Champions Night 2. Is everything else from ROHomicide good enough to buy or should I get WOC N2, which I haven't seen anything??

Well, no, there's nothing left worth buying the DVD for, but you have to get your hands on Kikitaro/Cabana and McGuinness/Lethal, the first is really, really funny (funniest match in ROH for 2006) and McGuinness/Lethal is a reeeally good pure rules match. There's also a solid tag title match, but it's far surpassed at Unified. Buy WOCN2, and download the other matches if you can.

[Jack Evans 187]

Alright, thanks. My final order for this weekend is Dethroned (hopefully if it comes out), Nowhere To Run, WOC Night 2, & Final Battle 2005.

[MrPaiMei]

That's a diesel order, but I will warn you its extremely possible FB2005 and NTR will be in the next $10 sale, so you can save some cash there. The last one is the first I can remember that didn't have NTR, and the last one was the first to have FB2005.

[Jack Evans 187]

Originally Posted by MrPaiMei

That's a diesel order, but I will warn you its extremely possible FB2005 and NTR will be in the next $10 sale, so you can save some cash there. The last one is the first I can remember that didn't have NTR, and the last one was the first to have FB2005.

Well, my b-day is the 15th so I'm not paying a dime for these. Anyway, I think with my money in the next $10 sale I'll pick up Vendetta & another '05 show.