Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread - Page 837 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Indy Wrestling, Lucha Underground, Women of Wrestling Forums

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post #8361 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 04:15 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

Originally Posted by Hailsabin View Post
How you liked the DX vs Legacy cell is beyond me. Hated the way that was worked. All wrong.

at least you enjoyed Orton/Sheamus. That's my pick for the most underrated HIAC. Said that some pages back. Well, I'll say it again. Boosh.
I dont know how you could hate the DX/Legacy HIAC? Yes, it was kind of shitty how Triple H by himself did what HBK couldnt an entire match, but the rest of the match was great.
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post #8362 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 04:43 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

You'd be in the minority for one who liked it. The way their first two PPV matches were done and then to see that? Blah. Should have been done with all 4 inside and letting the intensity boil over. Instead they took out H and beat up Shawn for 15 boring minutes only to be owned 2 minutes later when H got back in the ring. It's not a "omg DX buried them thing". It's simply just a bad way that they worked the match.

Took a look at some Cena/Show matches today:

RAW 3/6/06
John Cena vs Big Show ~ **1/2

Smackdown 2/27/09
John Cena vs Big Show ~ ****

RAW 3/30/09
John Cena vs Big Show ~ *3/4

~ Oh hell yeah the Smackdown is just as great as I remember. If only all of their matches were worked that strongly. Especially on PPV. The beauty of that match is that while Show does dominate it, it doesn't even seem like it. It's so damn interesting. Where as that's a problem with some of their other bouts like Judgment Day 2009. That one goes by soooooo slow thanks to the blah workover phase by Show. He's better than that. The Smackdown match proves it. Good lord at the punch that Cena takes to the temple. Loved that match.

~ 2006 RAW bout is pretty solid. One thing I have to note about watching a match from 06 compared to now (hell even that Smackdown 09 match felt big) was how hot those fans were and how big the match felt. It felt like something that you were excited to see. RAW had such energy once upon a time. Match fed off of it. Utilized the factors going into WrestleMania 22 for it. HHH hanging out on the stage causing Cena to look over his shoulder often. Carlito/Masters attempting a run-in on Show with KANE being the roadblock in their way. One AWESOME part of the match was sadly marred by some TNA-esque camera work. Cena suplexed Show off of the top rope but in the middle of it they panned away to see HHH's face. WHY?! Eventually they showed it via replay. It might be minor, but that upset me. Especially when that move was the turning point of the bout. Oh well I guess. Cena hits one of his BEST F-U's on Show to end it. Even Trips had to stop and say holy shit w/a smile on his face because he was so impressed. You can tell it was honestly legit. Solid bout. On the better half of their matches. I'd put it a notch above WrestleMania 20. Which was their last match prior to this one.

~ The RAW 09 match was meh. It was such a weak, watered down version of the Smackdown 09 bout. Watching those back to back and you can see that clearly. I know they got was less time, but it was pretty standard RAW crap main event style. Only part of the match that was noteworthy was Show doing a BASEBALL SLIDE~!

I looked it up today: 13 singles matches with John Cena vs Big Show. Seen them all pardon the very first one back in 2003. That's the one I have no memory on. I need to find it and see how it ranks up compared to the rest.

Also this:

WWE Main Event 10/31/12

1) Randy Orton, Rey Mysterio, Sin Cara vs Alberto Del Rio & Primetime Players ~ **1/4

2) Wade Barrett vs Tyson Kidd ~ *

~ Not nearly as bad as last weeks, but still pretty lackluster. Short match was fine for what it was. Enjoyed the promo duel with Sheamus vs Barrett. Next week should be a heck of a match. The 6 man was nothing special. If i'm being honest, the only thing I liked about it was Primetime Players. Orton did his same ol stuff. Sin Cara sucks. Not enough Del Rio work. Rey did something...idk I already forgot. See. Forgettable. Like the majority of matches on WWE TV nowadays.

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post #8363 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 09:01 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

Read through the pages and saw some WCW 1990 tags being mentioned, as well as the Steamboat/Douglas vs Windham/Pillman Starrcade tag. Steamboat/Douglas vs Windham/Pillman was #20 on my top 100 WCW matches ballot, only tags I had above it were:

#5 - Ricky Steamboat & Dustin Rhodes vs Arn Anderson & Larry Zbyszko, (Clash Of The Champions XVII 11/19/1991)
#8 - Rock n Roll Express vs Midnight Express w/ Jim Cornette, (Wrestlewar 02/25/1990)
#9 - Southern Boys vs Midnight Express w/ Jim Cornette, (Great American Bash 7/7/90)

Rock n Roll Express vs Midnight Express w/ Jim Cornette, (Wrestlewar 02/25/1990):

Pre match promo from JC is terrific, just oozes extreme heel as well as making the match seem that much greater and must see. Maybe its just me but there's something about southern US accents that really adds to a promo for me and makes it seem much better than say a NYC accent etc. Maybe its because I love a lot of southern wrestling and its influence but hearing a guy like Cornette, Funk or Lawler comes off much more dramatic and resembles 'professional' wrestling a lot better to me. JR saying 'I didn't even know he liked girls' about Cornette was just worthy. Also seeing how well WCW actually PROMOTED this upcoming bout as you know...important and larger than life makes me sad when seeing how WWE promotes tag teams these days.

Anways this is a legit classic tag team match IMO, so many great moments such as the atomic drop collision between the midnight express, Cornette flapping his racket to revive Eaton after he's possibly KO'd, Cornette cracking Gibson with the racket for that gorgeous nearfall and pulling this awesome shit toothed grin before flipping out when it doesn't get the win. Classic southern tag formula with the R n R Express being too hot to handle in the beginning and I really loved Morton being stuck in the corner only to roll through the legs and tag out immediately demonstrating the Midnight Express just could not catch a break. Great bumping from Eaton & Lane as well as Cornette being a constant thorn on the outside, Lane saying Gibson used a closed fist after he eats a shoulderblock etc. Morton's FIP was amazing with him eating the offence wonderfully and them doing a bunch of great cut off spots, cheating behind the ref's back, drawing Gibson into the ring to bend the rules some more, Cornette getting into it with the ref meaning he misses a Morton sunset flip and the hot tag being built to as the R n R Express's last hope of winning the match given the punshment Morton has taken. Shame Morton appeared to be a little out of position on the finish as Eaton simply dropped Gibson without any sign that Morton was in frame but I'm not about to let that detract from a wonderful match, hell the spot in itself was difficult to execute believably even without a miscommunication in timing. Will add Morton climbing onto Lane during a knucklelock to dive onto Lane was a mind blowing spot that I lost my shit for. Top 10 easily and hell this may be my highest ranked tag match with a definate top 5 shot.
Southern Boys vs Midnight Express w/ Jim Cornette, (Great American Bash 7/7/90):

"Why don't you sit down and wipe that ugly off your face you stinking pig faced moron" .

"Karate's not legal in pro wrestling"

JC is awesome man.

Aww man this was incredible, I mean I thought the last match was pushing top 5 for the poll and well this is right up there with it. I mean aside from a killer pacing, we get a breakout team vs the established heels, a killer FIP segment and heel in peril segment and Cornette adds so much to the match with his distractions, antagonising and general despiar when Armstrong & Smothers are on top.

The karate spot and Cornette's reaction is top 20 material by itself and the building to it with the Southern Boys being all over the Midnight Express and in particular Eaton with their pacing, double team moves as well as even besting then in the quick mat exchanges really paint the picture that the Southern Boys are gonna pull off the win of their careers, of course Ross pointing out the roll they've been on actually helps reinforce their credibility (take notes 2011 WWE). Cornette ending up on the floor crying capped off a tremendous heel in peril segment which went around 9 minutes and featured all the classic heels look like goofs and high octane pacing you've come to expect from great southern formula tags. I've also grown to adore how sinister and brutal the Midnight Express are during the transition and control segment, both times Smothers hits the guardrail sounded incredibly brutal and a lot of the closed fist punches and force with how the moves were applied really added to the story, shame a lot of the crowd seemed to love the Midnight Express as it did kind of take away from the Southern Boys's breakout match instead of like in the R n R Express match where not even Lane & Eaton's mothers were cheering them. Loved the hot tag and anarchy which broke out after with bodies flying everywhere and Smothers trying to outsmart Eaton by switching with Armstrong to score a close near fall. Finish was great in keeping heat on Lane & Eaton with the kick to the head into the schoolboy and it really came off as the midnight express being ahead of the southern boys tonight with how they pulled off the spot and got the win. Really nice finish that completed the story and made the Southern Boys look like legit stars...shame the crowd popping for the heels took away a bit of the story in making new stars out of Smothers & Armstrong.
Speaking of overlooked tags, Flair/Windham vs Steamboat/Eddie Gilbert from 89 is really overlooked but is absolutely quality:

Ric Flair & Barry Windham vs Ricky Steamboat & Eddie Gilbert, (1/20/1989)

Tremendous tag match and a lock for top 30. Loved Windham's 'aww son of a bitch' expression as Steamboat's music played and the whole chaotic nature of the first few minutes with Steamboat destroying both Flair & Windham before even young Gilbert manages to be too much for Flair & Windham served as a great introduction to the match. Refreshing to see the commentators play up the smallest bit of detail such as the heels regularly having to rethink their strategy because the faces are too much of them. Gilbert in peril was pretty great I thought, it lacked some hot tag teases but him reguarly getting in a few punches added to his character and the commentators trying to play up a lesser man being beaten by now really added to the drama and development of Gilbert which added excitement to the match. Loved Steamboat in particular doing a favourite spot of mine in tags where he reaches over the rope and almost collapses into the ring; never tires and always serves as a nice spot to show how hungy Steamboat is. Flair's cocky face after chopping Steamboat like he'd just won the battle only to be chopped 10x harder had me rolling and the hot tag and subsequent Steamboat burst of offence was brilliant in setting up Flair/Steamboat for the belt; really refreshing as well to see Steamboat not even be troubled at all during the exchanges and really put him over as the major threat to Flair and the Horsemen, Gilbert looked great working off of Flair & Windham and the heels had good stooging, bumping and snide tactics. For some reason I really marked for the simple transition where Flair faked leaving the ring only to grab Gilbert's leg and hook him to the mat: just oozed 'World Champion intelligence'.
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post #8364 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 10:04 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

Got this BORK documentary on the D/L . Should be a good watch.

Although I do think they have missed out on some money by not doing an all new doc.
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post #8365 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 10:32 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

I'll go ahead and say it; A well done, thorough BORK documentary now has the potential to be better than Punk's BITW documentary, if the WWE are willing to make some sacrifices. The timeline of his career would be absolutely insane.

His amateur wrestling days - His rise to the top during high school and eventually winning the NCAA Wrestling Championship in 2000, after a heatbreaking second place in 1999. Get Shelton Benjamin to talk about that, as he helped coach Lesnar and was his room mate at University. Maybe get some teachers, then girlfriends, school friends etc. to talk about him.

Obviously then his first run - Still have Shelton, as they teamed up in OVW. Have Heyman and MAYBE Cornette and/or Danny Davis who helped train Lesnar in OVW. Then transition in to being called up to the main roster, have the likes of Rey Mysterio, Big Show, The Rock, John Cena etc. all giving their insight in to Lesnar's first run. Throw Vince in there maybe, hell even Zach Gowen, that would be cool. Then talk a little bit about his stint in NJPW because he couldn't make it in to Professional Football. Bring in JR and then some American footballing names/analysts, and then go in to a bit of detail about the lawsuit between Lesnar and the WWE with the no compete clause.

Then move to MMA. Imagine having someone like Dana White, Frank Mir, Randy Couture or even Joe Rogan talking about Lesnar and his meteoric rise to the top of MMA and draw parallels to his rise in wrestling; Amateur and Professional alike. Then slowly move in to his downfall - His illnesses etc. and the eventual retirement after his loss to Alistair Overeem.

Then bring it back to the WWE and his second run and whatever. Blah blah blah.

On top of this, you could break up these segments of the doc with little tidbits about his growing up on a farm and the subsequent "farm strength" that he has and how that has helped him in his career. His personal life, his fame, his natural athleticism etc.

With the right speakers and the right matches, a Bork DVD would be epic. That's what im trying to say.

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post #8366 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 10:35 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

The MMA part of that doc would own. I'd be really interested in hearing stuff from Dana/Mir, especially when he was first coming into the company. And stuff from other big name HW too.

Rusev | Sami Zayn | Dean Ambrose | Alberto Del Rio | Jack Swagger
Timothy Thatcher | Chris Hero | Scott Dawson | Dash Wilder | Roderick Strong
Summer Rae | Charlotte | Carmella | Becky Lynch | Paige

Panthers - Red Sox - Nuggets - Mets
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post #8367 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 10:42 AM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

I got the Brock Lesnar Blu-Ray and I'm disappointed somewhat with the presentation. I thought they were going to take Lesnar's interviews and incorporate them into the old documentary to give it a complete feeling or at least he would give his thoughts on all his matches. Unfortunately, none of that (aside from SummerSlam 2002).

Basically, all you need to know from everything he said is he is a tough guy and he will be WWE (or world) Champion again.

His work is still worth the purchase though since there were only 5 matches on the previous DVD release.

Some notes:

The entrances for the Hogan Vs. Lesnar match are still cut!

The Iron Man Match is still in its entirety.

The missing two minutes after the Goldberg Vs. Lesnar match ends are still cut.

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post #8368 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 12:26 PM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

Originally Posted by Hailsabin View Post
You supremely underrated Punk vs Danielson MITB though. You went my review Cena/HHH WrestleMania 22 on it. (yeah, I gave it a bs rating. I know that now. :hhh)
Nah man, fuck that match!

I'll give it another watch soon and re-review it, though. Just to see what if I missed anything. But fuck AJ, she ruins everything she's involved in.
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post #8369 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 01:14 PM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

@Segunda Caida: Flair/Windham vs. Steamboat/Gilbert from 89 is definitely quality, no offense to Steamboat and Gilbert however personally Flair and Windham made that match for me I just thought that their heel work in that match was fundamental excellence but during that time you'd come to expect it from those guys lol.

WWE presents... nWo: Back in Black 2002 review

Quick Thoughts: In hindsight, this was a disappointing set. It wasn't long and they glossed over a LOT of stuff; they pretty much only covered the first 3-4 months of its formation and skipped straight ahead to their WWE run (strange that they never went with Hall/Nash vs. Rock/Hogan at Backlash). The matches were mostly milestones. Overall, this was a decent set that smelled like "cash in", hopefully their new DVD is better.

Kevin Nash & Scott Hall vs. Sting, Lex Luger & Randy Savage (7/7/96)- **1/4
Hogan, Nash, Hall & Sting vs. Flair, Anderson, Luger & Sting (9/15/96)- ***
Goldberg vs. Kevin Nash (12/27/98)- **1/2
The Rock & Steve Austin vs. Hogan, Nash & Hall (3/11/02)- ***

I for Matt Hardy (A Matt Hardy guy since '99):
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post #8370 of 20566 (permalink) Old 11-02-2012, 02:45 PM
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Re: Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

Originally Posted by Brye View Post
This much own.

Just watched it, very fun six man. Crazy to me that the Uso's aren't higher up on the tag team totem pole.

You know you remember this.
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