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Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

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#1 ·
#9,061 · (Edited)
Agreed, second best Rock match. Top 5 Rock matches:

1. Vs Austin WM17 *****
2. Vs HHH JD00 **** 1/2
3. Vs Hogan WM18 **** 1/4
4. Vs Austin WM19 ****
5. Vs Angle/Taker Vengeance 2002 *** 1/2-3/4
 
#9,063 ·
Top 5 Rock Matches:

1. Vs Austin - WrestleMania 19. Adore this match. And I'd happily say its as good as it is because of The Rock. Its HIS match from their series. His promo beforehand is the best promo he's ever done too.

2. Vs HHH - Judgement Day 2000 Iron Man. Second best Iron Man ever (Lesnar/Angle #1).

3. Vs Austin - WrestleMania 17. WM 19 is Rock's match, this is Austin's.

4. Vs HHH - Backlash 2000. My all time favourite PPV, and while its overbooked to shit, its overbooked to shit in the absolute PERFECT way. Russo should have been taking notes.

5. Vs The Undertaker Vs Angle - Vengeance 2002. No longer ***** (making Rock's total number of 5 star matches 0 lol), but I still love it a lot. Just not as much :p.
 
#9,064 ·
Started watching some WWE stuff from the decade, thought I'd write a bit about one of the matches I never properly got around to watching before...

The Rock vs. Triple H - Iron Man Match (WWF Judgment Day 05/21/00)
Holy fuck, Triple H was so badass in 2000. Seriously, his entrance is one of the most awesome things…ever. Looks like a boss walking down followed by Steph, Vince and Shane. Reminds me of how much I used to mark out for him despite hating him at the same time. Also forgot just how insane Rocky’s pops were, jesus, every single time he comes out it’s ridiculously loud, gives all of his matches from this time period a great atmosphere imo. Anyway…

Stare dwon at the start is great, they hate each other. Rock was always great at that kind of thing, talking shit to his opponents and looking angry before his matches. Absolutely loved the start of this, seeing stuff from these two we’ve never seen before because of them adapting to the match type. Rock going for the pin attempts early off the shoulder blocks and the roll ups was cool, and Trips’ going to the outside out of frustration was great. Already this feels like a really different type of match completely to what we’d usually get from these two, or any main event style match from the time, and I really dig it.

I really liked the first fall for The Rock, put over how Hunter will try and strategize but Rock is more full on with his offence so him countering the arm work Trips was going for into the Rock Bottom was great. The missed knee on the barricade was a good transition spot into the next portion of the match. Rock controlling the match and working over the leg is something I didn’t expect (never actually seen first half of this before, and what I have seen I can‘t really remember), but it’s really good, and Trips is great selling everything. Figure Four is a good spot, actually expected one of them to tap in the hold. The first two falls for Triple H are fine and dandy, he hit’s a desperation Pedigree out of nowhere for the first, sells the leg really well, and then small packages Rock for the second. The thing about this is, it’s really putting over both guys finishers as certain match enders, and having Rock remain out of it after the Pedigree for ages was a great touch and not being able to escape even a roll up for Trips’ second fall ruled.

I really dug them going to the outside with Rock still loopy from the Pedigree, and walking around like a drunk while Hunter goes on the attack. Rock hitting desperation stuff up the entrance isle, especially the back suplex was great. It didn’t look smooth, and it was kind of sloppy, but JR’s “Rock’s heart was in the suplex, but his head was not” really put over how groggy he still is and him not hitting the move smoothly really added to the match. JR fucking rules, not like I have to tell anyone that. When Rock comes back around he’s back in control, but Trips hits another huge desperation move for another fall, this time it’s a piledriver. Piledriver getting a fall was awesome to see. Triple H is selling the leg all the time, and both guys sell the fatigue and the effects of the match really well too.

The match kicks into higher gear after that fall and the arm drag off the top rope by Rock. Trips going for the sleeper could easily have been seen as trying to kill time, but it totally worked and it wasn’t even locked in for that long either, but it was a logical spot for Hunter and in the context of the match. The next fall for Rock seemed a little anticlimactic because Rock kind of fluffed the float over DDT, but who the hell is complaining there, for a guy who never wrestles these long matches it’s always going to happen. I like that all the falls up until this point have been desperation spots with big moves.

The next part of the match completely rules. Rock is on the advantage after the DDT, and Trips gets desperate and sacrifices a fall by cracking Rock with a chair, but it’s ok because he can gain a fall straight back because Rock is out cold. I adore spots like that in these kind of matches. Trips then using the sleeper to get another fall was again, awesome stuff. Rock is totally dead now.

Loved The Rock getting back into it and hitting the Pedigree on the table which looked sick! Another great way to end a fall (by countout), and then followed by the McMahons coming back down and getting involved only for Michaels to get involved and allowing Rock to hit the People Elbow to tie things up. Crowd is molten by this point and it’s amazing. Rocky getting back into it after being down and out was a great baby face comeback moment. The crowd was testament to how good it was. Then DX gets involved and Taker’s video package starts playing in the background while everyone beats down The Rock. It’s an awesome moment and still had me freaking out like a child on this viewing. Crowd is insane, they really think Rock has it in the bag now because Taker has come to kill everyone and help him out and it makes for an amazing atmosphere. But it wasn’t to be. The swerve ending was great, pretty sure everyone knows how it ends. Crowd are pissed, but not in a ‘this sucks’ way, in a ‘I hate that bastard and I hate that he won’ way where they are just mad that the heel won.

Yeah, it got a tad overbooked towards the end (just like the backlash match), but it was hella fun, and the match that preceded it was absolutely superb on pretty much every level. Never felt like anything was done to kill time, everything felt logical and important, and all the falls were worked very well. Both guys put on brilliant performances too. I seriously loved this. ****1/2
Great review for a great match. ***** imo, even with the slightly botched ending, but who cares, it was the Attitude Era. Very little made sense, but it was incredible TV.
 
#9,067 ·


This vid made me appreciate Rock/Austin WM19 alot more, I didn't understand why people were giving the match **** 1/2+ but now I get it. I could probably give it as high as **** 1/4

that whole video series is amazing btw
 
#9,070 ·
I'm the only person here who isn't THAT crazy about Austin vs Rock from WrestleMania 17. It's a low **** match for me. It sort of loses my interest about as much as an electric, memorable match could do. (if that makes sense) Idk, I would have prefered a shorter bout. I think that's why their WrestleMania 19 match blows it away for me. They went out there with 11 minutes less and tore it up. Plus it didn't feel like that drawn out Attitude Era brawling stuff which I don't care for. WrestleMania 19 gave off that awesome King's Road type vibe. It was mega the moment the bell rang.

I don't rate Hogan vs Rock very high, but I love it. Thought it was really entertaining bout. Cena vs Rock went too long. That's the problem. Still liked it though. Oh, and Undertaker vs Rock vs Angle from Vengeance '02 is AMAZING. If it wasn't for the 2004 Triple Threat combo, that would probably by my favorite Triple Threat match in WWE history.

Haven't seen those awesome Rock vs Triple H matches from 2000 since I bought the PPVs back in that year. :(
 
#9,073 ·
Judgment Day 2005:

MNM vs Hardcore Holly/Charlie Haas - **1/2
- The latter has to be one of the most random tag teams ever. This is just your typical, generic obligatory tag team title defense on PPV but it's not bad neither good, just okay.

Carlito vs Big Show - **
- Way too short and the only highlight is Matt Morgan giving Big Show the F5.

Paul London vs Chavo Guerrero - ***
- A decent match between two good cruiserweights. They get 10 minutes and make the most of it. And wow @ London. He takes some reckless bumps but still goes on, that's awesome!

Booker T vs Kurt Angle - **3/4
- Stupid feud although a bit funny with Angle bringing out his comedic best. The match itself is nothing special just decent but I simply couldn't get into the story because it's damn stupid. It started off with a chair-shot then suddenly Angle turns the attention to Booker's wife and talks about beastiality sex, lol. About time Booker also gets to win a match that matters.

Orlando Jordan vs Heidenreich - *
- Total shit and Heidenreich's "are you my friend?" shtick is even worse than Eugene and also a rehash to an extent. They should have gotten rid of him at this point already since he brings nothing to the table.

Eddie Guerrero vs Rey Mysterio - ****
- Much better than their Wrestlemania 21 match but that's also because of a better story. Eddie is now the sadistic heel who's only concern is beating the hell out of Rey while Rey is the underdog that refuses to lose. They go for almost 20 minutes and it's a great match while it lasts from the storytelling to the wrestling itself. I found Chavo's interference unnecessary but the DQ finish was in-line with Eddie's will to just physically destroy Rey. One thing I found funny was when Eddie threw Rey in the ring early in the match then out again to break the count, Tazz & Cole even pointed it out. Now I'm just waiting for their 23/6 match which should be a classic.

John Cena vs JBL - ****1/2
- Now this is more like it! After that underwhelming Wrestlemania match, here we are in an "I Quit" match between these two and simply put, it's a bloody battle. They explore all the options they are given from going to the top of that huge truck to using the limo door, to going through glass and announcer tables. Both men also bleed buckets. One of the best Cena matches ever and the one that "made" him into a permanent main eventer and a force to be reckoned with.

Overall: **3/4 out of ***** (Save for the two 5 minute matches with the lowest ratings, this PPV just gets better as it goes on with two amazing main event matches and some enjoyable stuff on the undercard. I'd say it's worth it just for the last two matches, though. Also why the hell is The Undertaker inactive at this point? He's just disappeared since WM21 and I assume he returns when Orton moves over to Smackdown. Otherwise, I have to say it's a pleasant surprise that the SD exclusive PPVs are doing so much better in 05 compared to 04 where they were terrible almost start to finish.)
 
#9,074 ·
So am I the only one that adores Rock vs. Jericho from No Mercy '01? That's my #1 Rock match for sure and pretty high up there for Jericho too, a pretty high end **** 1/2 in my eyes.
Nah it's awesome. One of the Rock's best performances and matches ever. One of Jericho's best matches as well.

SURVIVOR SERIES:
-The Mysterios v Those Other Guys: Um...this happened. Wasn't good. I remember....something. Not worth a shit w/e.
-Diva's Title: This was great. Gave me time to get some fruit for lunch. The match was also ****1/2 and a MOTYC.
-US Title: Fine match with a really nasty uppercut thing from Cesaro. That should definitely be his finisher.
-Vickie/AJ segment: This was as bad as anything I've seen in a long time. Is Gewirtz back?
-Show/Sheamus: I seemed to be one of the only people that thought their match at HIAC would be MOTN before it happened. Didn't change my tune for this show. Definite MOTN; these two have a really good quasi-formula worked out. Some of the fat could be trimmed since Show's controlling goes a little long and gets a little tedious, but the heavyweight slugging and big moves stuff is great. Finish was bullshit. They're out of ideas.
-Team Foley v Team Zigg: This was OK. Bryan's been shafted since the anger management stuff. It's like he doesn't stick out from the pack any more. The Miz looked stupid. Final moments were weird. TURN ZIGGLER. I loved the "I hate you" segment earlier on.
-WWE Title 3-way: This fuckin' stunk. A lot of the time they were pretty much epitomizing "I roll out the ring you come in". Ryback is a god awful bald piece of useless shit. I remember weeks ago there a Goldberg v Ryback thread and people were saying crap like 'Goldberg is better at squashes but Ryback is better at actual matches'. Obviously talking out of their arses and I wonder if they've changed opinions after his two terrible performances in the main event of back to back PPVs. Pops up after big moves and nothing he does looks good. Yuck. Another weird finish, but this at least could lead to something. CM Punk leading a bunch of FCW followers would be cool.

Grumpy verdict: BAD SHOW.
 
#9,076 ·
I WOULD do a first take on tonight's Survivor Series PPV , but I felt the show was just so lackluster and uninspired that I don't feel like it. FUCK IT. Show-Sheamus was fucking great but not as good as the HIAC encounter as all , while Ryback needs to be out of main event matches like NOW. He's fucking garbage and if I have to see him main event any more PPV's you might just see me pull an Austin101 on here. I'm gonna go ahead and say that he's on BARRETT-MIZ BAD main event level matches.

Why stick Punk with him ? We're CLEARLY on cruise control with Punk until the Rumble, so why not give us a damn good match here or something with Punk-Cena again , or FUCK even a Punk-Orton match or some shit... Don't you think THAT would be good ? Ryback is TRASH.

Another thing that REALLY pissed me off ; WHY... WHY in the name of fuck is Daniel Bryan being treated like a second banana to DEL RIO of all people ? Bryan is easily one of the most over performers in the company right now and you've honestly just had him tap out with ease to the individual who has been more force fed to the audience than any other performer in HISTORY. Seriously, Del Rio sucks too.

The GOOD news : We're more than likely getting a Sheamus-Show chairs match at TLC that should be fucking awesome, and we're more than likely getting an Orton heel turn soon, probably leading to a Sheamus-Orton match at Wrestlemania. TLC better feature Cena-Punk or Punk-??? WITHOUT Ryback. FUCK.
 
#9,077 ·
I'm annoyed by the Danielson loss to Del Rio too, but I don't look into the elimination tags for much except for the result. Dolph won. That's the only thing that's gonna matter for tomorrow and onward.

The face/heel dynamics of Miz & Orton matter too. I'll give those their due. The Orton one was a total swerve, but YES at the signs being there. A week and a half ago he was high-fiving Mysterio & Sin Cara. Now he's surly. It's random, but I'll take it. It's needed. Much like Miz going face is to revitalize his career.
 
#9,078 ·
I'm thinking Ziggler-Orton-Sheamus at Mania. That's when Zig'z cashes in. Orton's potentially a darkhorse candidate to win the Rumble for a second time, although I still think Cena takes it for his inevitable second (and shitty) match with Dwayne.
 
#9,079 ·
You're thinking Rocky is gonna win the WWE Championship come Rumble? Oh, how I'm hoping that doesn't go down.

I got no idea for the World Championship. Look at last year around this time. Henry was champ and feuding with Big Show. Then WrestleMania ended up being Sheamus vs Danielson of all matches. Not even gonna attempt to predict.
 
#9,080 ·
If Punk drops the belt I want it to be at Mania and NOT at the Rumble , preferably to The Undertaker (who drops it back at Extreme Rules) with Rock Cena II and HHH Lesnar II . That's ideal. However, Rock is a celebrity and if there's one unwritten rule in WWE it's this ; celebrities do NOT lose.

You know, on a side note I have a theory on why Punk has had such a long title reign, and it's because of Night of Champions 2011. Trips saw how over Punk was at the time and decided that before they give him the company reigns , Trips suggested that he personally oversee that Punk "does what's best for business" :hhh

AND THUS THE YEAR LONG REIGN BEGUN ! :punk2
 
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