[JoeRulz]

Angle/Mysterio from Japan. Now, that was a helluva match.

[Brye]

Originally Posted by WOOLCOCK

People still not getting the idea of subjectivity bemuses me.

Angle is bad more times than he's good for me because his selling is shoddy, his matches lack a clear story, structure or sense of pacing, very little in the way of build occurs in his matches and his matches post 2003 (with a few exceptions) generally feel comprised of lazy transitions, nearfalls and kickouts which aren't built to or sold extensively and essentially all style with little substance. That being said, I don't begrudge anyone for getting caught up in the pace and style of his matches and totally see why what irritates me is what draws others in. I mean christ I adore Finlay, Jim Duggan, Jerry Lawler, Bill Dundee & Dick Murdoch but I would understand if people didn't get sucked into their best matches because the pace generally is more refined and the action is basic with more thought going into storytelling, character work and pacing. I would disagree if people thought some of their best matches weren't good, but as long as the person explained their reason I could at least understand what specifically bothered them. People who laugh off an opinion irritate me.

Sheamus vs Dolph Ziggler, Main Event (1/9/13)

Not massively high on it but I thought it was a step in the right direction and one of the examples of where Ziggler's counter heavy style can shine if there's enough build and general selling in between the nearfalls to hold the match together. Much better way for Ziggler to build genuine nearfalls and test Sheamus whilst making the idea of the wrestler landing the decisive blow being the victor without minimising his signature offence. Thought the middle was a marked improvement and whilst it was still lacking that truly gripping control segment, the mini theme of Ziggler constantly thwarting Sheamus from making a comeback was a cool little narrative before his flurry after Ziggler got too cocky. A couple of transitions in the finishing stretch seemed a little mistimed, but that's easily forgiveable and the only time I thought there was a little suspect selling was Ziggler's running leap into the top rope DDT. Overall a good outing with the long term selling from both men being beneficial in aiding the down time between the counter heavy sequences and ensured this was a better done 'counter orientated' match with both men having to fight to regain control, rather than numerous transitions which felt aimless.

Completely agree with this.

[WOOLCOCK]

I don't think the day has come yet where we've not seen eye to eye Brye

[Vader]

This is the only part of the WWE section I bother with, we need someone on Mong Patrol so this thread doesn't get filled with morons.

[WOOLCOCK]

Angle discussions have never ended well really, seems to always attract people who disagree but don't really offer an explanation as to why and just laugh any contrary arguments off. Should probably be culled like any reference to HHH/Taker KOTR 2002. God what a shite match.

[sharkboy22]

Oh don't worry, I'm still waiting on that day lol.

Hey, I respect opinions as much as others but dammit there's a limit. I have no problem who like that high spotty style of wrestling but please, please, please don't ever try to tell me that a babyface comeback insults your intelligence while guys taking turns dropping each other on their heads 50 times doesn't. Just don't. You lose all credibility.

Anyway, just finished with Orton/Taker WM 21. Pretty fun match. I have it somewhere it the ***3/4-**** range.

Up next is Summerslam 2005 right?

[The Lady Killer]

I'll admit I'm entertained by a lot of Angle matches, regardless of the lack of structure/storytelling/selling. He's one of the exceptions.

[sharkboy22]

I liked Angle/Mysterio from SS '02. That was a 90mph match , that was incredibly entertaining. Then again, it made sense. One, it was the opener, and two, it went like 10 minutes. Those two did a tremendous job of seeing the tone for the night.

Fast paced, spot fests have their place on the card. But the World Title match is not that place.

[Big Z]

Originally Posted by WOOLCOCK

Angle discussions have never ended well really, seems to always attract people who disagree but don't really offer an explanation as to why and just laugh any contrary arguments off. Should probably be culled like any reference to HHH/Taker KOTR 2002. God what a shite match.

That match never happened. Doesn't exist. Shouldn't be referenced because its not real. Go away now.

[WOOLCOCK]

I've said it before, a lot of my annoyance with Angle stems from his ability to actually work very good matches when he wants to. Seeing him work matches with very little redeeming qualities beside some stand out spots when he's delivered some very good performances and matches in his career is irritating.

@ Cal, agree. Should be discussed about as often as that match where Diesel won the title in quick fashion. Never to be mentioned again!