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Old 06-22-2011, 07:40 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default The Ultimate Warrior

Now i know that a lot of what happened to The Ultimate Warrior in his career was down to himself as he shot himself in the foot and often believed he was worth a lot more than he really was but how big could he have really been in personal opinion had he not shot himself in the foot on numerous occasions throughout his career. Looking back to 1989 in particular he was clearly as popular as Hulk Hogan was despite being a mid carder at that point and a very strong case could be made for The Ultimate Warrior actually surpassing Hulk Hogan in terms of popularity from 1990 through to 1991 when he was fired by Vince McMahon.

Recently i either read somewhere from Bret Hart or heard an interview that Bret Hart had done in which he stated that Vince McMahon wanted to go with Warrior/Hogan rematch at WrestleMania 7 and then proposed it for SummerSlam in 1991 as well which would have taken The Ultimate Warrior's career to new levels but Bret Hart also said that Vince McMahon wanted to put the WWE title on The Ultimate Warrior in 1992 before dropping it to Bret Hart at The Royal Rumble to put him over. Obviously because of The Ultimate Warrior being fired again in 1992 just prior to Survivor Series a Warrior/Flair match couldn't happen and then once Ric Flair stated his intention to go back to WCW a Hart/Flair match was done at a house show in Canada and we then saw Hennig/Flair and Hart/Ramon as the two main feuds kicking off 1993.

We didn't see anything of The Ultimate Warrior outside of his comic books until 1996 when he once again returned prior to WrestleMania 12 and a match with Triple H but it was said that Vince McMahon really wanted to do something with Shawn Michaels and The Ultimate Warrior in 1996 because he believed that The Ultimate Warrior could still draw due to his star power being higher than anyone else on the roster at that time. I remember reading or hearing in the last few years about SummerSlam or/and Survivor Series being the likely places for Michaels/Warrior happening but again because The Ultimate Warrior was fired for the third and final time due to missing house shows he was billed to appear at it never happened but much like in his main era he could have added so much to his legacy due to being the biggest name in WWE at that time in 1996.

Obviously his whole run in 1998 in WCW was centred around him feuding with Hulk Hogan which saw quite possibly the worst big match in mainstream wrestling history at Halloween Havoc and a tag team match alongside Sting against Hulk Hogan and Bret Hart just prior but Eric Bischoff said they had major plans for him as a main event star. By the latter part of 1998 we had seen WCW begin to struggle as WWE really upped their game but Eric Bischoff stated that Goldberg and The Ultimate Warrior were to be their two main focuses which would have seen more added to the career of The Ultimate Warrior but financial disagreements with WCW meant it was a very short term deal and The Ultimate Warrior would never be involved in mainstream wrestling again.

For me the biggest names in wrestling history would read Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold Steve Austin and The Rock as the top three with Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Sting, Randy Savage, John Cena, Bret Hart and The Undertaker probably rounding off the top ten although that list is only my own personal opinion and is entirely arguable but i believe had The Ultimate Warrior been a lot more sensible in his career and not believed his own hype he would most likely be in that list. In my opinion The Ultimate Warrior will forever rank alongside Goldberg as a star he shone brighter than almost everyone else for a period of a year or so but is nowhere near as big as they could have been or they themselves believe they are and probably wouldn't make top fifteen or possibly even top twenty of the biggest names of all time in the American wrestling industry.
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Old 06-22-2011, 08:01 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

i disagree .. goldberg and warrior became icons and made name for themselves in just a short time ..


warrior wrestled his last match 13 years ago and he's still known worldwide

he's not bigger than hulk or austin or rock , but he's their on the list and not very far below them

the guy was a mega draw back then ..


it's like every era has two big guys , well in the golden era it was hogan and warrior ..



and when it comes to goldberg .. he was the only reason to watch wcw from 1999 to 2001 .. other than that nobody gave a damn and probably nobody would've watched
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Old 06-22-2011, 08:42 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

I think had he continued throughout the 90's the fans would have turned against him, as they realised how limited he actually was. But then a heel turn would have been interesting.

Bischoff really screwed up with him in WCW after that stunning debut on Nitro. The whole supernatural aura bombed and putting him against washed up Hogan straight away was an obvious mistake. Guys like Jericho, Benoit and Hart could have carried him.


He missed out on millions due to an inflated ego and gave nothing to help younger stars.
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Old 06-23-2011, 02:35 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

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Originally Posted by Rocky Mark View Post
i disagree .. goldberg and warrior became icons and made name for themselves in just a short time ..


warrior wrestled his last match 13 years ago and he's still known worldwide

he's not bigger than hulk or austin or rock , but he's their on the list and not very far below them

the guy was a mega draw back then ..


it's like every era has two big guys , well in the golden era it was hogan and warrior ..



and when it comes to goldberg .. he was the only reason to watch wcw from 1999 to 2001 .. other than that nobody gave a damn and probably nobody would've watched
I'll agree that he was a draw for a short time but he could have been a long term mega draw had he not ruined his whole career because of his ego, i was actually a fan of his over Hulk Hogan and was so happy when he beat Hulk Hogan at WrestleMania 6 to become the top guy but he ruined it. It is also very hard to determine who was the other top guy in that era with Hulk Hogan because there is a case for any of Andre The Giant, Randy Savage and The Ultimate Warrior to have been the main support act to Hulk Hogan back then but for me outside of 1990 i would say Randy Savage was the main support act.

Had The Ultimate Warrior gone through his whole career the same way as he did in between 1989 and 1991 in which he was a major star he may have been talked about in the same breath as the group that i call "The Golden Trinity" in Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold Steve Austin and The Rock because he was a draw and his popularity in 1990 alone probably surpassed Hulk Hogan. Had The Ultimate Warrior stuck around in 1992 when he was due to be WWE champion and been the main star in 1993 his star would have been brighter as it would also have been had he stuck around in 1996 when he was set to be the main star then as well alongside Shawn Michaels but the reality is he didn't either time and is nowhere near as big as he should have been.

As for Goldberg which is going off topic he was a major draw in 1998 but that was it because by 1999 no one cared about WCW at all despite them attempting to go back to basics with WCW/NWO again which despite being done with Sting a couple of years before would still have drawn had WCW booked it properly and Goldberg still been the draw he believed he was. WCW tried to build the company around Goldberg and it failed and then when Goldberg came to WWE in 2003 he was horribly exposed because everyone could see how poor he was in the ring whilst not being big enough to fill the gap after Stone Cold Steve Austin and The Rock had left and offered a chance for someone to come in but despite being an established star and meant to be a major draw Goldberg failed.
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Old 06-23-2011, 04:43 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

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Originally Posted by Rocky Mark View Post
and when it comes to goldberg .. he was the only reason to watch wcw from 1999 to 2001 .. other than that nobody gave a damn and probably nobody would've watched
Are you serious bro?

Let's take a look at some WCW stars worth watching in the late 90's (outside of the NWO)

Chris Benoit, Dean Malenko, Ric Flair, Sting, Red Texas Rednecks, Eddie Guerrero, Raven, Rey Mysterio,Billy Kidman, Diamond Dallas Page.

Now let's take a look at my additional list (personalized) of people to watch over Goldberg:

Glacier, Scotty Riggs, Louie Spicolli, David Taylor, Lenny Lane.

the Ultimate Warrior is still a huge name in pro wrestling and well known and sure as hell more well known than Goldberg.
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Old 06-23-2011, 07:17 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

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Originally Posted by jimboystar24 View Post
Are you serious bro?

Let's take a look at some WCW stars worth watching in the late 90's (outside of the NWO)

Chris Benoit, Dean Malenko, Ric Flair, Sting, Red Texas Rednecks, Eddie Guerrero, Raven, Rey Mysterio,Billy Kidman, Diamond Dallas Page.

Now let's take a look at my additional list (personalized) of people to watch over Goldberg:

Glacier, Scotty Riggs, Louie Spicolli, David Taylor, Lenny Lane.

the Ultimate Warrior is still a huge name in pro wrestling and well known and sure as hell more well known than Goldberg.
I will always say that The Ultimate Warrior is a big name in the wrestling industry still to this day but my question is how big do people believe he could have been had his mainstream singles career lasted longer than around four years in total with his longest run being his first run in between mid 1988 and mid 1991. This was a man who seriously rivalled Hulk Hogan for the title of most popular wrestler anywhere in the world in his first WWE run with some believing he actually surpassed the popularity of Hulk Hogan in early 1990 which is why Vince McMahon gave him a shot at being top guy.

Had he stayed in 1991 he would have continued his feud with The Undertaker and then had his planned feud with Jake Roberts which i believe would have been gold because Jake Roberts much like Randy Savage could work with even the most limited wrestler and make them look great, we would have seen Warrior/Flair in 1992 and the planned WWE title run for The Ultimate Warrior and the planned Warrior/Hart match. He would have been the biggest name in WWE in between 1993 and 1996 so would have surely added much more to his standing in the industry as would his WCW run had he not ruined that as well so my question is how big could he have been not how big is/was The Ultimate Warrior.
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Old 06-23-2011, 07:43 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

Hogan and Macho Man were the 2 big draws from the late 80's. Top 4 names 1.Hogan 2. Macho Man 3. Andre The Giant 4. Ultimate Warrior
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Old 06-25-2011, 09:58 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

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Originally Posted by scottyrussell316 View Post
Hogan and Macho Man were the 2 big draws from the late 80's. Top 4 names 1.Hogan 2. Macho Man 3. Andre The Giant 4. Ultimate Warrior
I can't argue with that list but that still doesn't answer my question on how big The Ultimate Warrior could have potentially been had his career panned out differently.
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Old 06-25-2011, 10:59 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

the warriors only remembered so fondly because he didnt stick around for too long.

had he been a constant presence for 10-15 years people would have gotton bored of him and his insane promos

you only need to see his recent videos to see the guys still working the same schtick hes been doing since his debut.

to keep going for a couple of decades you need to have versatility to change with the times. The warriors obviously a nut job who has neither the ability or versatility to change his act to keep him on top

its not just about him making better career choices. its about him needing a complete change in attitude and personality.

Last edited by nachoman : 06-25-2011 at 11:01 AM.
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Old 06-25-2011, 12:31 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Ultimate Warrior

Quote:
Originally Posted by nachoman View Post
the warriors only remembered so fondly because he didnt stick around for too long.

had he been a constant presence for 10-15 years people would have gotton bored of him and his insane promos

you only need to see his recent videos to see the guys still working the same schtick hes been doing since his debut.

to keep going for a couple of decades you need to have versatility to change with the times. The warriors obviously a nut job who has neither the ability or versatility to change his act to keep him on top

its not just about him making better career choices. its about him needing a complete change in attitude and personality.
disagree .. when he returned in wcw in 1998 he was a bit edgier .. plus it's common sense that a character or gimmick would improve and evolve by time

look at undertaker for example , first he was a silent deadman .. then by 1996 he started cutting his own promos without paul bearer .. and in 1999 his character became a hybrid between the deadman and the biker gimmick (he was the leader of the ministry but still weared a bandana and talked in a texan way , imo best undertaker ever) .. and in 2000 he became a fully american badass , and by 2004 he was a deadman once again ..

i'm sure warrior would've had a character transition as well
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