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It's so easy to cater to the IWC and the casuals

4K views 46 replies 35 participants last post by  RapShepard 
#1 ·
Why don't most people realise this? Most "names" within the industry, that is.

Casuals eat up whoever is portrayed in a certain way. Treat someone like a star, give them decent entrance music, give them time and they'll eat up whatever merch the company put out for them.

The IWC love wrestlers.

I don't see how ANY casual that goes to events or watches doesn't care for wrestling. You put on a show, you get over. You put on a great promo, you get over. No one casually watches if they have no interest in the mat based aspect of the show.

So, why is it that everyone thinks the two audiences are different? Casuals are the same people that watch week in and out. The same people that buy merch. Why are the two groups always separated like they're a completely different fanbase?

We all watch the same thing that is, for the most part, shit on by the real world. Why do people alienate either group in order to get their points across?
 
#2 ·
I don't see how ANY casual that goes to events or watches doesn't care for wrestling. You put on a show, you get over. You put on a great promo, you get over. No one casually watches if they have no interest in the mat based aspect of the show.
Most of it is WWE's fault with the booking. Example: most casuals have no idea who Finn Balor is. They see him debut, and win against Reigns, a guy who has been booked as an unstoppable main event talent for the past 2 years, and it's confusing as hell. That doesn't make people come back to watch next week.
 
#4 ·
It's because the leadership is crazy delusional. They don't like being criticised and they created this fantasy "casual " that coincidentally wants WWE to be whatever Vince thinks it should be.

I think the need for network subscribers and the USA network sitting them down and telling them to get their shit together has somewhat forced them out of their delusion.

Plus the internet massively expanded the number of well informed and knowledgeable fans. I'm a guy that watches a shit tonne of wrestling, NJPW, ROH, PWG, LU, EVOLVE, DG, PROGRESS fucking all of it and back in the day most of the IWC was like that and we were a faily small group. But now it's far more diverse and represents most of WWE'S audience.
 
#5 · (Edited)
Marks should realize that IWC is not a single entity.

There are millions of differing opinions, and not a single coherent one.

:tripsscust


There will always be a vocal portion of audience who will dislike the product.

You push any mark darling to the moon, just like those marks want, and still the same marks will turn against their own darlings.

These cough*hoes*cough marks ain't loyal.
 
#6 · (Edited)
You have a point but i think it's way too easy which i see done a ton on this forum to link all the IWC, Workrate, Smarks etc together and putting them all into one bubble like we all think and like the same things.

Sure for the vast majority they love great wrestler but that doesn't the the build to the match is irrelevant and promo ability can't be important as trust it's just as important to us like it is to the so called "sports entertainment" fans who want differentiate themselves from the IWC. Maybe it's not seen as the be all and end all and we can still appreciate the wrestling but the build is still a major factor in how we see the match.

It's the same way that some think all that the IWC cares is about is a match with a bunch of spots and that's it, i can enjoy the odd spotfest and take it for what it is but if the match is devoid of a story and psychology then it's not going to get rated as some classic.

I really don' think the IWC is any esier to please than casuals they just hold different things highly
 
#17 ·
I really don' think the IWC is any esier to please than casuals they just hold different things highly
This.

The storylines, building coherent rivalries, personalities, promos and yes, actual mat wrestling all play a factor.

Even within 'mat wrestling' there is still a story to be told. Selling, psychology, commentary, rest holds, spots and finishers all play a part.
 
#9 ·
Jesus, this post should probably be closed, made "sticky" and put on top of this page as a sort of WF verbum.


You could push literaly anyone of the smark favourite and you'll get a positive response from the casuals, as long as the push is handled "correctly".WWE just doesn't want people they don't like to represent them, this is not delusion, this is just not accepting a guy that doesn't have their mark of approval.

They're perfectly aware of the fact casuals eat any shit they serve, as long as it's presented as the best superstar to ever grace the ring with his presence. Just look at how they pushed Cena and how they push (or I may say pushed, still undecided now) Reigns, absolutely no character development, presented as the ultra-strong babyface, winning most of the time and barely losing clean at all. If this is not done on purpose to cater to casuals, I'm Mickey Mouse.
 
#10 ·
I disagree, things like look, mic skills and charisma don't matter to the most vocal portion of the IWC, they'd want the guy Braun squashed to be a main eventer if he was one of the best in ring. Meanwhile, guys like Big Show, Kane and Mark Henry still get cheered, especially at house shows, despite not being able to work for shit. Casuals still like the "larger than life" aspect of wrestling whereas the IWC prefers "same as life", being a regular joe is now a bonus because it makes you "relateable". Look how over Ryback was a few years ago putting on the exact same squash match, look how over Enzo and Cass are now doing the exact same hot tag match, casuals don't give a fuck that these guys can't chain wrestle. Them getting over in 2016 with no workrate and no spectacular matches under their belt is the surest evidence that casuals and the IWC are divided on what's entertaining.
 
#21 ·
I see you often lumping the IWC as one entity and it's really not true, other than maybe the importance of the look not being as high on the list that in used to be.

Trust me Charisma and mic skills get you over with the IWC just as much as with the casuals, yes match quality is also important but why shouldn't it be.

In terms of Larger than life vs same as life i think what it really is is believable and how you can portray yourself in a way that can connect, i don't think that separates over casual and iwc lines.

If you can be larger than life and believable at the same time that is great but the problem with the WWE right now there is nobody on the roster that fits that criteria which is why it has issues. I can't blame people gravitating to guys that as you put are same as life and believable in their roles when there is no alternative.

Good booking will attract both audiences, it just has to be good.
 
#15 ·
It really is. I don't know where the "smarks only care about wrestling" and "casuals only like the opposite" divide came from but that myth gets proven wrong whenever Enzo/Cass, Dean Ambrose, and John Cena come out and they get reactions and then you get matches like Zayn/Owens at Battleground that gets a standing ovation and everyone cheering, all from the same crowd. Just find something that appeals to the entire crowd every week and you're automatically catering to both audiences, whether it be charismatic talkers, exciting wresters, or interesting stories.
 
#16 ·
To me the IWC fan is all about breaking from the norm. For instance, when legitimate amateur background was a prerequisite to be a top guy in the early 80s if the IWC existed they would have been behind pushing Hulk Hogan in the AWA. Even though Verne resisted initially when he decided to break from the norm and push a guy casuals weren't used to seeing on top they ate it up and wrestling was forever changed.

Same thing with Bret over Lex, Austin as the top guy, Rocky Maivia morphing into the Nation's Rock. All of those changes broke from the norm and certainly would have been what an IWC wanted. So I think it's a false assumption to think pleasing smarks results in turning off casuals. All Vince has done for the last 12 years is push guys aimed at casuals like Cena, Orton, and Reigns to the detriment of the popularity of the industry. Why not give the Balors, Nakamuras, and Styles of the world a shot? I don't think they could fare any worse.
 
#20 ·
This notion that all casual wrestling watchers only care about the big guys is a load of shit. Said it before, I have many friends who will casually watch every now and then when they come round mine and will say that they like guys like Finn Balor, and will call guys like Kane and Big Show "slow" and "boring". It's 2016, there's nothing impressive about seeing a 6'5+ guy wrestle anymore.
 
#22 ·
I agree OP but you know WWE, makes things way more difficult than they need to be. Instead of doing stuff that will satisfy fans from both sides of the aisle, WWE tries to satisfy themselves and lets the fans pick up the pieces.
 
#24 ·
WWE's inability to please neither the smarks or marks is laughable when you compare them to giants like Marvel Studios who can please their hardcore and casual fan bases with what seems to be chilling ease. And please don't say smarks are too hard to please. These comic fanboys are fucking scummy to the extreme. Yet they seem pretty dang pleased with the corporate proliferation of their characters.
 
#28 ·
Agreed, today's "casuals" are just former hardcore fans that the WWE has driven to being only casual now. The old "casuals" that people claim on here the WWE needs to appeal to do not exist anymore. That is a group of the audience the WWE lost a long time ago and is NEVER getting back as long as they are ANYTHING that resembles anything close to pro-wrestling.
 
#31 ·
But again this is like saying the IWC all think the same. We all have our favourites within the IWC itself.

For example I like AJ, Seth and Owens but idgaf about guys like Cesaro and Finn. I'm indifferent towards Ambrose and Reigns. I'm sure most don't share my views, obviously I be more annoyed if others were pushed before my favourites and I will speak up.
 
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#35 ·
You can't casually spend all that money on something you only half care about. You can't casually spend 3 hours of your night watching something you have no interest in week after week.

Yes, there are some guys that will only watch certain things, but I'd call myself a hip hop fan..doesn't mean I'm going out listening to every release out there. Some will, some won't.
 
#34 ·
IWC is really just a catch all term for any informed wrestling fan. And to be an informed wrestling fan, you need to do a lot of internet research, which includes blogs, podcasts, etc. Now of course informed wrestling fans will not all have the same opinions, but you can often find trends among that group of people. Most informed wrestling fans like people like Cesaro, Sami Zayne, etc. Is the IWC a real thing? Yes, it is. Fuck you Wade Keller.

It doesn't mean everyone in that group thinks the same though. And personally, I think Informed Wrestling Community would be a better use of that acronym than Internet Wrestling Community

Casuals are just people who watch WWE. They don't know that other wrestling companies exist. And wrestling to them is just what they see on TV. They don't know all the behind the scenes stuff. They don't know what the hell "face" or "heel" or "kayfabe" means. And they are likely going to be diehard WWE fans whether the product is good or not. It can be fun watching wrestling with a casual because you get to see how the story lines affect someone who isn't privy to all the smark bullshit. So when they say Roman sucks, you know it's because he actually does and not because they are rebelling against the fact that he is Vince's chosen one because they don't actually know that.
 
#39 ·
Everyone has been a casual in their life before they became a smark. The things I wanted to see then are very similar to what I want to see now.

What is and was interesting:
- Two (or sometimes more) guys who have been booked as main eventers go at it. Hogan vs Ultimate Warrior, Shawn vs Bret, Austin vs Rock, HHH vs Batista, Rollins vs Reigns etc. In all of these cases both guys could just as easily win and it felt high stakes. One superstrong guy beating lesser guys or two lesser guys going at it simply isn't as interesting.

- Big spots. As much as spotfests get critized in here, a match won't be entertaining without high impact moves. Whether it is a powerbomb or a shooting star press, a match needs these 'highlights' and preferably quite a few.

- Mic skills. Why do you think Enzo and Cass got so over without being great technical wrestlers? They can actually talk in a sea full of bland people.

Doesn't really matter if you're just tuning in or have been following the product for 20 years. Who in their right mind thought casuals want to see a guy who looks the part but can't back it up in any other way?
 
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