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Old 05-08-2013, 06:59 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

^good point about New Nightmare, much underated film, practically invented the post modern horror genre.

and fuck the ghostface mask, was the go-to haloween costume for lazy people for years, I recall going to a huge haloween party and at least 70% of people there were wearing that.

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Takashi Miike. Gonna check out the most of his filmography soon. Someone (blarg, asfd, ABH) name me 5-6 "sleepers" from him, outside of the obvious ones (Black Society Trilogy, Ichi, Dead or Alive, Visitor Q, Gozu), please, because he makes so much movies. Miike is a fucking genius.
fucking love Miike, went through a serious binge of his stuff a few years ago, not just his horrors but even his family dramas and kids movies are usually worth a look, you seen any of the Young Thugs trilogy? or Happiness of the Katakuris?
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:06 AM   #32 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

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^good point about New Nightmare, much underated film, practically invented the post modern horror genre.

and fuck the ghostface mask, was the go-to haloween costume for lazy people for years, I recall going to a huge haloween party and at least 70% of people there were wearing that.
New Nightmare is the tops. Honestly could be my favorite Kruger film. Love the fantasy horror elements breaking the fourth wall.

No kidding. Try wanting to be Ghostface for Halloween at school one year. I show up and my stars, EVERYONE was the psychotic horror fanatic. Mind you this was in a elementary school.

see, if there is no nudity - parents won't give a damn.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:14 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

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I still consider it rather genre busting to this day. Wes Craven was into some of his flicks pressing in between reality & movies so not only did he accomplish that with the final Freddy Kruger movie - New Nightmare - but along the same lines, only varies with the slasher style in Scream. To me, what you stated about the realism/unpredictability along with the movie being an homage or even periodic timepiece on slasher/horror flicks is what makes me fall in love with 'em. There is humor mixed in throughout. Giving the movie a non-serious vibe throughout to easy into things. Almost not to make it feel cheesy when it in fact was kind of meant to be once poking fun at the entire sub-genre on the whole. Randy being the central character in all of this. The uber-fan who knew ever in and out from watching all of the previous slasher films prior. Once it began happening in real life - he was able to feed the characters with the proper amount of knowledge. That's what is so cool about all of it. It's almost like this big "blows it a kiss" towards the list of classic or cult classic slasher/horror flicks seen from the 70's & 80's. A love affair, really. Maybe not IN the story of the movie, but the point behind the movie in general. Ghostface's gimmick was spawned from the start as being a Horror buff. "What's your favorite scary movie?" Boom. Right there. From that point on it became linked forever. As the franchise would grow this element of "what if people watched these movies & acted on it themselves" came to life (on screen) Having that layering effect to add along with the central stories involving the characters of these movies. Part III encompasses this to a tee. Of course that one became the ultimate mirror effect and became a movie about movies that was filming a movie about this movie. (HOLY SHIT right?) From then on out we've seen multiple films go the route Wes Craven seemed to branch off here. Regardless if one wants to be mad or thank him for that, well that's one person's opinion. I know I'm happy he gave us something different at the time & can stand up till this day.

Part Four was the most violent I'd say. Def on a visual level. That's modern day style. I wasn't surprised. About five minutes in you knew that was going to be the case. All good with me. A little bit more blood didn't put a damper on me. We always pays to see attractive young dames get sliced and diced when we watch slasher films.

I could have sworn there has been copycats who killed wearing Ghostface's mask in real life. Maybe it was more of a local thing and didn't go on for long. About 50% sure atm. Happened in the 90's of course. So I was VERY young.



Problem I have with sequels is that they often trend on redundancy. Sometimes the story doesn't really need to be continued since the point was already made clear with the first film, what saves those for me is when they approach the sequels from an entirely different angle and distinguish it from it's predecessors (ala' Exorcist 1 compared to 3). If the sequels to Scream are but a watered down rehash of what was already seen, chances are i'll have trouble getting into it, but your words hold the promise that each movie plays to an important underlying theme so that keeps me hopeful enough.

Yeah Wes Craven was one of the first to push the envelope back when he was still an indy filmmaker, the original Last House was shocking at the time. It's interesting that you brought up his "New Nightmare" movie since i'd consider that to be the best all around Elm street barring the b-horror campy fun I had with the 4th film, and the novelty of the original. I think NN is the first time he took the actors out of their elements and sorta broke a fourth wall (within the movie, not with the viewer) where past horror flicks were acknowledged, and where this was portrayed as the only "real" Elm street making the previous ones a fictional setup to it. In that sense, the way it was film and acted, I think it's tremendously underrated.

Didn't hear about the copycat killer stuff, maybe I have but it's too long ago to recall. It's not uncommon for the worry to be there, same thing happened with Natural Born Killers, the movie where Oliver Stone Glorifies the act of serial killing. Of course, his message was about how the MEDIA does that to spike interest, how they create celebrities out of people for their horrific crimes. It was a great social commentary in that regard since the media tells you "hey.. go in a theater, shoot down a shitload of people and you'll be famous!". That's the point of NBK, but ironically it could've been taken out of context, and could've in and of itself influence killings since the movie was Tarantino levels of stylish. (Tarantino did write the screenplay).
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:21 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

JeoRulz, haven't seen much from Miike. Only movies that come to mind right now are Shangri-La, Visitor Q, Audition and Ichi the Killer. All unique in their own right. Visitor Q is tough to watch though.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:29 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

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Originally Posted by blarg_ View Post
Problem I have with sequels is that they often trend on redundancy. Sometimes the story doesn't really need to be continued since the point was already made clear with the first film, what saves those for me is when they approach the sequels from an entirely different angle and distinguish it from it's predecessors (ala' Exorcist 1 compared to 3). If the sequels to Scream are but a watered down rehash of what was already seen, chances are i'll have trouble getting into it, but your words hold the promise that each movie plays to an important underlying theme so that keeps me hopeful enough.

Yeah Wes Craven was one of the first to push the envelope back when he was still an indy filmmaker, the original Last House was shocking at the time. It's interesting that you brought up his "New Nightmare" movie since i'd consider that to be the best all around Elm street barring the b-horror campy fun I had with the 4th film, and the novelty of the original. I think NN is the first time he took the actors out of their elements and sorta broke a fourth wall (within the movie, not with the viewer) where past horror flicks were acknowledged, and where this was portrayed as the only "real" Elm street making the previous ones a fictional setup to it. In that sense, the way it was film and acted, I think it's tremendously underrated.

Didn't hear about the copycat killer stuff, maybe I have but it's too long ago to recall. It's not uncommon for the worry to be there, same thing happened with Natural Born Killers, the movie where Oliver Stone Glorifies the act of serial killing. Of course, his message was about how the MEDIA does that to spike interest, how they create celebrities out of people for their horrific crimes. It was a great social commentary in that regard since the media tells you "hey.. go in a theater, shoot down a shitload of people and you'll be famous!". That's the point of NBK, but ironically it could've been taken out of context, and could've in and of itself influence killings since the movie was Tarantino levels of stylish. (Tarantino did write the screenplay).
Let me say this about the Scream sequels: the contain the same general style that lets you know it's a Scream flick, but grew into adding more and more layers to separate each from the next. Part of me feels like you might not enjoy some of the third. Idk why, maybe the reveal and the weird ghost imagery will throw you off. Only a slight vibe. Hate to say it in case it steers you clear entirely, but formulating by what you seem to like/dislike, it's the one I can see you being lukewarm on. Def give II and/or IV a try. Well, second chance for II since you did see it once.

New Nightmare took things to a different level for me. Sole fact it ended up going the complete swerve route of being real life with a movie's elements coming through causing terror was tremendous. I remember watching it around last year and being blown away immediately. It's even better than I remembered at that point. Now it's just about cemented as not only the best Elm flick around, but one of my favorites from the genre. Robert Englund even gets offed in the movie. I LOVE THAT. Now this has sparked an urge to watch, rank, and go through all of the Nightmare on Elm St. franchise.

See, I didn't remember anything coming from Natural Born Killers. But, that's b/c I was even younger when that was released. Only about three years old I think. I do love that movie too. The media frenzy being captured the way it was. You knew what Oliver Stone was driving at there. Sensationalism. The height of media acceptance by any means. Robert Downey Jr's character in it is one of my favorites. He captured those scummy "I'll air and film anything to spark ratings" guy of host for his TV show. Not to mention Rodney Dangerfield in what had to be his darkest role, but being fantastic during it. Not to mention the laugh track behind all of it only to aid the humor that Dangerfield was normally associated with. Great stuff. It's a bit of a divisive flick, I've noticed. Buddy of mine HATES Oliver Stone. Not uncommon. I can't say I have much of an opinion on him directly, but NBK does it for me every time. Quentin had a role in the story. You had to know I'd be a fan with that fact.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:47 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

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Originally Posted by Obfuscation View Post
Let me say this about the Scream sequels: the contain the same general style that lets you know it's a Scream flick, but grew into adding more and more layers to separate each from the next. Part of me feels like you might not enjoy some of the third. Idk why, maybe the reveal and the weird ghost imagery will throw you off. Only a slight vibe. Hate to say it in case it steers you clear entirely, but formulating by what you seem to like/dislike, it's the one I can see you being lukewarm on. Def give II and/or IV a try. Well, second chance for II since you did see it once.

New Nightmare took things to a different level for me. Sole fact it ended up going the complete swerve route of being real life with a movie's elements coming through causing terror was tremendous. I remember watching it around last year and being blown away immediately. It's even better than I remembered at that point. Now it's just about cemented as not only the best Elm flick around, but one of my favorites from the genre. Robert Englund even gets offed in the movie. I LOVE THAT. Now this has sparked an urge to watch, rank, and go through all of the Nightmare on Elm St. franchise.

See, I didn't remember anything coming from Natural Born Killers. But, that's b/c I was even younger when that was released. Only about three years old I think. I do love that movie too. The media frenzy being captured the way it was. You knew what Oliver Stone was driving at there. Sensationalism. The height of media acceptance by any means. Robert Downey Jr's character in it is one of my favorites. He captured those scummy "I'll air and film anything to spark ratings" guy of host for his TV show. Not to mention Rodney Dangerfield in what had to be his darkest role, but being fantastic during it. Not to mention the laugh track behind all of it only to aid the humor that Dangerfield was normally associated with. Great stuff. It's a bit of a divisive flick, I've noticed. Buddy of mine HATES Oliver Stone. Not uncommon. I can't say I have much of an opinion on him directly, but NBK does it for me every time. Quentin had a role in the story. You had to know I'd be a fan with that fact.


Well, there were some drastic rewrites to Quentin's NBK script which pissed Quentin off, but they kept the overall gist of it. I totally get the Oliver Stone hate, I wouldn't go as far as to say I hate the guy, but there's one major thing about him that I dislike.. his sensationalising and misrepresentation of factual events. One glaring example of this is Midnight Express, the "true story" based on the Billy Hayes story. Not only is the movie a gross misrepresentation of the Turkish people, but he downright demonises them. His movie was so exagerrated from what actually happened that Billy Hayes himself called Stone out on it! Midnight Express is an incredible movie when you overlook that, but it sums up Stone to a tee. At least with NBK, it was meant to be overblown, and that complimented the theme. I could've done without the weird psychedelic shit, but that was the style he went for. It is what it is. Rodney, Woody, TOmmy Lee and RDJ were all excellent in their over the top performances. Even Juliette Lewis did well. (have you ever noticed the NBK tie in with Kalifornia?)


I'll skip straight to Scream 4 and likely write a full review for it. Something tells me that it's the one that matters most at this point. I trust your judgement on the other ones, but 4 is particularly interesting to me since it's the most distinguishable of the sequels and takes place over a decade later. I'm interested to see how they take a dated concept and spin it into something fresh. Love the fact that they brought back the original cast since they were all fairly good for what it was. Sad for the lack of Rose Rose Mcgowan, an admitted dame I crushed on as a teen. Hey, at least we got her gunning down muthafuckas with her machinegun leg so there's that
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:48 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

Anyone seen "The compeny you keep" ? the new redford flick?


Luke Evans lands the Crow lead... hmmmm not sure on that.
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Old 05-08-2013, 08:24 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

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new thread,pfft when has there ever been a part III better than a part II?

anyway recently in the other thread there was a lot of talk of good modern horrors and a little bit of talk of classic Giallo (no, not vincent giallo) so Im gonna give a shout for Berberian Sound Studios, anyone seen it?
pretty great british made giallo homage, psychological thriller, really ominous, slightly let down by the last 20 minutes or so imo but one Id be happy to watch again.
Yeah Good, Bad & The Ugly sprang to mind. Toy Story 3 also. And Die Hard 3 .

Been dying to see Berberian Sound Studio. Got it downloaded. Toby Jones is the man.
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Old 05-08-2013, 08:28 AM   #39 (permalink)
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The end of Visitor Q is a legit feel good moment.
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Old 05-08-2013, 09:11 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Default Re: General Movie Discussion Part III

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Well, there were some drastic rewrites to Quentin's NBK script which pissed Quentin off, but they kept the overall gist of it. I totally get the Oliver Stone hate, I wouldn't go as far as to say I hate the guy, but there's one major thing about him that I dislike.. his sensationalising and misrepresentation of factual events. One glaring example of this is Midnight Express, the "true story" based on the Billy Hayes story. Not only is the movie a gross misrepresentation of the Turkish people, but he downright demonises them. His movie was so exagerrated from what actually happened that Billy Hayes himself called Stone out on it! Midnight Express is an incredible movie when you overlook that, but it sums up Stone to a tee. At least with NBK, it was meant to be overblown, and that complimented the theme. I could've done without the weird psychedelic shit, but that was the style he went for. It is what it is. Rodney, Woody, TOmmy Lee and RDJ were all excellent in their over the top performances. Even Juliette Lewis did well. (have you ever noticed the NBK tie in with Kalifornia?)


I'll skip straight to Scream 4 and likely write a full review for it. Something tells me that it's the one that matters most at this point. I trust your judgement on the other ones, but 4 is particularly interesting to me since it's the most distinguishable of the sequels and takes place over a decade later. I'm interested to see how they take a dated concept and spin it into something fresh. Love the fact that they brought back the original cast since they were all fairly good for what it was. Sad for the lack of Rose Rose Mcgowan, an admitted dame I crushed on as a teen. Hey, at least we got her gunning down muthafuckas with her machinegun leg so there's that
Taking your word for it. Can't think of many Stone films I've actually viewed to form much of a formulated opinion on him. However, the gripes I hear is always how he only puts his point across and never facts. Solely one sided opinions on the matter. I guess that's why I thought W. was comedic.

I have noticed it. For a good while when I younger I kept getting Natural Born Killers & Kalifornia mixed up all the time.

Not a bad plan. Like I stated, you'll be in the loop for the most part. You know the story of the original. You know Sidney has been tormented three times over. You might not know the vast details behind part III or how/why there are STAB movies, but you'll be able to get the gist of it. Especially when it explains the point of the movies within the opening scene. There is no Rose McGowan for a reason. She was too busy getting her head crushed in by a garage.

Planet Terror (that's some damn good barbecue.)
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