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Old 08-31-2013, 08:39 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

Mozza I loved your integration of natural humour, it's definitely something that's always welcome in debates because it adds some personality in a debate and as long as it doesn't detract from tackling the question it should always be welcomed. I'd say just study the structure of the winning debates to gain a perspective on structure and breaking down counter arguments whilst writing strongly in supporting your decision. Andre's broad consideration in dissecting Mourinho's importance edged out your effort, something like his Ferguson comparison would be something to try and replicate in future because it adds invaluable context to strengthen your opinion


Anark & Andre neither of you should feel downbeat given your efforts. I'll happily give further feedback if either/both of you require, but essentially Anark I just felt Clique had the stronger argument and tone which was the difference maker between two similar debates in terms of structure and arguments. ANDRE it was a tough decision to pick between your broad debate vs Clique's marginalised focus on one area of testing, but I felt his empassioned defence of a strongly critised practice was thoroughly impressive and best defended animal testing..even if it didn't tackle the wider areas as yours did. Had his debate been a bit weaker yours would have been successful.

STEVIE congrats on a great piece regarding Owen Hart's death. Very eloquent consideration of it being a business decision and remembering the context of the Monday Night Wars and the intense pressure Vince & co were under alongside it being an instinctive gut decision.

Social Division Title Match was outstanding and Gothic I truly feel for you to lose after that effort. There really isn't much you could have done to improve your debate imo, it was just a marginal decision in SPC's favour.

Jesus wept @ TLK/Zombo. If Zombo isn't the Mikey Whipreck of this League I don't know who is. I always enjoy reading contrary viewpoints rather than both arguing the same POV, so that was enjoyable to see. I would have just given TLK the edge based on Seabs' overview of Zombo's debate but it was a strong effort from both of you and another indicament of the abundance of quality in this division.

Congrats Perfect Poster! That piece on Harrison was wonderful to read and it's interesting to see the even nature of the sports section with continous title changes. Looking forward to the next title match and hopefully the quality here can be replicated.


Wow, I really didn't expect a unanimous victory here. Read through Evo's debate and it was a strong submission from him and I really did want to include Austin but felt the criteria I went for excluded him (Hogan tied into Vince's expansion plus his historical consistency through the 80s, 90s and the 00s). I agree that whilst the question was interesting it did limit both of us. Having to impose a 200 word limit for 4 candidates and eloquently express why they were worthy was very difficult and really did force me to consistently cut and edit my debate to be as concise as possible whilst employing a persuasive tone. Perhaps if the question had focused on one individual and whether they were worthy it might have worked better? I see Evo's point re. it being more of an essay, but I will concede this was a challenging question which in some ways I enjoyed in trying to construct the best answer.

However...

ROSE BROTHERS REUNION . Not ashamed to say I guessed the identity of our limping ally immediately and howled with laughter. CAN YOU B+Q IT, SUCKA??

Patiently awaiting the lineup for the next card now that I've gone rogue (c'mon, how did I maintain such a beloved status given my atrocities on countless farms through the mid wales countryside?).

Froooot's quest, Joel & Redead trying to cash in on my marketable image were hilarious and again more brilliant skits.

Plus the appearance of


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Old 08-31-2013, 08:55 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

Quote:
Originally Posted by WOOLCOCK View Post
Mozza I loved your integration of natural humour, it's definitely something that's always welcome in debates because it adds some personality in a debate and as long as it doesn't detract from tackling the question it should always be welcomed. I'd say just study the structure of the winning debates to gain a perspective on structure and breaking down counter arguments whilst writing strongly in supporting your decision. Andre's broad consideration in dissecting Mourinho's importance edged out your effort, something like his Ferguson comparison would be something to try and replicate in future because it adds invaluable context to strengthen your opinion
Hear you loud and clear, chief.

Thank you. <3
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Old 08-31-2013, 08:58 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS



Time to put my name around that belt
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Old 08-31-2013, 09:18 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

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Originally Posted by THE DARK ANDRE View Post
Another judge agreed with me on this, get over it.
No Judge agreed with you on it (Seabs said that they could be condensed, which isn't the same as your opinion), and in fact TLK went in the complete opposite direction.

Quote:
Which has nothing to do with the debate, hence why it was a pointless part to include. I didn't write "Bolt made it popular", I said If you could argue that he was a part of that and how "that was an achievement" then it might have made it worthwhile, but you didn't/couldn't, so why include it? More wasted words.
Its something that makes winning a 100m more special than winning a shooting gold medal for example. Hence why it was included.

Quote:
Comparing something that passed 13 years ago to something that passed ONE year ago is ridiculous in this context. Society and culture change, you also have to consider that Ennis might become far more marketable in the future, so many elements to consider. Also, if you're going to make an argument like that (Cathy Freeman) THEN USE IT IN THE DEBATE instead.
could compare it to Chinese athletes from 5 years ago, Greek athletes from 9 years ago etc etc. If you think its irrelevant then say so rather than make a stupid comment about a time machine. I compared it to Bolt and Phelps, no one will remember much about ennis, people will remember Bolt and Phelps.

Quote:
...but that's your job to define that point, but you really didn't do that well enough, as explained later on when I said your counter points were weak...if I was supposed to assume everything and fill in the gaps then what would be the point? That's your job to convince me.
don't want words on establishing a debate, but you want them on saying the olympics are more recognised than the paralympics? really?

Quote:
...and then I explained how PP's argument FOR was far stronger, hence why you needed to improve the rest of your debate in order to match up. You had good qualities when arguing for Bolt (1/4 or less of your debate), but hardly anywhere else. Meanwhile PP was STREETS ahead in terms of persuasion FOR, while slightly ahead in arguments against. To have beaten him you would have had to improve all round.
not in the judging of mine though. on that point though, " The supporting angle of having to overcome a torn MCL was crucial in sending this debate over the top," really dude? really? So if i said Bolt had to overcome a back and hamstring issue that would have made this harder to pick in that sense non-serious injuries months out from the olympics are fairly meaningless.

I have no issue with PP winning, and reading his would definintely judge that the winner. Don't like getting stupid judging comments on it though.
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Old 08-31-2013, 09:20 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

TDL VI - FALLOUT
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Old 08-31-2013, 10:17 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush View Post
No Judge agreed with you on it (Seabs said that they could be condensed, which isn't the same as your opinion), and in fact TLK went in the complete opposite direction.
Seabs said it should have been condensed which meant that you should have cut some of it out. Same thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush View Post
Its something that makes winning a 100m more special than winning a shooting gold medal for example. Hence why it was included.
More special in terms of hype doesn't equal a bigger achievement. This was actually covered over both feedback cards. Not sure why you're whining here? It just wasn't a very good argument.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush View Post
could compare it to Chinese athletes from 5 years ago, Greek athletes from 9 years ago etc etc. If you think its irrelevant then say so rather than make a stupid comment about a time machine. I compared it to Bolt and Phelps, no one will remember much about ennis, people will remember Bolt and Phelps.
Okay, so why wasn't the bolded included in your debate? You're just giving me even more reasons as to why your counter arguments weren't supported well enough

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush View Post
don't want words on establishing a debate, but you want them on saying the olympics are more recognised than the paralympics? really?
No, I never criticised the differentiation of the Olympics and the Paralymics, just the overblown narrative of what the Olympics actually is (which had nothing to do with separating it from the Paralympics), along with a few points/questions (notice the use of "most" in the feedback) that were never answer satisfactorily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush View Post
not in the judging of mine though. on that point though, " The supporting angle of having to overcome a torn MCL was crucial in sending this debate over the top," really dude? really? So if i said Bolt had to overcome a back and hamstring issue that would have made this harder to pick in that sense non-serious injuries months out from the olympics are fairly meaningless.
There was extra feedback in the decisions card, but never mind...Yes that put PP's debate over the top, because he built a strong argument around the idea that Harrison had to overcome several issues that could have affected her psychologically. If you had found an angle like that (or something else, but directed in that type of manner) then you might have been able to compete with him, but you didn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush View Post
I have no issue with PP winning, and reading his would definitely judge that the winner. Don't like getting stupid judging comments on it though.
Your debate wasn't very good and I have explained exactly why. You might disagree with my stance but it was up to YOU to convince me with your arguments. The fact that you are bringing out better supporting claims NOW then you did in your debate says a lot for the quality of your debate.

I would actually agree with you about Bolt being a greater achiever, and while some of your arguments might have some merit you didn't include enough evidence or persuasive language to overcome any doubt. The majority of your points came off more like opinions than well reasoned arguments due to the lack of evidence in support, hence why I pointed out all of the potential flaws within your counter points with such disdain. You need to delve deeper into why these points are legitimate.

I'm sorry that you're upset about a little time traveling joke, but without supporting evidence I can only take your arguments at face value. Like I said before, I'm not here to fill in the gaps for you, you have to provide the evidence within STRONG arguments, not just a few throwaway statements that lack clarity and elaboration. There's plenty enough explanation as to why your points left areas of doubt so I'm not sure why you're arguing the toss over it? I suppose it helps when you can properly comprehend the feedback, which I've noticed you've failed to do a few times. Regardless of that, just remember to support your claims properly, even you can't be deluded enough to think that you provided enough supporting evidence (which this this discussion has proved)?

At the end of the day...My judging >>>>> Yours

You have a problem with this then go to Seabs about it when he's back, I highly doubt that he will agree with you...
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Old 08-31-2013, 10:39 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

SPCDRI/CLIQUE.

HYPE

:allen

I'm double digit points now. 2 for unanimous, times 2 for a thousand worder champ match...

12 points. HYPE.

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Old 08-31-2013, 10:45 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

Damn it anyways see I have another Euro/Aussie poster to face for the title. Where are all the American Sports guys so I can get a debate topic I have interest in?
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Old 08-31-2013, 10:58 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

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Originally Posted by SPCDRI View Post
SPCDRI/CLIQUE.

HYPE

:allen

I'm double digit points now. 2 for unanimous, times 2 for a thousand worder champ match...

12 points. HYPE.
vs. four victories in my first two shows. LEGIT

I personally do not see the battle ending unanimously either way. Although I will try like hell to be the one to defeat you decisively for the Social Division Championship. Bring on an epic topic TDL team!

This encounter will be a match...for the AGES.

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Old 08-31-2013, 11:04 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: TDL V: HIGH STAKES - THE RESULTS

Clique vs SPCDRI should main event the next card. Two great competitors with winning streaks, the title on the line, something has to give...
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