Yokozuna was great - Page 14 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
Reply

Old 03-17-2013, 09:27 AM   #131 (permalink)
Humbled
 
Yosihait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Israel
Posts: 503
Yosihait 50 - 100
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by LBGetBack View Post
Nobody cares about your language, so if you want people to understand what you're saying without any confusion, don't speak it.

This isn't about Yoko. I don't care about Yoko. It's about you being born in 1993 but acting like a know it all about things that happened when you were still in your daddy's nut sack.

Aspergers huh? I suspect you may have a touch of a few more things too. Go to the Doctor.
"Some" and "Lie" are english words...

I'm Asperger, and that's uncurable.

Actually, that's make me SMARTER then you.

Let me get this straight- If I was born in 1986 and I would've said that Yoko sucks, then you'll say nothing?

Then you're just a hypocrite who decides what's right and what's wrong according to the one who say it.
Yosihait is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 

Old 03-17-2013, 09:47 AM   #132 (permalink)
Humbled
 
LBGetBack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 4,682
LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
"Some" and "Lie" are english words...

I'm Asperger, and that's uncurable.

Actually, that's make me SMARTER then you.

Let me get this straight- If I was born in 1986 and I would've said that Yoko sucks, then you'll say nothing?t.
YES. Because if you were born in 1986, you would be old enough to have actually watched and experienced the WWF back then, and would have a clue.

As it stands, you have no clue. You weren't alive when he debuted. Your opinion on this is worthless, because it can't possibly be informed, first hand knowledge.
LBGetBack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 09:51 AM   #133 (permalink)
Humbled
 
Yosihait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Israel
Posts: 503
Yosihait 50 - 100
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by LBGetBack View Post
YES. Because if you were born in 1986, you would be old enough to have actually watched and experienced the WWF back then, and would have a clue.

As it stands, you have no clue. You weren't alive when he debuted. Your opinion on this is worthless, because it can't possibly be informed, first hand knowledge.
So basically, you're saying that if a ten year old boy will call you stupid, then it's less relevant then an 80 year old calling you stupid.

However, stupid is stupid. It's factual.

And I showed facts. Unlike someone who said "Thousands of people came to the USS interpid", while only 1,500 came.

A lot of people who watched then said those stuff. They're not here, but there are those kind fans.

Tell me how did Yokozuna belonged to the 90s. When were YOU born? Because you can tell me about the 90s culture and how Yoko was relevant in those days to the culture.
Yosihait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 09:56 AM   #134 (permalink)
I'll never be lonesome again.
 
L-DOPA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 4,926
L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
But Yoko is DEAD.

Honky Tonk Man is still alive. AND he wrestled way past his time. So he's not an example.
It is exactly the same principle, your argument is based on the fact that you think people are overrating Yoko because of his childhood. The guy you responded to could do exactly the same with the Honky Tonk Man. It isn't a legitimate argument, its a cop out and it is easy. It doesn't change simply because Yoko is deceased.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Hogan is considered big because he's a LEGEND.

Now, while you're right about today's culture and Hulkamania: Please explain to me how that has anything to do with Yoko.

Hogan WAS 80s in his spirit. Yoko WASN'T 90s. He was nothing.
Because Yokozuna was a product of the 90's in the same way Hulkamania was a product of the 1980's. I thought even you would understand that much .


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Taker is not about character, it's about the person who does that character.
Are you kidding me?! Undertaker is EVERYTHING about character just as much as Mark Callaway who made it iconic. Before the Undertaker Mark Callaway had nothing. He was just another wrestler, the Undertaker character gave him the break he needed at the time. The character at that time was considered dark and scary. Much like Yoko was considered a monster in his time. If the Undertaker character debuted for the first time in 2013 people wouldn't bat an eyelid. You really are stupid.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
But Yoko? What was the difference between 1993 Yoko and 1996 Yoko? Nothing. Except that his storyline was over. What was the difference between 1992 Warrior and 1996 Warrior? Nothing, because he was a main eventer in both times.
Warrior came back in 1996 and lasted all of about 4 months . You really going to pull that crap on me? He came back, squashed HHH and feuded with Goldust for the IC title. He sure was main eventing in those 4 months . Pathetic comparison.

Warrior main evented between 1991 and 1992 much like Yoko main evented between 1993-1994. By 1996 Warrior much like Yoko was past his time as a main eventer. His WCW in 1998 was also a tremendous flop and lasted less than 6 months. Did Warrior draw more than Yoko in his time? Yep, not arguing that. But my point about longevity still remains. You didn't prove me wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
People remember Yokozuna. They remember David Arquette as well.
Except they are remembered for very different things. That might be your most ridiculous strawman argument yet. Keep them coming.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Ummm... Yes, REALLY. There were more jobbers so all the stars (That means: Yoko, Headshrinkers, Ludvig Borga etc.) were undefeated.

Do I get that principle? Yeah. Do I KNOW that no one CARED about it back in the day? YEAH
Thank you for repeating exactly what I said about jobbers. Didn't need to be repeated. You'll see on the last points I make in this post that people cared more than you would like to admit.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
YEAH. Why? Because Yoko WAS the product. He WAS 80s Wrestling in the 90s. While Punk is NOT the product. He's a goldmine in a shit pool.
So first of all Yoko wasn't about the early 90's and now you are saying he WAS the product? It's funny how you change your hypocritical opinion when it fits your argument. Yoko can't not be a product of the 90's AND the product of the WWF at the time. Make up your mind, then maybe your opinion will be taken more seriously.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Answer me.

IF YOKO HAD PRESENCE, CHARISMA AND ALL THAT, WHY DID NO ONE CARED AFTER HE LOST HIS TITLE?
So now people did care when he was champion? In order for people to care you have to have charisma and presence to begin with. In order for people to stop caring after he lost the title people would have to care about him being champion to begin with. Boy you make this too easy.

And people did care, you seem to forget that he and Undertaker had one of the biggest feuds of 1994 after he lost the title when the Undertaker returned. Undertaker's return was a big deal and people did care. Why? 1) Because it was the Undertaker and 2) Because Yoko was the one who instigated to have Taker taken out. Remember I've been arguing since Yoko got pushed when he got in the company in late 1992 to late 1994.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Nah, those arguments belong to a kid who cries.
Funny that, your the one who is whining because nobody agrees with you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Which is to say: HE WAS THE EXACT SAME THING.

Del Rio won the Rumble. He competed for the title. He won MITB. He won the title again. And main evented the PPV after he lost it. He was a top heel for 11 months... But no one cared. Just like Yoko.

Let's say that Yoko would not lose the title to Hogan... WOULD YOU CARE?!

The WWE wouldn't use this as a Wrestlemania moment: "Oooooh, lookie, Yokozuna won the title at Wrestlemania IX! He won it in the WORST main event ever!".

By the way, HENRY held the title for THREE months. And he WAS a dominating heel. Unlike Yoko.
Del Rio was pushed but was never pushed the full way like they did with Yoko. Yes he won the rumble, but he lost the title match at WM to Edge in the OPENER of the show. He won MITB and the title but was never the focal point of the show. WWE were more concerned with getting Cena up to 10 WWE title reigns and then putting the strap on Punk. Del Rio was playing third wheel to Cena and the Summer of Punk when it came to the WWE title in 2011. Henry however was slowly built up into a monster heel, won the title and became the focal point of the title and SD. He was the top heel in the company, he had more stock in him than Del Rio. 3 months? 5 months? Who cares. He was still dominant, we agree. He would have held the title longer if it weren't for his unfortunate injury.

Wrestlemania IX might have been the worst mania of all time but it didn't have the worst main event ever. It was one of the better matches on the card. And actually fans were pretty pissed off from what I hear with Hogan getting the strap again. There was a vocal portion of the audience who were sick and tired of Hogan always being on top. I'd say people did care that Hogan won the title off Yoko then. Whether it be because they hated how Yoko won the title and were happy that Hogan won it or that people were pissed off Hogan won the title so quickly after Yoko won the main event.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Okay, now you're just making things up.

Compare him to another heel? THERE WASN'T ANOTHER HEEL WHO HELD THE BELT FOR A LONG TIME FROM 1993 TO 1997!

By your merit, I can say that Diesel was a great Draw: Show me ONE guy that drew more then him... Between November 1994 and November 1995.

Come on.

Michaels drew more. HHH drew more. Rock drew more. Even Austin drew more.

By the way, that "Bankcrupt" started in the days of Yoko. He was the champ when advertisers stopped giving money, when they stopped broadcasting the WWF in a lot of syndicate stations, and when the house shows business fell flat.
Advertisers stopped giving money and stopped broadcasting in those syndicate stations because of the steroid scandal in 1993. Any person who has done their research will tell you this. Had nothing to do with Yoko or any other main event talent at the time.

Did I say Yoko was a huge draw? No. So why you arguing about it? You are arguing Yoko was worthless and talentless as a main eventer. I'm arguing he is not, I mentioned the heels because it is a worthy point to consider. If Yoko was such a bad main event heel, why wasn't there anybody else that Vince thought was better to carry the belt at the time as a heel? Why were there no other heels at that time who eclipsed Yoko between 1993-1994? Not till Sycho Sid when the company was truly in trouble? You cant answer this can you? Nope.

Again you seem to underestimate how much the steroid scandal had an impact on the business. It's funny you mention Diesel because Kevin Nash said the exact same thing about the steroid scandal, it was a shoot to say the least. As far as Diesel being a draw, even Nash admits the only reason he got the strap in 1995 because he was one of the only guys who was big and was proven that he didn't take steroids. That should tell you enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Stop lying.

http://thehistoryofwwe.com/93

WWF @ New York City, NY - USS Intrepid - July 4, 1993 (1,500 paid)

WWF @ Allentown, PA - Agricultural Hall - June 30, 1993 (2,500)

WWF @ Scranton, PA - CYC - July 23, 1993 (2,500)

WWF @ Hershey, PA - Hersheypark Arena - July 24, 1993 (2,000)

WWF @ Alexandria Bay, NY - Castle Recreation Center - July 25, 1993 (1,000) (Featuring Yoko-Luger contract signing)

WWF @ North Charleston, SC - Civic Auditorium - September 17, 1993 (3,300)

WWF @ Moline, IL - Mark of the Quad - October 8, 1993 (1,750)


You can check those.

And as I showed, only 1,500 people came to the USS interpid. Thousands? More like a Thousand.

So, as I was saying: He wasn't a draw.

Yoko wasn't great.

Here are some figures from after Mania when he was being built up as a main event heel towards KOTR:

WWF @ London, England - Wembley Arena - April 16, 1993 (11,000; sell out)
WWF @ Nurenberg, Germany - April 18, 1993 (sell out)
WWF @ Frankfurt, Germany - April 23, 1993 (9,000; sell out)
European Rampage - Milan, Italy - Forum Assago - April 25, 1993 (7,500)
WWF @ Long Island, NY - Nassau Coliseum - May 1, 1993 (8,400)
WWF @ Worcester, MA - Memorial Auditorium - May 4, 1993 (4,000; sell out)
WWF @ Portland, ME - Exposition Building - May 5, 1993 (2,700; sell out)
WWF @ New York City, NY - Manhattan Center - May 10, 1993 (1,200; sell out)
King of the Ring 93 - Dayton, OH - Nutter Center - June 13, 1993 (8,000; sell out; 7,000 paid)


Of course you will disregard that and say it was all Hogan even though it takes two to sell a main event of a PPV. Fine, let's pick out a "few" *sarcasm* examples from Yoko's reign in 1993:

When Yoko was champion:
WWF @ Wilkes-Barre, PA - Wilkes University Marts Center - July 6, 1993 (3,400; sell out)
WWF @ Plattsburgh, NY - Crete Civic Center - July 27, 1993 (3,000; sell out)
WWF @ Vienna, Austria - July 29, 1993 (7,000; sell out)
WWF @ Munich, Germany - August 1, 1993 (12,000; sell out)
WWF @ Sheffield, England - Arena - August 6, 1993 (10,000; sell out)
WWF @ New York City, NY - Madison Square Garden - August 13, 1993 (13,000)
WWF @ Poughkeepsie, NY - Mid-Hudson Civic Center - August 16, 1993 (3,000; sell out)
WWF @ Lowell, MA - Memorial Auditorium - August 18, 1993 (2,500; sell out)
WWF @ Anaheim, CA - Arrowhead Pond - August 21, 1993 (15,000)
Summer Slam 93 - Auburn Hills, MI - Palace - August 30, 1993 (14,100)
WWF @ Grand Rapids, MI - August 31, 1993 (3,500; sell out)
WWF @ San Jose, CA - Arena - October 1, 1993 (7,500)
WWF @ Los Angeles, CA - Sports Arena - October 3, 1993 (7,000)
WWF @ Tel Aviv, Israel - October 7, 1993 (12,000; sell out)
WWF @ Burlington, VT - Civic Center - October 20, 1993 (2,500; sell out)
WWF @ Pittsburgh, PA - Civic Arena - October 22, 1993 (9,800)
WWF @ Dehli, NY - Farrell Hall - November 10, 1993 (2,500; sell out)
Survivor Series 93 - Boston, MA - Boston Garden - November 24, 1993 (15,509; sell out)
WWF @ Montreal, Quebec - Forum - November 26, 1993 (13,800)
WWF @ Nurenberg, Germany - December 7, 1993 (5,000; sell out)
WWF @ Dusseldorf, Germany - December 8, 1993 (5,500; sell out)
WWF @ Lowell, MA - Auditorium - December 14, 1993 (2,500; sell out)


All either sell outs or big attendances. Sure you can say some of the sell out's mean nothing because of the small venues but then WWE ran smaller venues for house shows in them days. Heck they run small house shows these days. The focal point building up to the bigger shows at that point: Yoko and the face they built up to face him whether it be Bret, Luger or Taker.

It's very easy to pick out a few examples and claim from those few examples that the houses didn't draw. You are going to have a few bad houses during the year, it's a given. Stacked up to the examples I've given and your claim falls down like a house of cards.

I never claimed Yoko was a huge draw, he wasn't. Nor was Bret for that matter (your other love to hate wrestler) but to say Yoko was worthless as champion? Fallacy. The fact that you have to rely on numbers to prove your point just shows how much you are clutching at the straws to try and prove your opinion is correct even though it is subjective based. And even then, it can easily be rebutted.

Give up, you are never going to win this argument. I'm finished arguing with you.
__________________


I'm a Laura Stevenson guy

Last edited by L-DOPA : 03-17-2013 at 10:10 AM.
L-DOPA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 10:00 AM   #135 (permalink)
Humbled
 
LBGetBack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 4,682
LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000LBGetBack 3501 - 4000
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
So basically, you're saying that if a ten year old boy will call you stupid, then it's less relevant then an 80 year old calling you stupid.

However, stupid is stupid. It's factual.

And I showed facts. Unlike someone who said "Thousands of people came to the USS interpid", while only 1,500 came.

A lot of people who watched then said those stuff. They're not here, but there are those kind fans.

Tell me how did Yokozuna belonged to the 90s. When were YOU born? Because you can tell me about the 90s culture and how Yoko was relevant in those days to the culture.

Saying someone sucks is an opinion, not a fact.

When you have NO firsthand knowledge to base that opinion on, it is worthless.

You have no idea what people who watched then said.....you weren't there.

This is really not a confusing point. I don't go around giving my "opinion" on Bruno Sammartino. I know who he is, I've seen some clips of him wrestling.....but I wasn't alive. I wasn't watching him at that time. So I don't passionately offer my uninformed opinions on him, ranting and raving and getting mad and name calling, I don't say anything, I stick to what I KNOW. You should try it.
LBGetBack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 10:53 AM   #136 (permalink)
Humbled
 
Yosihait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Israel
Posts: 503
Yosihait 50 - 100
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by LBGetBack View Post
Saying someone sucks is an opinion, not a fact.

When you have NO firsthand knowledge to base that opinion on, it is worthless.

You have no idea what people who watched then said.....you weren't there.

This is really not a confusing point. I don't go around giving my "opinion" on Bruno Sammartino. I know who he is, I've seen some clips of him wrestling.....but I wasn't alive. I wasn't watching him at that time. So I don't passionately offer my uninformed opinions on him, ranting and raving and getting mad and name calling, I don't say anything, I stick to what I KNOW. You should try it.
LBsomelie- Stop being agist.

I stuck to FACTS and I can post what I want. It's not your daddy's forum.

Besides, I'm a history expert (Not FOR MY AGE, I don't need that shit. I'm a history expert PERIOD). So I can talk about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
It is exactly the same principle, your argument is based on the fact that you think people are overrating Yoko because of his childhood. The guy you responded to could do exactly the same with the Honky Tonk Man. It isn't a legitimate argument, its a cop out and it is easy. It doesn't change simply because Yoko is deceased.
It is important.

Honky wrestled even after his "Heydays" at the 1980s. Luger wrestled in the year 2000 and Jarrett is wrestling. Since Yoko is (Unfortunately) not alive- The only way you can judge him is by your childhood memories.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Because Yokozuna was a product of the 90's in the same way Hulkamania was a product of the 1980's. I thought even you would understand that much .
There's a HUGE difference between PRODUCT and CULTURE.

The 90s PRODUCT was related to 80s CULTURE. However, the 90s CULTURE was Grunge, MTV and rebellionism. Patriots and anti-americans are 80s things, not 90s things.

As Vince Russo said- Vince McMahon was living in the 80s. But the problem is that after what happened with Hogan and the steroids, the crowd hated this 80s illusion. The 90s gave a devestating blow to the 80s.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Are you kidding me?! Undertaker is EVERYTHING about character just as much as Mark Callaway who made it iconic. Before the Undertaker Mark Callaway had nothing. He was just another wrestler, the Undertaker character gave him the break he needed at the time. The character at that time was considered dark and scary. Much like Yoko was considered a monster in his time. If the Undertaker character debuted for the first time in 2013 people wouldn't bat an eyelid. You really are stupid.
No, you're really don't get it.

Undertaker is about Mark Callaway. If anyone else would've played it it would've been dumb. Taker wasn't "Dark and Scary at that time", the character is dark and scary PERIOD. Today or then. Therefore, if that character came in today, with the same Callaway, I'll love it. Because he does it so greatly.

Yoko wasn't a monster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Warrior came back in 1996 and lasted all of about 4 months . You really going to pull that crap on me? He came back, squashed HHH and feuded with Goldust for the IC title. He sure was main eventing in those 4 months . Pathetic comparison.

Warrior main evented between 1991 and 1992 much like Yoko main evented between 1993-1994. By 1996 Warrior much like Yoko was past his time as a main eventer. His WCW in 1998 was also a tremendous flop and lasted less than 6 months. Did Warrior draw more than Yoko in his time? Yep, not arguing that. But my point about longevity still remains. You didn't prove me wrong.
But he WAS a main attrection back then. Never mind if it was for a short time, Warrior WAS a main eventer during his WHOLE time at the WWF. Unlike Yoko.

Warrior was main eventing in 1990-1992, and in 1996 (He was set to face Michaels in a Summerslam main event and got a HUGE push). Even in WCW he WAS a star, never mind if he was a flop. Yoko was a main eventer for a one year and then... A jobber.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Except they are remembered for very different things. That might be your most ridiculous strawman argument yet. Keep them coming.
No. WHY do you actually remember him?

Because he WAS there?

And after Wrestlemania X, do you remember anything about him? He did nothing WORTH mentioning. Vader? Owen Hart? Nah.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
So first of all Yoko wasn't about the early 90's and now you are saying he WAS the product? It's funny how you change your hypocritical opinion when it fits your argument. Yoko can't not be a product of the 90's AND the product of the WWF at the time. Make up your mind, then maybe your opinion will be taken more seriously.
It's nice that you CAN'T READ.

Yoko was the PRODUCT. The BAD PRODUCT. He WASN'T THE CULTURE. I'll just repeat what I said above:

The 90s PRODUCT was related to 80s CULTURE. However, the 90s CULTURE was Grunge, MTV and rebellionism. Patriots and anti-americans are 80s things, not 90s things.

As Vince Russo said- Vince McMahon was living in the 80s. But the problem is that after what happened with Hogan and the steroids, the crowd hated this 80s illusion. The 90s gave a devestating blow to the 80s.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
So now people did care when he was champion? In order for people to care you have to have charisma and presence to begin with. In order for people to stop caring after he lost the title people would have to care about him being champion to begin with. Boy you make this too easy.

And people did care, you seem to forget that he and Undertaker had one of the biggest feuds of 1994 after he lost the title when the Undertaker returned. Undertaker's return was a big deal and people did care. Why? 1) Because it was the Undertaker and 2) Because Yoko was the one who instigated to have Taker taken out. Remember I've been arguing since Yoko got pushed when he got in the company in late 1992 to late 1994.
Stop that shit. Learn to read.

He did nothing. I meant to ask WHY DID HE NEVER CAME BACK TO HIS STATUS AFTER HIS STORYLINE ENDED?!

Yoko was a main eventer in his STATUS, sure. But in his TALENT? No. It's like saying that Del Rio was a REAL main eventer, although after his storyline was done, he never came back to that status.

NO ONE CARED ABOUT THE SURVIVOR SERIES 1994 MATCH! Bret-Backlund is more memorable. Everyone remember the Taker-Taker match from Summerslam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Funny that, your the one who is whining because nobody agrees with you.
Oooooh... Did the mean genius made you cry to your Yoko teddy bear? Crybaby.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Del Rio was pushed but was never pushed the full way like they did with Yoko. Yes he won the rumble, but he lost the title match at WM to Edge in the OPENER of the show. He won MITB and the title but was never the focal point of the show. WWE were more concerned with getting Cena up to 10 WWE title reigns and then putting the strap on Punk. Del Rio was playing third wheel to Cena and the Summer of Punk when it came to the WWE title in 2011. Henry however was slowly built up into a monster heel, won the title and became the focal point of the title and SD. He was the top heel in the company, he had more stock in him than Del Rio. 3 months? 5 months? Who cares. He was still dominant, we agree. He would have held the title longer if it weren't for his unfortunate injury.

Wrestlemania IX might have been the worst mania of all time but it didn't have the worst main event ever. It was one of the better matches on the card. And actually fans were pretty pissed off from what I hear with Hogan getting the strap again. There was a vocal portion of the audience who were sick and tired of Hogan always being on top. I'd say people did care that Hogan won the title off Yoko then. Whether it be because they hated how Yoko won the title and were happy that Hogan won it or that people were pissed off Hogan won the title so quickly after Yoko won the main event.
Yoko was like Del Rio.

Yoko wasn't dominating and played a third wheel to Hogan and Bret on Wrestlemania IX.

That main event of Wrestlemania sucked ass. And the crowd was REALLY happy seeing Hogan as the champ. Yoko was NOTHING.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Advertisers stopped giving money and stopped broadcasting in those syndicate stations because of the steroid scandal in 1993. Any person who has done their research will tell you this. Had nothing to do with Yoko or any other main event talent at the time.

Did I say Yoko was a huge draw? No. So why you arguing about it? You are arguing Yoko was worthless and talentless as a main eventer. I'm arguing he is not, I mentioned the heels because it is a worthy point to consider. If Yoko was such a bad main event heel, why wasn't there anybody else that Vince thought was better to carry the belt at the time as a heel? Why were there no other heels at that time who eclipsed Yoko between 1993-1994? Not till Sycho Sid when the company was truly in trouble? You cant answer this can you? Nope.

Again you seem to underestimate how much the steroid scandal had an impact on the business. It's funny you mention Diesel because Kevin Nash said the exact same thing about the steroid scandal, it was a shoot to say the least. As far as Diesel being a draw, even Nash admits the only reason he got the strap in 1995 because he was one of the only guys who was big and was proven that he didn't take steroids. That should tell you enough.
Let's say there wasn't a Steroid Scandal.

The WWE wouldn't draw nothing with YOKO as a champ.

No other heel got the belt simply because that wasn't Vince's method. He likes face champs, but at that time, Hogan left. And he couldn't put the belt on Luger at Summerslam 1993. So Yoko was VERY lucky.

About Nash- Oh, yeah... Nash would not say he was a bad draw, just as BRET won't say it.

Nash wouldn't draw even if it wasn't for the scandal. WHY? Because he sucked as a face champ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Here are some figures from after Mania when he was being built up as a main event heel towards KOTR:

WWF @ London, England - Wembley Arena - April 16, 1993 (11,000; sell out)
WWF @ Nurenberg, Germany - April 18, 1993 (sell out)
WWF @ Frankfurt, Germany - April 23, 1993 (9,000; sell out)
European Rampage - Milan, Italy - Forum Assago - April 25, 1993 (7,500)
WWF @ Long Island, NY - Nassau Coliseum - May 1, 1993 (8,400)
WWF @ Worcester, MA - Memorial Auditorium - May 4, 1993 (4,000; sell out)
WWF @ Portland, ME - Exposition Building - May 5, 1993 (2,700; sell out)
WWF @ New York City, NY - Manhattan Center - May 10, 1993 (1,200; sell out)
King of the Ring 93 - Dayton, OH - Nutter Center - June 13, 1993 (8,000; sell out; 7,000 paid)
I can ask you about each and every one of those:

Can you prove Yoko was there at London at April 1993?

Sold out at Germany? HOW much, exactly?

Yoko WASN'T main eventing at some of those house shows.

2,700 is a big crowd? NO.

He sold out THE MANHATTAN CENTER?! WOW! It's a SMALL venue, dumbass!

About King of the Ring- Oh, you mean the LOWEST attendence for a KOTR? The one that got DOUBLED after a year when Yoko was in a tag match with Crush?

Also, a lot of those are outside of the US. That means nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Of course you will disregard that and say it was all Hogan even though it takes two to sell a main event of a PPV. Fine, let's pick out a "few" *sarcasm* examples from Yoko's reign in 1993:

When Yoko was champion:
WWF @ Wilkes-Barre, PA - Wilkes University Marts Center - July 6, 1993 (3,400; sell out)
WWF @ Plattsburgh, NY - Crete Civic Center - July 27, 1993 (3,000; sell out)
WWF @ Vienna, Austria - July 29, 1993 (7,000; sell out)
WWF @ Munich, Germany - August 1, 1993 (12,000; sell out)
WWF @ Sheffield, England - Arena - August 6, 1993 (10,000; sell out)
WWF @ New York City, NY - Madison Square Garden - August 13, 1993 (13,000)
WWF @ Poughkeepsie, NY - Mid-Hudson Civic Center - August 16, 1993 (3,000; sell out)
WWF @ Lowell, MA - Memorial Auditorium - August 18, 1993 (2,500; sell out)
WWF @ Anaheim, CA - Arrowhead Pond - August 21, 1993 (15,000)
Summer Slam 93 - Auburn Hills, MI - Palace - August 30, 1993 (14,100)
WWF @ Grand Rapids, MI - August 31, 1993 (3,500; sell out)
WWF @ San Jose, CA - Arena - October 1, 1993 (7,500)
WWF @ Los Angeles, CA - Sports Arena - October 3, 1993 (7,000)
WWF @ Tel Aviv, Israel - October 7, 1993 (12,000; sell out)
WWF @ Burlington, VT - Civic Center - October 20, 1993 (2,500; sell out)
WWF @ Pittsburgh, PA - Civic Arena - October 22, 1993 (9,800)
WWF @ Dehli, NY - Farrell Hall - November 10, 1993 (2,500; sell out)
Survivor Series 93 - Boston, MA - Boston Garden - November 24, 1993 (15,509; sell out)
WWF @ Montreal, Quebec - Forum - November 26, 1993 (13,800)
WWF @ Nurenberg, Germany - December 7, 1993 (5,000; sell out)
WWF @ Dusseldorf, Germany - December 8, 1993 (5,500; sell out)
WWF @ Lowell, MA - Auditorium - December 14, 1993 (2,500; sell out)

All either sell outs or big attendances. Sure you can say some of the sell out's mean nothing because of the small venues but then WWE ran smaller venues for house shows in them days. Heck they run small house shows these days. The focal point building up to the bigger shows at that point: Yoko and the face they built up to face him whether it be Bret, Luger or Taker.
They did a small house shows because the business sucked ass at that point, sorry.

I won't talk about the TV tapings or PPV. Those aren't house shows and can have huge crowds. but those are the special occasions, and those occasions mean nothing about his reign.

He faced Hogan on three occasions there. PLUS, two of them are outside of the US.

About the "Home venues" for the WWF (MSG, Arrowhead Pond) that means nothing. Also, Yoko wasn't main eventing a lot of those house shows.

Those California house shows are not sold out.

He sold out in Tel Aviv, ISRAEL?! MY COUNTRY?! Yeah. I said: Yoko is a GOD in my country. BUT it means nothing... Wrestling was new to Israel back then. Yoko had nothing to do with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
It's very easy to pick out a few examples and claim from those few examples that the houses didn't draw. You are going to have a few bad houses during the year, it's a given. Stacked up to the examples I've given and your claim falls down like a house of cards.
All in all, Yoko had small crowds. The "Big crowds" are nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
I never claimed Yoko was a huge draw, he wasn't. Nor was Bret for that matter (your other love to hate wrestler) but to say Yoko was worthless as champion? Fallacy. The fact that you have to rely on numbers to prove your point just shows how much you are clutching at the straws to try and prove your opinion is correct even though it is subjective based. And even then, it can easily be rebutted.
You've said he had "BIG HOUSES" and that "FACTS DON'T LIE". Besides, Yoko was nothing.

He wasn't worthy being a champ. He wasn't a main eventer- And I mean to him not being a REAL main eventer. A REAL star.

And also, he was only a good wrestler for his SIZE. Just like Ryback is a very good wrestler for a Ryback.

He was nothing. He had a stale character.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Give up, you are never going to win this argument.
No, YOU GIVE UP. The facts are on MY side.

Yoko is overrated.

Last edited by Yosihait : 03-17-2013 at 10:57 AM.
Yosihait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 10:55 AM   #137 (permalink)
Moron
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: “We are each our own devil, and we make this world our hell.”
Posts: 5,127
Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500Coffey 6001 - 6500
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

I love the Yokozuna WWF debut jobber squash match. Not even because of Yoko, honestly. Jobber Bill Jordan is hilarious. Watch how he sells the leg drop! I was falling out.



A lot of those old school jobbers don't get the credit they deserve for the beatings they took.
Coffey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 12:39 PM   #138 (permalink)
I'll never be lonesome again.
 
L-DOPA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: London, UK
Posts: 4,926
L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501L-DOPA 7001 - 7501
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
It is important.

Honky wrestled even after his "Heydays" at the 1980s. Luger wrestled in the year 2000 and Jarrett is wrestling. Since Yoko is (Unfortunately) not alive- The only way you can judge him is by your childhood memories.
No actually, you can judge by looking years later than when he was around. Like now. The same way you can with Luger and Honky. You're full of shit.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
There's a HUGE difference between PRODUCT and CULTURE.

The 90s PRODUCT was related to 80s CULTURE. However, the 90s CULTURE was Grunge, MTV and rebellionism. Patriots and anti-americans are 80s things, not 90s things.

As Vince Russo said- Vince McMahon was living in the 80s. But the problem is that after what happened with Hogan and the steroids, the crowd hated this 80s illusion. The 90s gave a devestating blow to the 80s.
You did not explain it as culture. I completely agree with you about the early to mid 90's with WWE being stuck in the 80's. That was a problem with the booking philosophy and the product. At least you finally said something that makes sense.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
No, you're really don't get it.

Undertaker is about Mark Callaway. If anyone else would've played it it would've been dumb. Taker wasn't "Dark and Scary at that time", the character is dark and scary PERIOD. Today or then. Therefore, if that character came in today, with the same Callaway, I'll love it. Because he does it so greatly.
You really can't read can you? I said the character was just as important as the person playing it. Not more. Your saying the character has less importance the person playing it. I disagree, they are both equally important. The Undertaker character got Mark Callaway over and made him relevant as much as Mark Callaway made the Undertaker character. He would tell you that himself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Yoko wasn't a monster.
In your opinion and most people agree your opinion doesn't mean shit.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
But he WAS a main attrection back then. Never mind if it was for a short time, Warrior WAS a main eventer during his WHOLE time at the WWF. Unlike Yoko.
The main attractions in 1996 were HBK, Bret, Sycho Sid and Undertaker. Austin was also starting to come into his own. Warrior was there for 4 months before getting fired. His biggest profile match was against Goldust for the IC title. He was booked as a mid carder. Not a main eventer. Yoko and Warrior are not as different as you like to think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Warrior was main eventing in 1990-1992, and in 1996 (He was set to face Michaels in a Summerslam main event and got a HUGE push). Even in WCW he WAS a star, never mind if he was a flop. Yoko was a main eventer for a one year and then... A jobber.
As I said, Warrior never main evented in 1996. That is a pure fact. There might have been plans for him to face Michaels at Summerslam (what prove do you have that this was going to take place?) but it ultimately never happened. Warrior yes was a star in WCW for 5 months based on name sake. He didn't last as he was dropped by the end of the year and was never seen from again.

Yoko may not have been a main eventer after 1995 but he still continued to have prominence in the company. Unless being in successful tag team runs in 1995 = jobbing to you . 1996 was when he truly started to deteriorate


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Stop that shit. Learn to read.

He did nothing. I meant to ask WHY DID HE NEVER CAME BACK TO HIS STATUS AFTER HIS STORYLINE ENDED?!

Yoko was a main eventer in his STATUS, sure. But in his TALENT? No. It's like saying that Del Rio was a REAL main eventer, although after his storyline was done, he never came back to that status.

NO ONE CARED ABOUT THE SURVIVOR SERIES 1994 MATCH! Bret-Backlund is more memorable. Everyone remember the Taker-Taker match from Summerslam.
No one cared about the SS match with him and Taker? Are you listening to yourself?

The rebirth of the Undertaker was one of the biggest storylines in 1994 and the big revenge pay off with Yoko the man who took got him taken out was one of if not the biggest part of it. You want to talk about revisionism yet you will completely overlook things to credit your opinion.

The rest of it is again your subjective opinion on Yoko's talent which has been done to death now.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Yoko was like Del Rio.

Yoko wasn't dominating and played a third wheel to Hogan and Bret on Wrestlemania IX.

That main event of Wrestlemania sucked ass. And the crowd was REALLY happy seeing Hogan as the champ. Yoko was NOTHING.
Yoko was consistently in the main event for two years having feuds with the likes of Hogan, Luger, Bret and Undertaker. He held the title for 10 months. Del Rio despite his accolades never had any big feuds, had two transitional title reigns and played third wheel all summer. What feuds did Del Rio have? Tell me.

Hogan wasn't even a part of the Wrestlemania IX build up . He was randomly slotted in by Vince after Hogan played politics. The main event build was all Yoko and Bret. Nothing to do with Hogan. Even after Wrestlemania it was Yoko who ended up main eventing KOTR against Hogan and all the build was around Hogan/Yoko. If anything it was Bret who was forced to play third wheel up till KOTR. Bret after losing the title was left out at Mania and the talk was about Yoko winning the title and then Hogan winning it straight after. Hogan and Bret kayfabe wise didn't even beef with each other.

You and your false revisionism, this is too easy .


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
Let's say there wasn't a Steroid Scandal.

The WWE wouldn't draw nothing with YOKO as a champ.

No other heel got the belt simply because that wasn't Vince's method. He likes face champs, but at that time, Hogan left. And he couldn't put the belt on Luger at Summerslam 1993. So Yoko was VERY lucky.

About Nash- Oh, yeah... Nash would not say he was a bad draw, just as BRET won't say it.

Nash wouldn't draw even if it wasn't for the scandal. WHY? Because he sucked as a face champ
Do you even read? I said Nash said the only reason he got the belt was because Vince liked that he was big. That's it. He freely admits that was the only reason. Complete opposite of what you claim. Boy you are an idiot.

WWE wouldn't draw as much with Yoko than they did in the Hogan era because they were in a transitional period. What part of "I know Yoko wasn't a mega draw" don't you understand? Yoko as the champ was not the main reason why WWE was in big financial trouble. Had the steroid scandal never happened WWE would have been a much more stable position even with Yoko as champion. You realize how much money that scandal cost them? They weren't as financially secure as they are now.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
I can ask you about each and every one of those:

Can you prove Yoko was there at London at April 1993?

Sold out at Germany? HOW much, exactly?

Yoko WASN'T main eventing at some of those house shows.

2,700 is a big crowd? NO.

He sold out THE MANHATTAN CENTER?! WOW! It's a SMALL venue, dumbass!

About King of the Ring- Oh, you mean the LOWEST attendence for a KOTR? The one that got DOUBLED after a year when Yoko was in a tag match with Crush?

Also, a lot of those are outside of the US. That means nothing.

They did a small house shows because the business sucked ass at that point, sorry.

I won't talk about the TV tapings or PPV. Those aren't house shows and can have huge crowds. but those are the special occasions, and those occasions mean nothing about his reign.

He faced Hogan on three occasions there. PLUS, two of them are outside of the US.

About the "Home venues" for the WWF (MSG, Arrowhead Pond) that means nothing. Also, Yoko wasn't main eventing a lot of those house shows.

Those California house shows are not sold out.

He sold out in Tel Aviv, ISRAEL?! MY COUNTRY?! Yeah. I said: Yoko is a GOD in my country. BUT it means nothing... Wrestling was new to Israel back then. Yoko had nothing to do with it.
All the shows after he became champion that I noted he was main eventing. All the other shows I noted were when Hogan and Yoko were being built up to main event KOTR. So Yoko was a big deal in all those shows he was involved with. He was considered a main eventer then, so he contributed a lot.

WWE does small house shows even now, I really don't get how that doesn't register with you. Yes the business was in a state then for reasons I have already stated but a sell out house is a sell out house regardless of how big the venue is. Yoko helped keep the business a float and draw money for the WWE. If that weren't the case WWE would have been out of business and they weren't in real deep trouble until 1996 when Yoko WASN'T main eventing.

King of the Ring was a new unproven concept, a new PPV. So obviously it was not going to draw as much as the other big PPV shows because it was a new thing, they were taking a risk. The fact that the next year show doubled showed how much the concept had worked. Considering it was a new PPV concept at a time it did a pretty decent number. By your definition Hogan is as much to blame for it not drawing as much as the preceding years as Yoko if not more as he was the champion. Never mind that it was a new unproven PPV concept.

How does the outside the US shows mean nothing? If anything in some ways they were more important. WWE was making their most money those days like music artists and bands make their money these days: From doing dates through touring. In 1993 the events outside the US were still drawing good business, the market was still out there and it was still big and drawing good houses. Yoko main evented all of the shows I put there that were outside the US.

Israel? Yeah you got me, it was a new concept. But the fact that Yoko was main eventing the show and it drew that well does suggest something. It maybe a new concept but not all new concepts get off the crowd. You need stars to come out and see in order to be interested and Yoko was the champion then. If they didn't have any interest in the champion or main stars then they wouldn't have drawn a dime.

Business was bad because of the scandals WWE were under and the money they lost so they were forced to do smaller venues in the states and rely on overseas tours (which did well and mean a lot more than you think, wrestling was becoming a more global market now) + the bigger events. Yoko did fine as champion and drew fine. He was no Hulk Hogan but he was no business killer either.

It shows how much you have to rely on numbers to try and prove Yoko was bad when you can't do it through formulated opinions because you have no understanding of what charisma and presence is. Yet I'm still able to answer every point you make.
__________________


I'm a Laura Stevenson guy

Last edited by L-DOPA : 03-17-2013 at 01:05 PM.
L-DOPA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 01:07 PM   #139 (permalink)
Humbled
 
Yosihait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Israel
Posts: 503
Yosihait 50 - 100
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
No actually, you can judge by looking years later than when he was around. Like now. The same way you can with Luger and Honky. You're full of shit.
No, I can judge by facts and facts are that Yoko wasn't that main eventer you try to say he was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
In your opinion and most people agree your opinion doesn't mean shit.
It's a FACT he wasn't a monster, because he lost all the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
The main attractions in 1996 were HBK, Bret, Sycho Sid and Undertaker. Austin was also starting to come into his own. Warrior was there for 4 months before getting fired. His biggest profile match was against Goldust for the IC title. He was booked as a mid carder. Not a main eventer. Yoko and Warrior are not as different as you like to think.

As I said, Warrior never main evented in 1996. That is a pure fact. There might have been plans for him to face Michaels at Summerslam (what prove do you have that this was going to take place?) but it ultimately never happened. Warrior yes was a star in WCW for 5 months based on name sake. He didn't last as he was dropped by the end of the year and was never seen from again.

Yoko may not have been a main eventer after 1995 but he still continued to have prominence in the company. Unless being in successful tag team runs in 1995 = jobbing to you . 1996 was when he truly started to deteriorate
Austin and Sid weren't attrections back then. Especially Sid- He actually replaced Warrior. Warrior was set to main event the July in your house and he was booked (On the shows) as a real main eventer. Also- He main evented house shows back then against Vader, and those main events never happened because he left. And as you've said- Warrior was a star by his name. Yoko? No.

And YEAH, Yoko's career stopped after WM 10. His run at 1995 with Owen means nothing- They hardly defended those titles, and the tag team division was REALLY dry at that point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
No one cared about the SS match with him and Taker? Are you listening to yourself?

The rebirth of the Undertaker was one of the biggest storylines in 1994 and the big revenge pay off with Yoko the man who took got him taken out was one of if not the biggest part of it. You want to talk about revisionism yet you will completely overlook things to credit your opinion.

The rest of it is again your subjective opinion on Yoko's talent which has been done to death now.
Nah, the REAL deal was his return at Summerslam, not that match at Survivor Series. That wasn't the big payoff. It was just an afterthought... By the way, WHERE was Yoko at Summerslam 1994?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Yoko was consistently in the main event for two years having feuds with the likes of Hogan, Luger, Bret and Undertaker. He held the title for 10 months. Del Rio despite his accolades never had any big feuds, had two transitional title reigns and played third wheel all summer. What feuds did Del Rio have? Tell me.

Hogan wasn't even a part of the Wrestlemania IX build up . He was randomly slotted in by Vince after Hogan played politics. The main event build was all Yoko and Bret. Nothing to do with Hogan. Even after Wrestlemania it was Yoko who ended up main eventing KOTR against Hogan and all the build was around Hogan/Yoko. If anything it was Bret who was forced to play third wheel up till KOTR. Bret after losing the title was left out at Mania and the talk was about Yoko winning the title and then Hogan winning it straight after. Hogan and Bret kayfabe wise didn't even beef with each other.

You and your false revisionism, this is too easy .
Yoko was a main eventer because the WWE PUT HIM THERE. Even more then this, Hogan was the REAL main eventer with the tag match. That was the REAL deal back then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
WWE wouldn't draw as much with Yoko than they did in the Hogan era because they were in a transitional period. What part of "I know Yoko wasn't a mega draw" don't you understand? Yoko as the champ was not the main reason why WWE was in big financial trouble. Had the steroid scandal never happened WWE would have been a much more stable position even with Yoko as champion. You realize how much money that scandal cost them? They weren't as financially secure as they are now.
They wouldn't draw with Yoko never mind what... Because he wasn't the culture. He wasn't that guy. And no, he wouldn't draw even without steroid scandal. It's like saying Nash would draw at 1995 if it hadn't been for the scandal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
All the shows after he became champion that I noted he was main eventing. All the other shows I noted were when Hogan and Yoko were being built up to main event KOTR. So Yoko was a big deal in all those shows he was involved with. He was considered a main eventer then, so he contributed a lot.
Ummm... No, he WASN'T. Check it- He wasn't main eventing a LOT of those house shows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
WWE does small house shows even now, I really don't get how that doesn't register with you. Yes the business was in a state then for reasons I have already stated but a sell out house is a sell out house regardless of how big the venue is. Yoko helped keep the business a float and draw money for the WWE. If that weren't the case WWE would have been out of business and they weren't in real deep trouble until 1996 when Yoko WASN'T main eventing.
No, Yoko didn't sell out. According to you, I'm bigger then Yoko if I'll headline a 2,000 people house show. The WWE WERE in trouble back then as well. Stop that. Wrestling was in trouble.

WWE today have 8,000 people at LEAST on their house shows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
King of the Ring was a new unproven concept, a new PPV. So obviously it was not going to draw as much as the other big PPV shows because it was a new thing, they were taking a risk. The fact that the next year show doubled showed how much the concept had worked. Considering it was a new PPV concept at a time it did a pretty decent number.
You've brought that up, and now you're saying it meant nothing? Yoko doesn't need your excuses. He didn't drew.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
How does the outside the US shows mean nothing? If anything in some ways they were more important. WWE was making their most money those days like music artists and bands make their money these days: From doing dates through touring. In 1993 the events outside the US were still drawing good business, the market was still out there and it was still big and drawing good houses. Yoko main evented all of the shows I put there that were outside the US.
Wrestling outside of the states was in bubble back then. And the reason that the WWE made money from the touring back then was because the profit from wrestling in the US was down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Israel? Yeah you got me, it was a new concept. But the fact that Yoko was main eventing the show and it drew that well does suggest something. It maybe a new concept but not all new concepts get off the crowd. You need stars to come out and see in order to be interested and Yoko was the champion then. If they didn't have any interest in the champion or main stars then they wouldn't have drawn a dime.
But no one in Israel knew anything about Wrestling before 1993.

According to your merit, Kwang and Tatanka (Who were main eventing in Israel at 1994) are big stars as well... Tatanka is considered to be a big star in Israel, so does Kevin Von Erich.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
Business was bad because of the scandals WWE were under and the money they lost so they were forced to do smaller venues in the states and rely on overseas tours (which did well and mean a lot more than you think, wrestling was becoming a more global market now) + the bigger events. Yoko did fine as champion and drew fine. He was no Hulk Hogan but he was no business killer either.
Yoko drew BAD and almost killed the business. The man who turned wrestling to a global phenomenon was Hogan. And also- the business were bad not because of the scandals- They were bad because the culture just hated it.

I don't see you say that the business today suck because of Benoit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusade View Post
It shows how much you have to rely on numbers to try and prove Yoko was bad when you can't do it through formulated opinions because you have no understanding of what charisma and presence is. Yet I'm still able to answer every point you make.
Yoko had NO charisma!

IF HE HAD THAT, WHY HE BECAME A JOBBER AFTER HIS STORYLINE WAS ENDED?!

It shows Yoko is nothing when you have to invent stuff and special catagories for him outta your ass, just to prove he was so great (AND THAT'S THE QUESTION, DUMMY- IF HE WAS GREAT!).

I am the one who answered each and every one of your points.

And I am the one who knows about Yoko, because he's so fondly remembered here in Israel.
Yosihait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2013, 07:13 AM   #140 (permalink)
Getting ignored by SCOTT STEINER
 
dddsssccc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 670
dddsssccc 101 - 250dddsssccc 101 - 250
Default Re: Yokozuna was great

Yoko was like a dancing bear. He could move unbelievably well for someone so huge. He had such a limited character and personality though. R.I.P.
dddsssccc is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On


VerticalSports
Baseball Forum Golf Forum Boxing Forum Snowmobile Forum
Basketball Forum Soccer Forum MMA Forum PWC Forum
Football Forum Cricket Forum Wrestling Forum ATV Forum
Hockey Forum Volleyball Forum Paintball Forum Snowboarding Forum
Tennis Forum Rugby Forums Lacrosse Forum Skiing Forums
Copyright (C) Verticalscope Inc Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2
Powered by vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2009 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007, PixelFX Studios