Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums

Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums (http://www.wrestlingforum.com/)
-   Classic Wrestling (http://www.wrestlingforum.com/classic-wrestling/)
-   -   The Montreal Incident (http://www.wrestlingforum.com/classic-wrestling/623656-montreal-incident.html)

AwSmash 06-23-2012 09:56 PM

Who do you think? State why.

I know Shawn Michaels was an absolute dickhead back in the day. Bret Hart was too though. I can only imagine how much fun Vince had dealing with those two. Ha.

I think that far too many people are giving Vince the blame here, to be honest. I think it's 50/50.

Amazing_Cult 06-23-2012 10:32 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Bret screwed Bret. He really wasn't that special, and to flat-out refuse to drop the title to Shawn. It wasn't like Bret was some fabled Canadian hero. Even though his character was a nationalist, he was far from being straight-up idolized and legit riots happening.

Even though Vince gets ostracized here often about some of his decisions and more appalling nature/attitude [Making fun of JR's Bells palsy], the man is still someone who respected most of his stars [Not having any problems with Flair leaving, as long he dropped the title before he went to WCW.]

But Bret didn't want to drop the title to Shawn, who really was the only wrestler at the time that could hold the belt and be credible. Even though he was a member of The Kliq, Michaels was still a respected wrestler and great champion. I know Hart wanted to stand-up to Michaels horrible behavior, but at the end of the day, its better to be a professional.

RyanPelley 06-23-2012 10:33 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
I've yet to see any reasoning to how the fault is Bret's. People like to bring up that he refused to drop the Title to Shawn, yet don't mention that it was Shawn who did that first. Bret was just returning the favor for Shawn's douchey ways.

I think it's Shawn. How he acted like he had no idea, then jumps in the air, celebrating before going behind the curtain. Then of course. "I had no idea. God as my fuckin witness."

Ziggler Mark 06-23-2012 10:49 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Other: Shawn Michaels...for vehemently denying that he was involved during the post-match confrontation, but years later, admitting he was involved.

For as talented as Michaels was, he's arguably the biggest mother fucking ego in the history of the business. Always craved the spotlight...always.

Elipses Corter 06-23-2012 11:26 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
I voted Bret, for refusing to drop the title in Canada. I know HBK said he wouldn't do the job for Bret but 2 wrongs don't make a right. Bret should have been the bigger man and done what was best for business.

I hate to sound like an asshole but everything that happened to Bret since was karma. And while HBK has done tons of rotten shit in his career, he had 1 moment that was truly good for business, made Vince tons of money and changed the business, when he dropped the belt to Austin. Bret shouldn't have worried or bitched about losing in Canada. I could see if it was Calgary but it was fucking Montreal. And the fact that HBK bitched his entire career and got away with it, yet Bret refuses to do a job and gets screwed, it tells you how highly Vince thought of HBK compared to Bret. He saw more money in HBK and also, I think Bret was still pissed he had to job at WM 12.

KO Bossy 06-23-2012 11:42 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Trouble Trouble (Post 11638169)
I voted Bret, for refusing to drop the title in Canada. I know HBK said he wouldn't do the job for Bret but 2 wrongs don't make a right. Bret should have been the bigger man and done what was best for business.

I hate to sound like an asshole but everything that happened to Bret since was karma. And while HBK has done tons of rotten shit in his career, he had 1 moment that was truly good for business, made Vince tons of money and changed the business, when he dropped the belt to Austin. Bret shouldn't have worried or bitched about losing in Canada. I could see if it was Calgary but it was fucking Montreal. And the fact that HBK bitched his entire career and got away with it, yet Bret refuses to do a job and gets screwed, it tells you how highly Vince thought of HBK compared to Bret. He saw more money in HBK and also, I think Bret was still pissed he had to job at WM 12.

You are aware that Shawn did not want to drop the belt to Austin and it was only under the threat of physical injury and violence from Undertaker that he was basically forced to do it, right?

It was absolutely HBK and Vince who were the ones at fault here. Anyone saying that Bret screwed Bret is a fucking idiot. Please tell me how it is anyone, ANYONE, can justify international humiliation in front of millions of people by being betrayed by your boss (in an industry that relies HEAVILY on trust) because the man he was scheduled to do business with was already violating said trust by being a dangerous, unprofessional jerk and Bret stood up for himself. Never once did Bret say he wouldn't job to Shawn, he only ever said he wanted to retain in Canada and would gladly lose it on television the next night or week after. However, Vince was terrified of another Alundra Blayze incident occurring and thought Bret would just boogie down to Atlanta with his world title, instead of giving Bret the benefit of the doubt, since they'd been friends and business associates for...15 or so years. So what is the logical decision in this case? Let's conspire with the self centered, highly political, degenerate drug addict to fuck Bret over!

Way to choose sides there, Vinnie.

As far as I'm concerned there is no debate here. Bret absolutely did not deserve what happened to him. Whoever thinks he does, picture this: you're at work and your boss says "take this toothbrush and go clean toilets." You say "no, that's not my job." Your boss says fine. Next thing you know, a video of you doing something extremely embarrassing (use your imagination) airs on TV on all major channels. It turns out it was your boss who had it put on the air and he did it as a way of fucking you over because you wouldn't do what he asked. Now tell me, did you deserve something that humiliating? No, and neither did Bret.

Coffey 06-23-2012 11:46 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanPelley (Post 11638027)
I've yet to see any reasoning to how the fault is Bret's. People like to bring up that he refused to drop the Title to Shawn, yet don't mention that it was Shawn who did that first. Bret was just returning the favor for Shawn's douchey ways.

Have you ever heard the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right?"
Quote:

Originally Posted by Trouble Trouble (Post 11638169)
I know HBK said he wouldn't do the job for Bret but 2 wrongs don't make a right.

Guess so!

But whatever, I think it was all a work anyway (I'm not joking).

RyanPelley 06-23-2012 11:57 PM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Walk-In (Post 11638214)
Have you ever heard the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right?"

Guess so!

But whatever, I think it was all a work anyway (I'm not joking).

Of course. But with an ego the size of Shawn's going against Bret's also big ego, if one refuses to do business, why should the other? I know it's not mature and the best for business, but this situation was pretty much a "Fuck You" deal.

It's like, I helped out a fellow co-worker last year. Went out of my way to give him a hand, transporting several thousand pound containers. He didn't say thank you to me, not a single word. So I kinda said, "Fuck you dude", and didn't alert him that he left his equipment unsecured. He drove up, had an accident, and got canned. I would have saved his ass if he could have been nice in the right situation.

Just like Shawn not being an asshole in the first place, then Bret would have had no problem dropping the Title back. Why lose your pride by letting some asshole(s) take advantage of your willingness to do what's best for business? Again, egos in play.

Elipses Corter 06-24-2012 12:12 AM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KO Bossy (Post 11638202)
You are aware that Shawn did not want to drop the belt to Austin and it was only under the threat of physical injury and violence from Undertaker that he was basically forced to do it, right?

It was absolutely HBK and Vince who were the ones at fault here. Anyone saying that Bret screwed Bret is a fucking idiot. Please tell me how it is anyone, ANYONE, can justify international humiliation in front of millions of people by being betrayed by your boss (in an industry that relies HEAVILY on trust) because the man he was scheduled to do business with was already violating said trust by being a dangerous, unprofessional jerk and Bret stood up for himself. Never once did Bret say he wouldn't job to Shawn, he only ever said he wanted to retain in Canada and would gladly lose it on television the next night or week after. However, Vince was terrified of another Alundra Blayze incident occurring and thought Bret would just boogie down to Atlanta with his world title, instead of giving Bret the benefit of the doubt, since they'd been friends and business associates for...15 or so years. So what is the logical decision in this case? Let's conspire with the self centered, highly political, degenerate drug addict to fuck Bret over!

Way to choose sides there, Vinnie.

As far as I'm concerned there is no debate here. Bret absolutely did not deserve what happened to him. Whoever thinks he does, picture this: you're at work and your boss says "take this toothbrush and go clean toilets." You say "no, that's not my job." Your boss says fine. Next thing you know, a video of you doing something extremely embarrassing (use your imagination) airs on TV on all major channels. It turns out it was your boss who had it put on the air and he did it as a way of fucking you over because you wouldn't do what he asked. Now tell me, did you deserve something that humiliating? No, and neither did Bret.

If it so humiliating to Bret, why did he come back, basically squashing the beef with Vince and HBK? That leads me to believe either Bret was more in the wrong than people admit or that it was all a work, with the plan for the 2 to have a rematch down the line but injuries said otherwise.

Losing the title in Canada should have been the least of Bret's worries. I've heard that WWE, upon signing, makes you list the 5 most embarrassing things that could happen in your career and then tells you eventually, they will happen.

Bret refusing to drop the title because HBK saying he wouldn't return favor is the equivalent of me saying "since you ratted me out to the police, I'm telling on you too". Still doesn't make either situation right. And the fact that they were shooting a documentary during the screwjob, the fact that Mr. McMahon was born from it, Owen stayed in WWE and Bret worked with Vince again less than a decade after the incident strongly tells me this was a work. Nobody can keep their story together and because of his reputation, HBK is always going to be the bad guy. And IMO, Bret still wanted his victory back from 1996.

Let me ask you this, lets say you're Vince McMahon. Now, you're known for screwing over talent in the past (Wendi Richter in '85), you've had the rival promotions WHC on your TV show and your competition had one of your titles thrown in the trash, killing that championship for about 3 years. Bret is known to throw temper tantrums, so how are you going to pretend that there is no chance Bret won't throw your title in the trash, especially as, after you said, Vince constantly standing by HBK?

It's only 2 choices for me, Bret couldn't be trusted or the whole thing was a work that backfired.

Ziggler Mark 06-24-2012 12:14 AM

Re: The Montreal Screwjob.. Who acted worse?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Trouble Trouble (Post 11638265)
If it so humiliating to Bret, why did he come back, basically squashing the beef with Vince and HBK? That leads me to believe either Bret was more in the wrong than people admit or that it was all a work, with the plan for the 2 to have a rematch down the line but injuries said otherwise.

dafuq? Do you honestly think people hold fucking lifelong grudges over scripted championships?


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:29 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2