The Montreal Incident - Page 10 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums

View Poll Results: Who Was Wrong?

Vince McMahon 61 51.69%
Bret Hart 45 38.14%
Other 12 10.17%
Voters: 118. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-05-2013, 08:58 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucky101 View Post
i have brets book, and others seem misinformed but let me get this straight, correct me if im wrong

bret in 96 turned down wcw and signed 20 years with wwe

vince wanted out of it in mid 97 or fall of 97

bret wanted to stay and told vince forget about the money, but vince pushed him out the door even saying take wcw's offer

bret was still under contract for a few weeks after the screwjob, which is why he never showed up on nitro the next night

is this all fact, because some fans seem to think bret signed with wcw because he was greedy and he would of showed up on nitro, which is all wrong
Bret Hart did indeed sign a 20 year contract. His rational for signing it was that the WWF/Vince McMahon had made him a star, so they deserved his loyalty. Also, they were offering him a lot of money to sign, over a long period which basically was letting Bret stay involved with the company for a long time with the idea in his mind that he'd one day succeed Pat Patterson as Vince's #2 guy. This was a dream scenario for Bret because he trusted Vince and as a fan of the business (and himself) he loved the idea of a continued involvement.

Vince was the one who wanted out of the contract. The WWF were in a dire position financially and Vince also saw the writing on the wall with Bret's career. He had already got the best possible out of him and had plans to move in a new, more raunchy direction which Bret wouldn't approve of and would begin to look out-dated and therefore lose worth.

It was under Vince's guidance that Bret began negotiating with WCW. Vince explained his financial position and told Bret to go make a lot of money in a short period of time. Bret decided to respect Vince's wishes and was more than happy with the salary which was offered by Eric Bischoff/WCW.

I'm not too sure about Vince's official start date but I do know that he was still contracted for the night after Survivor Series, so he couldn't have turned up on Nitro then.

Bret Hart is a lot of things but I wouldn't say greedy is one of them. He's just as greedy as anybody else when it comes to money, in fact the way he originally turned down a big money move to WCW would say he is slightly less inclined to do something just for the money.

All in all, I think the whole thing could very well have been a work. Everything worked out so well for everybody involved. Hitman got a nice new contract, HBK got tons of heel heat, Vince became a main event player and pro-wrestling's greatest ever bad guy. Even Earl Hebner got a certain level of ovverness because of it.
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Old 01-05-2013, 11:12 PM   #92 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

^ thats what i thought

so many fans don't know the real truth behind it, saying bret would of showed up the next night on nitro, he couldn't, it would of been breach of contract
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:33 AM   #93 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

can't believe some people are still trying to defend this self-righteous abomination that is Bret Hart, I respect your opinions and to each our own but Defei's post based on the Observer 92' pretty much refutes all Bret Hart defenses and is an invincible/unbeatable argument.
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:39 AM   #94 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

Here's the story I've always knew.

In 1996, Bret was offered a 3 year, $3 million a year deal from WCW. Vince countered with a 20 year deal, with Bret making $1.5 million a year for the first 3 years and spend the next 17 in the booking department at a reduced salary.

On September 22, 1997, Vince told Bret he was intentionally breaching his contract because he couldn't afford to pay him. Vince gave Bret written permission to negotiate with WCW and Bret had an escape clause in his contract that allowed him to leave with 30 days notice and have "reasonable creative control" on how his character finished up.

Before an October 24th show in NY, Vince told Bret the money situation changed and he was able to pay him the agreed upon deal. At that point, WCW had yet to make Bret a serious offer and he told Vince he really didn't want to leave.

On October 31, WCW made Bret an offer for 3 years, $3 million a year. The next day, which was the deadline, Bret told Vince about the offer and said he wanted no additional money from Vince but just wanted to know the direction of his character. Vince had no answer and said he was giving Bret permission to extend his notice and that the WWF CFO would give him written permission. The CFO told Bret that he couldn't get it in writing on such short notice. Bischoff calls Bret for the second time that day with the offer.

On the night of November 1, Vince told Bret to just take the WCW offer. He also gave Bret an idea of how things would play out if he stayed. He would drop the belt to HBK at Survivor Series, HBK goes over again at the December PPV in a four way with Bret, Shamrock & Taker. HBK wins again in a ladder match at Royal Rumble and on the January 19th RAW, Bret opens the show by saying if he can't beat HBK for the title that night, he would retire. Bret would win the belt and go on to drop it to Austin at Mania. But according to Meltzer, Bret wasn't too keen on 4 major losses and only 1 major win. Bret signed with WCW, hours before the midnight deadline.

On November 2, Vince told Bret he wanted HBK to win the belt but Bret refused to drop it in Canada, saying he'd rather do it in Youngstown, OH on the 14th, MSG on the 15th or the December PPV. Vince mentioned dropping the belt at Detroit the night before Survivor Series but Bret felt he needed to go into Montreal as champion.

Bret's WCW contract would begin on December 1st and Bischoff gave him permission to continue in WWE through December 8th. On December 7th, Bret was to drop the title to HBK and come out the next night and give a farewell speech, as all parties had agreed to.


Bottom line, it's a reason Bret didn't appear on WCW TV until December 15th. Bischoff extended Bret's finish up date to December 8th, which would have been the night of RAW, where Bret would say goodbye. But, the screwjob came because Bret turned down various scenarios of dropping the belt, Vince had a fear implemented by HBK & HHH that Bret would show up on Nitro with the belt and throw it in the trash. Vince began calling Bischoff but couldn't get in contact with him because Bischoff was on a hunting trip all week in Wyoming, which was the week leading up to the Survivor Series PPV.

So at final notice, Bret remained under contract pretty much until December 8th, allowing for the title change the night prior. But due to his ego, HBK & HHH in Vince's ear and the fact that Bret had creative control for his final 30 days in the company (which would have been from Survivor Series to the DX PPV), we got a screw job.
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Old 01-06-2013, 01:01 AM   #95 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

i thought the plan was to have a dq finish, then the very next night bret would come out and drop the title and give some sort of speech and leave on those terms

anyways i think it was stupid that vince thought bret would show up the next night, it was a breach of contract, plus if vince wanted the title so dam bad he could of had bret hand it over as soon as he was in the gorilla position, plus bret/vince had a long father son type relationship

point is bret was not showing up the next night, he couldn't, and vince could of confiscated all of brets titles if he wanted to, just to make sure

vince saying he was scared that bret was throwing the title in the trash doesn't make any sense

i get if vince was scared it would make his company look weak, i get that, i just dont get the whole "bret was going to spit and throw title in trash the next night" impossible
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Old 01-06-2013, 01:15 AM   #96 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

It was only impossible because Bischoff gave Bret permission to stay until December 8th and even then, Bret's WCW contract didn't begin until December 1st.

But, it's not completely impossible that the title wouldn't be thrown in the trash or show up on WCW TV, even without Bret.

Point is, Vince & Bret both were in agreement about how Bret would drop the belt days before Survivor Series. Bret told Vince that Bischoff gave him time to stick around until the DX PPV but Vince couldn't get in contact with Bischoff to verify and also had HBK & HHH pumping his head up with the thought of the title showing up on Nitro.

Because the truth is, if Bret refused every opportunity presented to him to drop the title, how was it a lock that he would drop it on December 7th, eventhough he clearly said he wouldn't drop to to HBK? So with that comes the prospect of Bret showing up on Nitro on December 1st, when his WCW contract started, as the champion and throw the belt in the trash.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:46 AM   #97 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

I think that Vince's problem was that he didn't want Bischoff to announce that he signed the champ. So he needed to take the title off Bret.
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:03 AM   #98 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

The Montreal Screwjob is a load of bs, in my opinion. Funny how it conveniently launched the attitude era with the Mr. McMahon character, it made Bret Hart the hottest thing in the business and helped WWF finally make the comeback in the ratings. Controversy makes people pay attention, that's all Vince needed. This led to Austin beating HBK at Mania with Tyson and the WWF never looked back.

Whether Bret was in on it or not can be debated, but I for sure believe Vince wanted/needed this to happen.
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:20 AM   #99 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

^ don't believe it, bret was not in on it, some fans just can't accept some things are real

if it was real why didn't bret come back in 1999, he signed for 3 years and hated it, he got his 9 million, wcw was on its deathbed, he could of came back in dec 99 before his concussion, hbk was gone

vince just should of allowed bret to drop the title maybe to taker, taker/hbk were wrestling anyways, they could of had there match at rumble and everything would of been the same
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:59 PM   #100 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bret Hart Contract in late 1997?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosihait View Post
I think that Vince's problem was that he didn't want Bischoff to announce that he signed the champ. So he needed to take the title off Bret.
I agree (again!). But then why did Vince tell Bret to sign with WCW as the WWF champion? Why didn't he have Bret drop the title first and then have him sign with WCW?
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