Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread - Page 13 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, Debate League, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums
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Old 12-07-2012, 09:36 AM   #121 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

The crowd hated that match because both men were leaving.
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Old 12-07-2012, 09:42 AM   #122 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

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Originally Posted by FuckChristmas View Post
The crowd hated that match because both men were leaving.
I didn't realise you spoke on behalf of the crowd at Wrestlemania XX, sorry.

Here's another one I presume we will disagree on:



Great match, what a tragedy that it wasn't the main event.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:15 AM   #123 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

Whilst the match itself wasn't great with the stalling and eternity in actually locking up, as well as the actual match quality being sub par when they did wrestle..the fact the crowd were chanting repeatedly about Lesnar leaving should speak volumes about what they thought of him. You could audibly hear 'You Sold Out' and 'Na Na Na Na' chants throughout and there were even loud jeers of 'Boring' and 'This Match Sucks'. Pretty sure Goldberg leaving wasn't known until afterwards (I don't have a great memory with that sort of stuff) but he got some pretty brutal heat in spells as well. It was clear the crowd were gonna shit on Lesnar regardless of how good the match turned out.

Rock/Hogan is about as good as that match in 2002 could have possibly been. Well layed out 'Clash of the Titans' match with the crowd obviously helping to make it a spectacle. Not really much in the way of a match but they layed out the brunt of the match well enough with making Rock act more heelish and the crowd cheering on Hogan regardless. Finishing run and both men's finishers being kicked out of with the crowd losing their shit is a really great moment and testament to what a brilliant crowd can do for a match. Such a shame Rock/Cena wasn't structured similarly, instead going twice as long and dragging horribly as a result. Its not a 'great' match in terms of the actual wrestling or even the actual story, but its a brilliant spectacle which is what the match needed to be. Its the kind of match that could make grown men relive their younger years when Hogan was the biggest thing in wrestling.

Stan Hansen vs Andre from 1981 in New Japan is still the best Andre match I've ever seen and one of the greatest spectacles in wrestling history. Seeing the New Japan fans fully behind Hansen in his battle to topple the Giant is such a sight and Andre is still fairly nimble compared to his broken down years in WWF. The whole battle of Andre trying to avoid Hansen's lariat and the ultimate payoff to that story is beautiful.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:33 AM   #124 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

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Originally Posted by The Gorgeous One View Post
I didn't realise you spoke on behalf of the crowd at Wrestlemania XX, sorry.

Here's another one I presume we will disagree on:



Great match, what a tragedy that it wasn't the main event.
Like Segunda said, the crowd were chanting stuff that proves they hated the fact they were leaving lol. Doesn't mean the match wasn't shitty though, because it was, but I don't think the crowd even gave it a chance because they were pissed they were leaving the company.

And I like Rock/Hogan. Definitely should have main evented over Jericho/HHH.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:59 AM   #125 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

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Originally Posted by Segunda Caida View Post
Its not a 'great' match in terms of the actual wrestling or even the actual story, but its a brilliant spectacle which is what the match needed to be. Its the kind of match that could make grown men relive their younger years when Hogan was the biggest thing in wrestling.
What is 'actual wrestling'? I have heard the term not a very good wrestler been thrown around a lot about certain guys or not very good 'wrestling' matches. What is 'wrestling'? Who says what makes a match good? Wrestling is in the eye of the beholder. What makes a match good is completely subjective.

'Wrestling' surely incorporates every aspect of it, not just technical or mat based wrestling.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:06 AM   #126 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

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What is 'actual wrestling'? I have heard the term not a very good wrestler been thrown around a lot about certain guys or not very good 'wrestling' matches. What is 'wrestling'? Who says what makes a match good? Wrestling is in the eye of the beholder. What makes a match good is completely subjective.

'Wrestling' surely incorporates every aspect of it, not just technical or mat based wrestling.
I mean from what I consider a good wrestling match. Neither guy puts in a great babyface/heel performance, the general match is just comprised of both character having basic sequences before the finishing run. Its a spectacle match where the atmosphere dominates and means they don't have to break out of their comfort zone. Its hardly a Benoit/Regal, Benoit/Finlay or Eddie/Mysterio match which has solid storytelling, a great babyface/heel dynamic, sequences which build and build until the finish, organic counters etc. Rock/Hogan obviously wasn't meant to see either grapple or even do much outside of the basics, which is entirely meant to be a compliment and not take away from the match.

I'm not saying Rock/Hogan should have tried to imitate any of those matches, just highlight the difference between the type of match Rock/Hogan worked and the sort of direction the other matches took in terms of character work, storytelling, pacing and build.

Not sure what the need was for that 'what makes a match good?' sentence. Wrestling as a subjective element should be entirely obvious to anyone.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:18 AM   #127 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

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Originally Posted by Segunda Caida View Post
I mean from what I consider a good wrestling match. Neither guy puts in a great babyface/heel performance, the general match is just comprised of both character having basic sequences before the finishing run. Its a spectacle match where the atmosphere dominates and means they don't have to break out of their comfort zone. Its hardly a Benoit/Regal, Benoit/Finlay or Eddie/Mysterio match which has solid storytelling, a great babyface/heel dynamic, sequences which build and build until the finish, organic counters etc. Rock/Hogan obviously wasn't meant to see either grapple or even do much outside of the basics, which is entirely meant to be a compliment and not take away from the match.

I'm not saying Rock/Hogan should have tried to imitate any of those matches, just highlight the difference between the type of match Rock/Hogan worked and the sort of direction the other matches took in terms of character work, storytelling, pacing and build.

Not sure what the need was for that 'what makes a match good?' sentence. Wrestling as a subjective element should be entirely obvious to anyone.
Cool. I wouldn't rate any of the matches you said as great matches. I do like some technical wrestling, the Dynamite Kid vs Tiger Mask series is great. Also, if you like that kind of British style I would urge you to check out Johnny Saint and Billy Robinson. Don't get me wrong, Finlay vs Benoit in WCW was a solid match, but I wouldn't rate it as great.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:27 AM   #128 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

Have you seen Benoit/Finlay in WWE? That's where their absolute best matches come from.

DK Vs TM are extremely overrated imo. Probably only one match from their series that I'd call good.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:44 AM   #129 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

Yeah I'm on about Benoit/Finlay Judgement Day 06, 5/5/06 Smackdown and 11/24/06 Smackdown. Benoit/Regal Velocity 05 and No Mercy 06 and Eddie/Mysterio 6/23/05 Smackdown, Judgement Day 05 and Great American Bash 05 are all outstanding and at worst top 40 matches in WWF/E history with some of them being closer to top 15.

Dynamite/Tiger Mask is on the whole a dire series IMO. A lot of the matches really don't hold up well and feature Dynamite at his worst: a guy blowing through good looking moves with very little depth or meaning. I mean at one point he hits a tombstone and inexplicably breaks up his own cover. Fujiwara/Tiger Mask is a far better series by a country mile to me. Fujiwara is a grappling/submission star who's a brilliant seller and pacer and he's a great base for Tiger Mask who's more strike orientated. The matches always break down into Fujiwara absorbing kicks and strikes and trying to sucker Tiger Mask into a rash move and forcing a submission. Some of the best matches in Japan in the 80's imo.

Dynamite can be good in the right setting, notably against Marty Jones in WOS in 1984 and in the Fujinami match from 1980 in New Japan (though Fujinami and Jones are better in the respective matches). He's a bump freak in the WOS match and plays the aggressive and violent heel to perfection and Jones is excellent as the babyface who grows impatient with DK's antics and allows the match to break down into more of a fight.
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:48 PM   #130 (permalink)
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Default Re: Classic Wrestling General Discussion & Review Thread

I used the Dynamite vs Tiger Mask series as a springboard to jump-start me watching junior style in Puro. I had fun with them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Segunda Caida
I mean at one point he hits a tombstone and inexplicably breaks up his own cover


I remember that so vividly.

Random classic wrestling match I want to put over: The Funks vs Tito Santana & Junkyard Dog - WrestleMania II



I wished this was in better quality. Love this.
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