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Old 01-04-2014, 03:48 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

According to Bischoff (in his book), he wanted Hogan to lose cleanly to Sting at Starrcade, but Hogan refused, so they had to resort to the gimmicks (fast count/Bret Hart involvement).
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Old 01-04-2014, 04:55 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

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Originally Posted by superdog View Post
According to Bischoff (in his book), he wanted Hogan to lose cleanly to Sting at Starrcade, but Hogan refused, so they had to resort to the gimmicks (fast count/Bret Hart involvement).
When one of your eon best friends in the business says something like that you tend to believe the stories from before and after 1997
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Old 01-04-2014, 05:07 PM   #63 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

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Originally Posted by Maelstrom21 View Post
It still baffles me that WCW's premier event in 1996 featured the World Champion in a non-title main event. Could you imagine Wrestlemania having the champion in a non-title match?

The non-title stipulation wasn't announced until after the event. Not saying it's a good idea.
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Old 01-04-2014, 05:16 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

@Maelstrom21, Mania 1 also didn't have a title match.
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Old 01-04-2014, 10:58 PM   #65 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

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Originally Posted by Antonio43 View Post
Hogan could have done so much good by helping establish the younger guys. He could have possibly saved WCW if he would have ended the NWO (by Sting/Goldberg) and then took a manager type face role. I still think WCW should have been able to stick around much longer with the egos in check.
I feel Hogan winning was usually for the best. But he should have put over Bret Hart before leaving in 1993. Bret, Yoko, Diesel and Shawn seemed like paper champions. There wasn't much of a transition period where the old stars put over the new ones. (besides Hogan losing to Yoko, and I don't count Backlund losing to Diesel.)
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Old 01-05-2014, 03:05 AM   #66 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

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Credit dave1981:
Oh, come on...

Hogan/Steamboat- Who thought it would work if Steamboat would be a heel? Even if he went out there with a chainsaw and sawed Hulk Hogan's arms off, the fans still wouldn't buy it. Hogan was right, as his feud with Studd was big.

Hogan/Savage at Mania 2- Come on, Savage wasn't ready yet... He was the IC champion, not a great idea.

Hogan refusing to job to Mr. Wonderful- Why? Orndorff shouldn't won that feud.

Hogan turns Savage face- And Savage was awesome in that role.

Hogan loses to Andre at 1988- You have to realize that back then, people didn't know it was fake. Hogan was right doing that finish.

The Mega Powers- Well... It was nice.

No Holds Barred- Oh dear. That was awful... But I think it was more Vince then Hogan.

Hogan losing to Warrior- And that's a problem?

Hogan working with Slaughter- Bad idea, but Warrior flopped as a champ.

The Desert Storm feud- He was wrong, that war was over. It sucked to keep that feud.

Hogan/Taker- Was a good idea, made Taker.

Hogan at WM 8- So, he refused to win the title because he was going to leave after the event? Sounds good to me. And Hogan main evented because Vince thought of giving Flair the win.

Hogan at WMIX- Even Bret says that something weird happened there with Vince. By the way, Wrestlemania ending with Yoko winning and that's it would be awful.

Obviously his WCW stuff suck.

But a lot of those stuff are idiotic...
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Old 01-05-2014, 10:31 AM   #67 (permalink)
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Can somebody show proof that Warrior flopped as champion?

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Old 01-05-2014, 11:04 AM   #68 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

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@Maelstrom21, Mania 1 also didn't have a title match.
I understand this but that was a different era. I personally think the biggest event of the year should have the top title defended but Wrestlemania I was the maiden voyage so they weren't really sure what they were getting in to and I believe Mr. T was a big selling point so they wanted to book him in the main event with the most recognizable guy (Hogan).

It was also a tag match, Hogan vs. Piper was one on one. World Titles don't usually change hands during tag matches unless some other tomfoolery is involved.
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Old 01-05-2014, 03:48 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

I wanna say this.

George "The Animal" Steele said that Hogan's character was so over in the 80s that WWE couldn't afford to have him lose, as it would have killed future business for a return. Steele talked about a match he had with Hogan in St. Louis, where Steele won by countout. He got great heat from the fans but when it was time to do the return, for Hogan to win the match, the fans didn't care. At that time, it was hard to sell to the fans the idea of Hogan losing, which is he didn't lose clean. And it was a risk to do screwjob/countout/DQ finishes where Hogan loses because, in the 80s, there was always a return, meaning you run that town again.

Now, according to Steele, the reason why Hogan lost the title was because he was running out of challengers.


So, to see people talk about Hogan should have lost to Orndorff or Jake, you're not looking at it from the business side. Orndorff drew more money as the challenger than he would have as champion, simply because fans weren't going to buy Hogan as the challenger.


On that note, every instance of "politics" by Hogan in the 80s should be disregarded, considering it was what was best for business and made everybody money.
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Old 01-08-2014, 12:48 AM   #70 (permalink)
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Default Re: Instances Of Hogan Using Creative Control/Politics

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elipses Corter View Post
I wanna say this.

George "The Animal" Steele said that Hogan's character was so over in the 80s that WWE couldn't afford to have him lose, as it would have killed future business for a return. Steele talked about a match he had with Hogan in St. Louis, where Steele won by countout. He got great heat from the fans but when it was time to do the return, for Hogan to win the match, the fans didn't care. At that time, it was hard to sell to the fans the idea of Hogan losing, which is he didn't lose clean. And it was a risk to do screwjob/countout/DQ finishes where Hogan loses because, in the 80s, there was always a return, meaning you run that town again.

Now, according to Steele, the reason why Hogan lost the title was because he was running out of challengers.


So, to see people talk about Hogan should have lost to Orndorff or Jake, you're not looking at it from the business side. Orndorff drew more money as the challenger than he would have as champion, simply because fans weren't going to buy Hogan as the challenger.
Great post that gives insight on why Hogan was dominate in the 80's. George Steele was right that after WM III to many fans Hogan seemed invincible defeating Andre The Giant and it was even harder then trying to convince people Hogan could actually lose.

I think this also played a part in Hogan/Flair not drawing as expected because of this situation. If Flair fought Hogan right after Andre as in 1988 (it was rumored Flair was jumping, but only half of the horsemen left) the match would have drawn much more buckets of money as both were in their prime and still had juice in their reigns.
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