Election Discussion Thread - Page 16 - Wrestling Forum : WWE, TNA, ROH, Wrestling Videos, Women of Wrestling Forums

View Poll Results: Who are YOU voting for?

Mitt Romney (R) 11 13.75%
Barack Obama (D) 59 73.75%
Gary Johnson (L) 10 12.50%
Jill Stein (G) 2 2.50%
The All Encompassing OTHER 4 5.00%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 80. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-23-2012, 12:21 AM   #151 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by GlassBreaks View Post
We're not proposing anything, and are not required to do so.

Therefore, you can take your tongue-in-cheek posts about activism on a discussion forum and find something to do with them. I was merely commenting on someone who shared the same thoughts as I do.

Still waiting for my official government statistic backing of your healthcare claim, by the way.
right here big boy, fair warning though, its a bit of a read

http://www.nhchc.org/wp-content/uplo...10/vm_0901.pdf

and criticism without action makes you just as responsible for america going doing the toilet as the men destroying. by withholding your right to choose, youre basically refusing to take responsibility, however marginal

now i dont give two shits about america, for obvious reasons, but a lot of people would kill to have what you have. and they do. because however small the difference is, you can make it. , in a democracy your role as a patriot is to defend it by casting your vote or making your voice heard in a another way


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Originally Posted by ChainGangRed View Post
Through charitable actions and the way I spend my money. Volunteering and supporting local businesses I believe is a good start for some actual grassroots change. I tend to agree with Alexis de Tocqueville in saying that volunteerism and community is needed to maintain political freedom, otherwise politicians take power and it all turns communities against each other. I don't really have hope for the future of our country though because people don't know how to maintain political freedom in a productive manner these days and Americans hate violence so I highly doubt they'll use that to maintain it either.

To me democracy is more about political freedom than voting. Voting tends to take away political freedom in my opinion, though the purpose of it was to make sure there were always leaders that kept it.

thats reasonable. what political system do you favour then?
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:23 AM   #152 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by scrilla View Post
lol you can say they're capitalist cronies, but one of them wants to go to war with Iran and Russia and the other doesn't. i'd say that's p. big difference.
It is all is all rhetorical usage to sway voters. When push comes to shove, Democrats and Republicans have historically had similar approaches in foreign policy. Both support the spread of democracy (George W. Bush with the War on Terror, Barack Obama with the American backing of the Arab Spring and the opposition to Assad.) They both will always support Israel over Palestine in that conflict. We are still in Iraq, we are still in Afghanistan, we are still supporting terrorist groups to overthrow governments. The likeliness of going to war with Iran and Russia is the same with both parties. Romeny will support it if it is in the banks best interest to go to war with them or if it becomes inevitable and Obama will do the same.

Also going to war with Iran and Russia doesn't make or not make someone a capitalist crony, though the reasons they'd both do it would be the same. If you need proof they are both capitalist cronies, look at who financially backs the parties (same people) and look at their policies (using the government to invest and backup businesses).

Also for the people who think if Libertarians take over the Republican Party all of a sudden the world will be better, you seem to still be falling into the same trap as the statists. The formal institutions of the government being ran by Libertarians won't mean anything if you aren't actually taking action to help the local community because soon enough the Statist group will rise to power again because problems aren't getting fixed still. Also you don't have to worry about Romney winning, it isn't happening for multiple reasons unless Obama destroys his public image.

So what political system do I favor? Really it doesn't matter to me whether it is federalist, confederate, a monarchy, or any other system. As long as it was a system that treated people as though they had agency (a creature with free will who is free to make choices).
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:28 AM   #153 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

so what you're saying is, no matter whos incharge, or hell, no matter what the system is, the same policies will be enforced, the same problems will exist and nothing will change

that actually sounds about right, if a tad cynical
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:31 AM   #154 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

Obama clearly doesn't support a war with Russia. saying that they're the same is a huge generalization. yes both support democracy and capitalism. yes they might not support your or my obscure political policy opinions. there are still clear differences in the candidates. do you really think "obamacare" would exist if McCain had been elected? do you really think McCain would've pulled troops out of Iraq to the same extent Obama has? yes I'm aware there are still troops there, but it's a dramatically smaller number than it was before. presidents are always going to be pretty moderate especially in their first term, but to say they're both the same is again a HUGE generalization.

there are plenty of things Obama has done that I don't support, but I'm not going to say we'd be better off or "exactly the same" with a Republican president. at least not with the modern day candidates and Republican party.

it doesn't really matter who I vote for though literally b/c I live in California and Obama is gonna win here anyway. the entire electoral college should be done away with imo, but that's another story altogether.
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:36 AM   #155 (permalink)
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Yeah no offence but you'd have to be retarded to want war with Russia
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:37 AM   #156 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Redead View Post
so what you're saying is, no matter whos incharge, or hell, no matter what the system is, the same policies will be enforced, the same problems will exist and nothing will change

that actually sounds about right, if a tad cynical
It's cynical but it's reality. Corporations/interest groups/lobbyists dictate policy more than anything in the United States. It's been like this for a long time. It got worse when the Supreme Court ruled that corporations are people.
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:38 AM   #157 (permalink)
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money is speech.
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Old 09-23-2012, 12:42 AM   #158 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

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It's cynical but it's reality. Corporations/interest groups/lobbyists dictate policy more than anything in the United States. It's been like this for a long time. It got worse when the Supreme Court ruled that corporations are people.
i think i remember that episode of community

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Old 09-23-2012, 12:56 AM   #159 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by scrilla View Post
Obama clearly doesn't support a war with Russia. saying that they're the same is a huge generalization. yes both support democracy and capitalism. yes they might not support your or my obscure political policy opinions. there are still clear differences in the candidates. do you really think "obamacare" would exist if McCain had been elected? do you really think McCain would've pulled troops out of Iraq to the same extent Obama has? yes I'm aware there are still troops there, but it's a dramatically smaller number than it was before. presidents are always going to be pretty moderate especially in their first term, but to say they're both the same is again a HUGE generalization.

there are plenty of things Obama has done that I don't support, but I'm not going to say we'd be better off or "exactly the same" with a Republican president. at least not with the modern day candidates and Republican party.
I am not sure if you are well educated in what is currently going on...Syria is having a rebellion at the moment which is currently being backed up by America and NATO as a whole. The Syrian regime is recognized by Iran and Russia as a sovereign state. Russian leaders have repeatedly warned Obama that if America and NATO continue to support the rebellion, war is very likely. America and NATO still support the rebel forces in Syria. Now if that seems like our President is worried about going to war with Russia then I don't know what else would make it seem like he isn't.

Also I don't think either support capitalism or democracy. If by supporting capitalism you mean my statements of them being crony capitalists then I need to tell you that crony capitalism is the use of government agencies to support businesses to improve the economy. Actual capitalism would be about free markets not favoritism and lobbying. As for democracy, I think my whole past few votes show that I don't think either is really democratic. Though if you mean me saying they want to spread democracy, then yes, I am not entirely sure that is their real goal. I think it is more likely they want allies in specific parts of the world to maintain control in those areas.

I don't really think Obamacare is going to do what we are told it will do. If you looked at when it was passed, the people who supported it basically said it was just more money to special interest groups.

I'm sure McCain would of coward under political pressure to remove some of the troops from Iraq, though that is one area where I see it possibly may have been worse under McCain.
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Old 09-23-2012, 01:02 AM   #160 (permalink)
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Default Re: Election Discussion Thread

proxy wars doesnt necessarily mean full out war, look at the cold war

nobody is stupid enough to piss off russia and china that much. well except for general douglas mcarthur but that was a different age
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