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Official DVD/Match/Show Discussion Thread

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#1 ·
#11,641 ·
So TLC is about to come in an hour and the discussion will no doubt be taken over by talk about the PPV so before we're there, I'll drop this one fast.

Taboo Tuesday 2005:

Rey Mysterio/Matt Hardy vs Chris Masters/Gene Snitsky - ***
- Don't know why Edge was pulled out of this but nevertheless, a very fun match with hometown hero, Rey Mysterio putting on a great performance. Matt Hardy also did his thing while the Raw heels worked the match just fine as the stronger monsters against the underdog faces. Gets just enough time to work and I enjoyed this a lot. Masters takes the pinfall after taking a combination of Matt & Rey's finishers.

Eugene/Jimmy Snuka vs Rob Conway/Tyson Tomko - *1/2
- When my favorite out of the bunch is Rob Conway, you know how little I care about this. Very short and more of a "feel good" moment than a legitimate match with Snuka pulling out another one of his infamous splashes. Post-match, I had even less of a reason to care with "Hacksaw" Jim Duggan coming out. Don't know why but I just can't stand this guy.

Mankind vs Carlito - **3/4
- A short and fun match with Mankind making a return. Considering Carlito's potential, I can't help but feel disappointed, though. They could've used this in a No Holds Barred environment to put over Carlito as a star but instead, Foley beats him with ease and sets back all the momentum Carlito built since his debut. And Shelton went from winning the IC title here one year earlier to not even being featured on the card.

Kane/Big Show vs Trevor Murdoch/Lance Cade - **
- What's with all the tag team matches here? Anyways, not much to see other than Kane and Big Show getting started as a tag team by winning the belt with ease and squashing Murdoch and Cade.

Batista vs Jonathan Coachman/Vader/Goldust - *1/2
- Why did Stone Cold get removed from his scheduled match with The Coach? They built up for it around Homecoming but suddenly a night before the PPV, they canceled it and instead Batista along with two unexpected returns in Vader & Goldust filled in for him. Shit match since it's nothing but a squash for Batista. Liked Joey Styles' commentary, though. "Does he have a death wish?" :lmao

Divas Battle Royale - **
- For what it was, I enjoyed it. Hot outfits, story progress between Mickie & Trish and just decent enough for the divas standards. I have to wonder, though, why was Lita never given the opportunity to wrestle throughout the entire year of 2005 after her knee injury early on?

Ric Flair vs Triple H (Steel Cage) - ****1/2
- Absolutely epic. Lasts for 23 minutes but there's never a dull moment here. I was interested in every minute of it because they truly put an effort into making this exciting. Flair takes less than 4 minutes to blade and even during the resthold parts with the Figure Four, he makes this entertaining every time he flips the bird towards HHH. Not much to say other than awesome match. And the facial expression on the fan's face towards the end with those chair-shots from Flair tells the whole story to me. Surprisingly, HHH gets a standing ovation after the match. I don't even know why the Intercontinental Championship was on the line, though. It's a complete afterthought during the match and only made it more predictable for those watching since no one seriously could have expected HHH to win a midcard title after having been World Champion for the majority of the last 3 years.

John Cena vs Shawn Michaels vs Kurt Angle - ***3/4
- A very good way to end the PPV. Decent action involving all three men and lots of back and forth. Cena gets put through the Spanish announce table halfway through but then after resting up, he runs back in and cleans house. Then he gets a fluke of a victory by catching HBK off guard with the FU after HBK gave Angle the Sweet Chin Music. I have to say the spot building up to it was pretty dumb, though. Angle has the Ankle Lock locked in and HBK instead of running in to break it up (since kayfabe speaking, Cena might tap any minute) takes his time to climb the turnbuckle and hit the elbow. Other than that one little spot, I enjoyed this match a lot. One thing notable here is how loud the Cena haters are. The majority of the arena are overwhelmingly cheering Cena but there's a vocal minority who steadily boo him for the entire match, to the point where they almost overtake the high pitched majority supportive of Cena.

Overall: *** out of ***** (The main event matches were absolutely amazing while the opener was decent. The rest of the PPV ranges from average to downright terrible but the good and bad keep this steadily in the middle of the road for my final rating of it. Worth noting is also Joey Styles on commentary. Absolutely loved it!)
 
#11,642 ·
Completely forgot about the PPV. I became uninterested once Punk was taken off, truly no reason to watch. But Ziggler/Cena interests me so I'll probably catch that some time eventually. Doesn't look like a very good show at all.

Edit: Also :mark: for Triple H vs. Ric Flair in 2005.
 
#11,643 ·
Just recently started watching Edge: A Decade of Decadence. Match ratings so far:

vs. Owen Hart: ** 1/4
vs. The Brood at No Mercy- *** 3/4
vs. The Dudley Boyz and the Hardy Boyz at WM 2000: **** 1/2

Any thoughts on these matches? Watching SummerSlam match vs. Lance Storm right now.
more like this:

vs Owen ***
vs New Brood *****
vs Dudleyz and Hardyz *****
 
#11,644 ·
A story that Hailsabin/tbhaley might appreciate:

I went into my local CEX for another DVD bargain hunting session, this time I was looking for 2007 pay per views. Managed to pick up Backlash, Judgement Day, ONS/Extreme Rules, Vengeance, TGAB, Unforgiven and New years revolution all from that year. £19 for the lot.

Haven't watched any yet but I want to know what matches are worth looking out for. General ratings and comments for these events would also be appreciated. Going to need some hype to get me up for watching that stack of events after tonights six hour marathon of Impact, Wrestle talk TV and TLC!
Holy crap you cleaned up. I'll let you know some quick ratings/thoughts to help you out:

New Year's Revolution
1) Steel Cage Match - Jeff Hardy vs John Morrison ~ ***1/2
2) Tag Team Turmoil ~ ***
3) Ric Flair vs Kenny Dykstra ~ **3/4
4) Mickie James vs Victoria ~ **
5) Rated RKO vs DX ~ ***3/4
6) Chris Masters vs Carlito Colon ~ *1/2
7) John Cena vs Umaga ~ ***1/2

----------
Backlash
1) Hardys vs Lance Cade & Trevor Murdoch ~ ***3/4
2) Melina Perez vs Mickie James ~ **3/4
3) Chris Benoit vs MVP ~ **3/4
4) Bobby Lashley vs Vince, Shane, & Umaga ~ *
5) Last Man Standing - The Undertaker vs Batista ~ ****
6) John Cena vs Shawn Michaels vs Edge vs Randy Orton ~ ****1/2

----------
Judgment Day (ok, these ones are from a WHILE ago. I have to rewatch)
1) Ric Flair vs Carlito ~ ***
2) Bobby Lashley vs Vince, Shane, & Umaga ~ N/R
3) CM Punk vs Elijah Burke ~ ***3/4
4) Shawn Michaels vs Randy Orton ~ 1/2*
5) Hardys vs Lance Cade & Trevor Murdoch ~ ***1/4
6) Edge vs Batista ~ **1/2
7) 2 out of 3 Falls - Chris Benoit vs MVP ~ **
8) John Cena vs Great Khali ~ *

----------
One Night Stand
1) Stretcher Match - Randy Orton vs Rob Van Dam ~ **
2) Tables Match - CM Punk, Tommy Dreamer, & The Sandman vs New Breed ~ **
3) Ladder Match - Hardys vs World's Greatest Tag Team ~ ***3/4
4) Lumberjack Match - Kane vs Mark Henry ~ 1/4*
5) Bobby Lashley vs Vince McMahon ~ *3/4
6) Pudding Match - Melina Perez vs Candice Michelle ~ DUD
7) Steel Cage Match - Edge vs Batista ~ **1/2
8) Falls Count Anywhere Match - John Cena vs Great Khali ~ *

-----------
Vengeance (same as Judgment Day)
1) Hardys vs Lance Cade & Trevor Murdoch ~ **3/4
2) Chavo Guerrero Jr vs Jimmy Wang Yang ~ ***
3) CM Punk vs Johnny Nitro ~ **
4) Umaga vs Santino Marella ~ DUD
5) MVP vs Ric Flair ~ **1/2
6) Deuce & Domino vs Sgt. Slaughter & Jimmy Snuka ~ DUD
7) Edge vs Batista ~ ***3/4
8) Melina Perez vs Candice Michelle ~ DUD
9) John Cena vs Randy Orton vs Booker T vs Mick Foley vs Bobby Lashley ~ ***

------------
Great American Bash
1) MVP vs Matt Hardy ~ **3/4
2) Cruiserweight 6 Way ~ **
3) Singapore Care on a Pole Match - Carlito Colon vs The Sandman ~ 1/4*
4) Melina Perez vs Candice Michelle ~ *
5) Umaga vs Jeff Hardy ~ ****
6) John Morrison vs CM Punk ~ *1/2
7) Bullrope Match - Randy Orton vs Dusty Rhodes ~ 3/4*
8) Great Khali vs Batista vs Kane ~ *
9) John Cena vs Bobby Lashley ~ ****

-----------
Unforgiven (yep, same boat as JD & Vengeance. Oh I'm so reliable..)
1) CM Punk vs Elijah Burke ~ **3/4
2) Matt Hardy & MVP vs Deuce & Domino ~ **1/2
3) No DQ Rules for Carlito - Triple H vs Carlito Colon ~ **
4) Candice Michelle vs Beth Phoenix ~ **
5) Great Khali vs Batista vs Rey Mysterio ~ *1/2
6) Lance Cade & Trevor Murdoch vs Paul London & Brian Kendrick ~ ***1/4
7) John Cena vs Randy Orton ~ DUD
8) The Undertaker vs Mark Henry ~ N/A (I really can't remember where I had this match at)

-----------
So certainly Backlash is the best of the bunch. GAB is a fun PPV with two GREAT matches on it. I liked NYR as a whole. Maybe I'm alone on it, but I felt it was a really complete wrestling event overall. Unforgiven is the worst based on memory granted it doesn't have as many DUDs as Vengeance. But, I really recall Unforgiven being so bush league. Only thing I really dug was the second tag team titles match. ONS was a total one match show. Ladder match was quite good and rather underrated/forgotten. Maybe you'll like it. I think I recall you saying you're not crazy about those kind of matches so maybe not.

I'm not as crazy about 2007 as some other people have shown. It had it's fair share of matches that were worth seeing on PPV, but I know I'd take other years over it. Best PPV of the year was Royal Rumble, imo. If you own it then awesome. If not? Well, I suggest scoping it out and purchasing it too. Cena vs Umaga was the MOTY. Revolution's was a good first match. That should wet your appetite for it. Hope this helps.
 
#11,645 ·
Flair/HHH cage is awesome. **** I got it at.
 
#11,646 ·
So TLC is about to come in an hour and the discussion will no doubt be taken over by talk about the PPV so before we're there, I'll drop this one fast.

Taboo Tuesday 2005:

Rey Mysterio/Matt Hardy vs Chris Masters/Gene Snitsky - ***
- Don't know why Edge was pulled out of this but nevertheless, a very fun match with hometown hero, Rey Mysterio putting on a great performance. Matt Hardy also did his thing while the Raw heels worked the match just fine as the stronger monsters against the underdog faces. Gets just enough time to work and I enjoyed this a lot. Masters takes the pinfall after taking a combination of Matt & Rey's finishers.

Eugene/Jimmy Snuka vs Rob Conway/Tyson Tomko - *1/2
- When my favorite out of the bunch is Rob Conway, you know how little I care about this. Very short and more of a "feel good" moment than a legitimate match with Snuka pulling out another one of his infamous splashes. Post-match, I had even less of a reason to care with "Hacksaw" Jim Duggan coming out. Don't know why but I just can't stand this guy.

Mankind vs Carlito - **3/4
- A short and fun match with Mankind making a return. Considering Carlito's potential, I can't help but feel disappointed, though. They could've used this in a No Holds Barred environment to put over Carlito as a star but instead, Foley beats him with ease and sets back all the momentum Carlito built since his debut. And Shelton went from winning the IC title here one year earlier to not even being featured on the card.

Kane/Big Show vs Trevor Murdoch/Lance Cade - **
- What's with all the tag team matches here? Anyways, not much to see other than Kane and Big Show getting started as a tag team by winning the belt with ease and squashing Murdoch and Cade.

Batista vs Jonathan Coachman/Vader/Goldust - *1/2
- Why did Stone Cold get removed from his scheduled match with The Coach? They built up for it around Homecoming but suddenly a night before the PPV, they canceled it and instead Batista along with two unexpected returns in Vader & Goldust filled in for him. Shit match since it's nothing but a squash for Batista. Liked Joey Styles' commentary, though. "Does he have a death wish?" :lmao

Divas Battle Royale - **
- For what it was, I enjoyed it. Hot outfits, story progress between Mickie & Trish and just decent enough for the divas standards. I have to wonder, though, why was Lita never given the opportunity to wrestle throughout the entire year of 2005 after her knee injury early on?

Ric Flair vs Triple H (Steel Cage) - ****1/2
- Absolutely epic. Lasts for 23 minutes but there's never a dull moment here. I was interested in every minute of it because they truly put an effort into making this exciting. Flair takes less than 4 minutes to blade and even during the resthold parts with the Figure Four, he makes this entertaining every time he flips the bird towards HHH. Not much to say other than awesome match. And the facial expression on the fan's face towards the end with those chair-shots from Flair tells the whole story to me. Surprisingly, HHH gets a standing ovation after the match. I don't even know why the Intercontinental Championship was on the line, though. It's a complete afterthought during the match and only made it more predictable for those watching since no one seriously could have expected HHH to win a midcard title after having been World Champion for the majority of the last 3 years.

John Cena vs Shawn Michaels vs Kurt Angle - ***3/4
- A very good way to end the PPV. Decent action involving all three men and lots of back and forth. Cena gets put through the Spanish announce table halfway through but then after resting up, he runs back in and cleans house. Then he gets a fluke of a victory by catching HBK off guard with the FU after HBK gave Angle the Sweet Chin Music. I have to say the spot building up to it was pretty dumb, though. Angle has the Ankle Lock locked in and HBK instead of running in to break it up (since kayfabe speaking, Cena might tap any minute) takes his time to climb the turnbuckle and hit the elbow. Other than that one little spot, I enjoyed this match a lot. One thing notable here is how loud the Cena haters are. The majority of the arena are overwhelmingly cheering Cena but there's a vocal minority who steadily boo him for the entire match, to the point where they almost overtake the high pitched majority supportive of Cena.

Overall: *** out of ***** (The main event matches were absolutely amazing while the opener was decent. The rest of the PPV ranges from average to downright terrible but the good and bad keep this steadily in the middle of the road for my final rating of it. Worth noting is also Joey Styles on commentary. Absolutely loved it!)
Opening match is such a fun tag. It's an underrated bout from the year.

btw, Austin didn't appear b/c he refused to job to Coach. Mark Henry was slated to return, destroy Austin, and have Coach get the pin. Austin wasn't for it so he split.

That show is the definition of main events saving it. You were more civil towards the show than I am. Especially on the Batista/Coach & Divas matches which were total DUDs.
 
#11,647 ·
Opening match is such a fun tag. It's an underrated bout from the year.

btw, Austin didn't appear b/c he refused to job to Coach. Mark Henry was slated to return, destroy Austin, and have Coach get the pin. Austin wasn't for it so he split.

That show is the definition of main events saving it. You were more civil towards the show than I am. Especially on the Batista/Coach & Divas matches which were total DUDs.
That's what I read too. I just don't get why Austin would make his ring return against COACH of all people. Still sucks that he never had that WM22 match with Hogan they wanted to have after the Homecoming tease. Would have been epic. But I guess politics got in the way of things Austin refusing to job and Hogan being his usual self.

And the reason I come across more 'civil' is because I don't have the DUD rating in my system. The lowest I go is zero and that's only saved for the worst of the worst like most one move matches. I only gave that handicap street fight *1/2 because I found parts of it funny. And the divas match gets a pass because Victoria, Mickie and TRISH all look awesome in it.

I have to say something regarding your 07 ratings, though. Why is HBK/Orton from JD rated so low? If I'm not mistaken, it's only used to write off HBK because he had an injury at the time, right? How stupid to do it at a PPV!

And I'm really eager to watch the Batista/Edge matches with both as main eventers. All their Raw matches in 2004 were terrible and unmemorable (much like 99.9% of Batista's pre-main event work) but I guess as main eventers, they had more to bring to the table.
 
#11,648 ·
That's what I read too. I just don't get why Austin would make his ring return against COACH of all people. Still sucks that he never had that WM22 match with Hogan they wanted to have after the Homecoming tease. Would have been epic. But I guess politics got in the way of things Austin refusing to job and Hogan being his usual self.

And the reason I come across more 'civil' is because I don't have the DUD rating in my system. The lowest I go is zero and that's only saved for the worst of the worst like most one move matches. I only gave that handicap street fight *1/2 because I found parts of it funny. And the divas match gets a pass because Victoria, Mickie and TRISH all look awesome in it.

I have to say something regarding your 07 ratings, though. Why is HBK/Orton from JD rated so low? If I'm not mistaken, it's only used to write off HBK because he had an injury at the time, right? How stupid to do it at a PPV!

And I'm really eager to watch the Batista/Edge matches with both as main eventers. All their Raw matches in 2004 were terrible and unmemorable (much like 99.9% of Batista's pre-main event work) but I guess as main eventers, they had more to bring to the table.
It would have been a squash too until Henry came in. Austin would have worked hard. That's the only reason I can piece together as to why he'd come back vs Coach.

Melina vs Ashley from WM 23 type matches? That's zero, DUD, worst of the worst type wrestling. If I rated divas matches on looks then every match involving Maria Kanellis would be pretty high. :eek:

Yep. 4 1/2 minute match. Orton debuted the punt about 2 weeks before it. Shawn was "injured" kayfabe and legit so he was gonna leave. It was the match that jump started the Orton push. Purely a feud advancer. Same with Orton vs Cena from Unforgiven.

Vengeance was great. Other two, decent personified. They had a match on Smackdown following Vengeance that I think was pretty darn good too. iirc my favorite match from them was at NOC '08.
 
#11,650 ·
^^^ You should ask KingofKings/#PaulHeymanGuy/Best in the North Pole about the matches for nWo: Revolution, haha. :p

It would have been a squash too until Henry came in. Austin would have worked hard. That's the only reason I can piece together as to why he'd come back vs Coach.

Melina vs Ashley from WM 23 type matches? That's zero, DUD, worst of the worst type wrestling. If I rated divas matches on looks then every match involving Maria Kanellis would be pretty high. :eek:

Yep. 4 1/2 minute match. Orton debuted the punt about 2 weeks before it. Shawn was "injured" kayfabe and legit so he was gonna leave. It was the match that jump started the Orton push. Purely a feud advancer. Same with Orton vs Cena from Unforgiven.

Vengeance was great. Other two, decent personified. They had a match on Smackdown following Vengeance that I think was pretty darn good too. iirc my favorite match from them was at NOC '08.
Yeah, that makes sense. But he should have probably won since Coach didn't really use any rub, certainly not in the replacement match. And they could've used Henry after DAT kayfabe injury from the Crossface (ha!) elsewhere to get him heat.

And yeah, that's sort of it. But the battle royale was not rated based on purely looks since the action itself didn't exactly put me to sleep which is always a good thing. But you have to realize, a ** rating is still pretty low in my system. I'm usually generous when it comes to these so a ** is nothing to be proud of.

I know about the Orton/Cena UNF match. Just when it was about to get going, Cena quickly got himself DQed and shit was over. Sucks their LMS No Mercy match was canceled. I think that could've been a classic. Although I'm more than satisfied with the HHH replacement.

I'll definitely check them out in the future. Hell, Vengeance and the Benoit tribute show are my last stops in my current yearly journeys before I go back and start from 97 until 2002. So I should catch a couple of the 'Tista/Edge matches.
 
#11,652 ·
Yeah, that makes sense. But he should have probably won since Coach didn't really use any rub, certainly not in the replacement match. And they could've used Henry after DAT kayfabe injury from the Crossface (ha!) elsewhere to get him heat.

And yeah, that's sort of it. But the battle royale was not rated based on purely looks since the action itself didn't exactly put me to sleep which is always a good thing. But you have to realize, a ** rating is still pretty low in my system. I'm usually generous when it comes to these so a ** is nothing to be proud of.

I know about the Orton/Cena UNF match. Just when it was about to get going, Cena quickly got himself DQed and shit was over. Sucks their LMS No Mercy match was canceled. I think that could've been a classic. Although I'm more than satisfied with the HHH replacement.

I'll definitely check them out in the future. Hell, Vengeance and the Benoit tribute show are my last stops in my current yearly journeys before I go back and start from 97 until 2002. So I should catch a couple of the 'Tista/Edge matches.
idk. JR was gone for being sick so they played off that with Austin and a way to re-debut Henry. Looking back the plan does look random and disjointed.

Ah, I see. ** from me is a pretty basic rating. I classify it as decent. I could literally list all the ratings and what they imply when I give it, lmao.

Yep. Lame that it got cut short. I understand it, but that PPV wasn't nearly strong enough to afford a match like that. That's the problem. Orton vs Cena LMS was probably the match I was looking forward to the most that year. Cena got injured and no go. I got Orton as champ at the end of No Mercy. And an excellent match to come with it. So I was plenty happy. Besides, John-boy came back in January and all was right with the world.

Do so if you want. Like I said, the '07 series Vengeance was the best. But it is better to watch them all in order. Helps appreciate the urgency by Batista come the third bout.

'97 - '02. Holy crap. Have fun. It's gonna be quite the journey. I'll wonder how you'll take to 2002. Such a wild year. Tried so many new things. It was sporadic with matches and feuds, but I really loved it. Minority answer. Oh well. You ever seen the original RAW Roulette show?
 
#11,653 · (Edited)
So... that 6-man TLC... ****1/2 I give it first watch. Perhaps it's overshooting it a little bit, but it gets into my top 5 of the year no problem, and wow, I'm shocked at how fucking awesome the match was. May even be second best match just behind Punk/Bryan OTL. Definitely looking forward to giving it a second viewing. I may even stay up for the replay of the PPV just to watch the match again. Damn, I really loved it.

Other ratings for the night:

Rhode Scholars/Mysterio and Cara- ***1/4
Cesaro/Truth- (Need to re-watch as I wasn't really paying attention to the match)
Barrett/Kofi- ***
Shield/Ryback and Team Hell No- ****1/2

MizTV segment was good as well all around imo. Overall a great PPV so far.
 
#11,659 ·
TLC match ****
I still have Cena vs Brock as MOTY apart from the ending that match told a great story with Brock dominating Cena. The match tonight was very good though all six men looked good, some great spots, great selling told a good story and it also sent three new guys right near the top of the card after that, perfectly booked from start to finish.

Great ppv so far nearly didn't watch it,
 
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