Originally Posted by Seabs
The guys I had listed were:
Super Smash Brothers
and that's all that I'd consider very good workers on the US Indies right now. Gallows, Finlay and Lawler are basically done for now too. Yes to Ricochet too but he's full time in Japan so I wouldn't really consider him an Indy guy now.
The biggest problem imo is the severe lack of vets for these new guys to work with. There's no Joe or a Danielson or a Aries or a Nigel to pair these new guys with promise with to elevate them to another level. Look at Tyler Black when he first broke through in ROH. He was a decent guy with potential who guys like Danielson and McGuinness made look like a legit star. Would Black have ever got over as more than a tag guy if them 2 weren't around? Debatable but I'd say unlikely. You look at the US Indies right now and there's nobody other than Generico who can fit into that role of taking a lesser guy and getting the most out of him to make him look like a great worker even if he isn't. Take Gargano for example. Gargano's a guy who's got the potential to be a great worker on the Indies but all the guys he works with are around his level so he can't progress any higher without a superhuman solo effort. Working with guys like Chuck Taylor and Jon Davis won't make him a great worker. Working with guys like Danielson and co would have made him a great worker by now though. All you have to do is watch Gargano's match with Danielson from 2010 and you'll see my point of how a guy like Danielson can take a decent worker, use all his positives and then use all of his attributes to make the guy look better than he already is and then use the experience for that guy to develop from it. There's an old wrestling phrase which is "you're only as good as your opponent". Basically in order for you to look good, you have to make your opponent look good. A guy like Chuck Taylor can't make a guy like Johnny Gargano look better than he is. Flair and Danielson were/are masters of doing that. How many Indy guys has Danielson had the best matches of their carears with? How many guys made Sting and Luger look as great as they did when they faced Flair?
List is around all the guys I'd say were at the tops in the US Indie scene anyways. Minus ACH. Not too sold on him atm.
Yes. That's my view on the state of indie wrestling too. All the veterans are lost. I made that statement about a month ago while reviewing Austin Aries vs Bully Ray. I can echo your entire post with my rebuttal post, but why do so when you pointed out all the facts already. 100% agreed.
I've always put Danielson over like that. His matches TJ Perkins a few years ago in PWG is one of the fastest examples that comes to my mind in this scenario. TJ, a good well rounded wrestler. A tad bland however. Danielson brought out the best I've seen from him in their clash at Battle of Los Angeles. Everyone was raving and it was all thanks in part to Danielson having that keen ability to make ANYONE he clashes against look like a star. He's the main guy to have that Flair quality about him. We could peg a few other names if we thought about it, but those are the two that go hand in hand. Indie scene needs another one to fill that void. Well, more than one obviously. Generico can do that. He's GREAT at adding a brilliant story/drama to a match. He can't save everything within the US indie scene all on his own though. He's done a damn good job nonetheless. Help is needed.